Idiotic Customer Service Protocols
Jul 23, 2018, 1:08 pm
#31
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,770
I wont deny for a second that "we need to talk to the 9yo travelling with you" is, to be frank, moronic as no boxes would be checked as said child at that age could easily be coerced to answering the way they were told to by a trafficker & wouldn't protect any airline from prosecution for exactly that reason.
But my guess is that this request wasn't actually to do with child trafficking rules anyway. Rather I would imagine (but may be wrong on this as don't know the details of the conversation) that it was a data protection process mistake, where the agent thought they had to speak to the passenger just as they might for an adult where someone else was calling on their behalf who they couldn't identify. The agent just didn't realise that asking to speak to a 9 year old was stupid, so didn't seek an appropriate solution.
Jul 23, 2018, 1:34 pm
#32
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Brighton UK
Programs: BAEC-Silver, AMEX-BA Prem' Plus & Standard, Accor Gold, HH-Silver, IHG,IBIS On Business
Posts: 955
@Ldnn1 - tried to like but can't ( seems to happen from time to time on FT, for myself at least, but im a newbie so maybe that's why?)
It was f-word stupid but I think the underlying cause was maybe a mix between an overzealous CS agent and their understanding on part of their training regarding the matter. While it clearly doesn't apply to you( whilst new to FT im reasonably confident PT's don't post complaints to the forum lol) there is a duty of care / legal issue at play here and in modern society / the scope of the problem they were possibly being a little over zealous( to an understandable point) and requesting things that were both unnecessary and in the larger scheme of things wouldn't have achieved any form of protection for BA anyway.
I'm certainly not going to say this wasn't a bit stupid and you're right to highlight nonsensical thinking on behalf of the agent you spoke to but there is the flip side of knowing that BA take such things seriously, imho as they should, and that in another less desirable situation they do their best to make sure that they are not a party to such activities.
It was f-word stupid but I think the underlying cause was maybe a mix between an overzealous CS agent and their understanding on part of their training regarding the matter. While it clearly doesn't apply to you( whilst new to FT im reasonably confident PT's don't post complaints to the forum lol) there is a duty of care / legal issue at play here and in modern society / the scope of the problem they were possibly being a little over zealous( to an understandable point) and requesting things that were both unnecessary and in the larger scheme of things wouldn't have achieved any form of protection for BA anyway.
I'm certainly not going to say this wasn't a bit stupid and you're right to highlight nonsensical thinking on behalf of the agent you spoke to but there is the flip side of knowing that BA take such things seriously, imho as they should, and that in another less desirable situation they do their best to make sure that they are not a party to such activities.
Jul 23, 2018, 1:58 pm
#33
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,659
No it isn’t. The OP was the booker, and the booker controls the booking. [ETA: It seems OP booked through AA which may be what caused the confusion here if BA didn’t recognise OP as the booker.]
In any case it would not be for the child to confirm to BA over the phone any authority to act on their behalf. If that’s in the CC manual (which I doubt) then it should change.
Last edited by Anonba; Jul 23, 2018 at 2:07 pm
Jul 23, 2018, 2:01 pm
#34
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,659
Exactly, this is the key point.
But my guess is that this request wasn't actually to do with child trafficking rules anyway. Rather I would imagine (but may be wrong on this as don't know the details of the conversation) that it was a data protection process mistake, where the agent thought they had to speak to the passenger just as they might for an adult where someone else was calling on their behalf who they couldn't identify. The agent just didn't realise that asking to speak to a 9 year old was stupid, so didn't seek an appropriate solution.
But my guess is that this request wasn't actually to do with child trafficking rules anyway. Rather I would imagine (but may be wrong on this as don't know the details of the conversation) that it was a data protection process mistake, where the agent thought they had to speak to the passenger just as they might for an adult where someone else was calling on their behalf who they couldn't identify. The agent just didn't realise that asking to speak to a 9 year old was stupid, so didn't seek an appropriate solution.
Jul 23, 2018, 2:14 pm
#35
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 8,770
Indeed, that was the crucial detail here to understanding what happened. Is there anything in your manual which covers this situation with a child?
Jul 23, 2018, 2:38 pm
#36
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2010
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,659
I did book with AA and it turns out there had been an issue with the PayPal payment for the seat selection on BA.com and that's what they were contacting me about. AA agent was able to keep her seat assignment free of charge as she us traveling with 3 Emeralds.
I would think somewhere there would have to be a note that does transfer between airlines letting them know who the child is travelling with, otherwise I would have had to book them as an unaccompanied minor and my main concern after the cryptic email is that this was the issue.
i understand all the issues about human trafficking and custody issues. Like I mentioned we have the proper documentation as the minor is not allowed to leave the country of origin in Latin America without the consent of both parents. But I think something as banal as a seat assignment issue should be such am ordeal. Also, if I did have the 9yo here with me and put her on the phone I would have had a hard time getting her to answer any questions, all my nieces and nephews are very shy at that age and not sure what questions she would have had to answer? Address? Email? Passport number? Date of birth?
Jul 23, 2018, 2:49 pm
#37
Join Date: May 2006
Location: 5 miles from EMA
Programs: BD, BAEC Pleb, VS Pleb, Accor Pleb, HHonors Gold, Big White Season Pass
Posts: 5,904
That rather depends on what’s being asked. We nearly got arrested at CBP in Seattle not so long ago because the agent addressed all of her questions to our (then) 7 year old. He was certainly not capable of answering the questions about the trip and was quite happy to tell her whatever he thought she wanted to hear. Utterly ridiculous. Asking to speak to a minor is nonsense.
Jul 24, 2018, 3:34 am
#38
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,659
I'm aware of this, but the problem is I don't like many seats in CW, and prefer one with storage which limits us to the upper deck, the other 3 of us could choose seats as OW Emeralds, j diwnt want to be moved to two random seats together on the plane.
I did book with AA and it turns out there had been an issue with the PayPal payment for the seat selection on BA.com and that's what they were contacting me about. AA agent was able to keep her seat assignment free of charge as she us traveling with 3 Emeralds.
I would think somewhere there would have to be a note that does transfer between airlines letting them know who the child is travelling with, otherwise I would have had to book them as an unaccompanied minor and my main concern after the cryptic email is that this was the issue.
i understand all the issues about human trafficking and custody issues. Like I mentioned we have the proper documentation as the minor is not allowed to leave the country of origin in Latin America without the consent of both parents. But I think something as banal as a seat assignment issue should be such am ordeal. Also, if I did have the 9yo here with me and put her on the phone I would have had a hard time getting her to answer any questions, all my nieces and nephews are very shy at that age and not sure what questions she would have had to answer? Address? Email? Passport number? Date of birth?
I did book with AA and it turns out there had been an issue with the PayPal payment for the seat selection on BA.com and that's what they were contacting me about. AA agent was able to keep her seat assignment free of charge as she us traveling with 3 Emeralds.
I would think somewhere there would have to be a note that does transfer between airlines letting them know who the child is travelling with, otherwise I would have had to book them as an unaccompanied minor and my main concern after the cryptic email is that this was the issue.
i understand all the issues about human trafficking and custody issues. Like I mentioned we have the proper documentation as the minor is not allowed to leave the country of origin in Latin America without the consent of both parents. But I think something as banal as a seat assignment issue should be such am ordeal. Also, if I did have the 9yo here with me and put her on the phone I would have had a hard time getting her to answer any questions, all my nieces and nephews are very shy at that age and not sure what questions she would have had to answer? Address? Email? Passport number? Date of birth?
Jul 24, 2018, 3:35 am
#39
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,659
There isnt anything that covers this. The guidelines tell us that we speak to passenger or cardholder and then security questions to ask.
Jul 24, 2018, 4:15 am
#40
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 756
I think maybe the agent just got confused. I understand various alarm bells going off when a child is involved, but having some kind of across-the-board policy to follow would be useful.
For example, South Africa has very strict documentation rules with regard to under-18s (even if both parents or guardians are present), and our experience is that BA's actions on the ground seem to vary quite a bit depending on the manager in charge of the local outstation. I wrote before on here about a dismal experience at SFO, where the BA check-in staff said that they were obliged to photocopy our son's birth certificate ("BA policy"). After I made a complaint, it turns out it's no such thing, it was just an over-zealous manager's personal policy at the SFO outstation. We've never been asked for a copy to be made before or since.
For example, South Africa has very strict documentation rules with regard to under-18s (even if both parents or guardians are present), and our experience is that BA's actions on the ground seem to vary quite a bit depending on the manager in charge of the local outstation. I wrote before on here about a dismal experience at SFO, where the BA check-in staff said that they were obliged to photocopy our son's birth certificate ("BA policy"). After I made a complaint, it turns out it's no such thing, it was just an over-zealous manager's personal policy at the SFO outstation. We've never been asked for a copy to be made before or since.
Last edited by newyorklondon; Jul 24, 2018 at 4:22 am
Jul 24, 2018, 7:05 am
#41
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Brighton UK
Programs: BAEC-Silver, AMEX-BA Prem' Plus & Standard, Accor Gold, HH-Silver, IHG,IBIS On Business
Posts: 955
The next set of Irony of course being the fact that we drill "stranger danger" and "online safety" into our babies heads ( and nephews/ nieces etc etc) because we have to because of the unfortunate world we live in and any child of that age would, I imagine, have an internal conflict going on in their heads shy or not as a person where they were asking themselves "I'm not supposed to ever give any of this information out to someone I dont know"
Jul 24, 2018, 12:45 pm
#42
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,659
I think maybe the agent just got confused. I understand various alarm bells going off when a child is involved, but having some kind of across-the-board policy to follow would be useful.
For example, South Africa has very strict documentation rules with regard to under-18s (even if both parents or guardians are present), and our experience is that BA's actions on the ground seem to vary quite a bit depending on the manager in charge of the local outstation. I wrote before on here about a dismal experience at SFO, where the BA check-in staff said that they were obliged to photocopy our son's birth certificate ("BA policy"). After I made a complaint, it turns out it's no such thing, it was just an over-zealous manager's personal policy at the SFO outstation. We've never been asked for a copy to be made before or since.
For example, South Africa has very strict documentation rules with regard to under-18s (even if both parents or guardians are present), and our experience is that BA's actions on the ground seem to vary quite a bit depending on the manager in charge of the local outstation. I wrote before on here about a dismal experience at SFO, where the BA check-in staff said that they were obliged to photocopy our son's birth certificate ("BA policy"). After I made a complaint, it turns out it's no such thing, it was just an over-zealous manager's personal policy at the SFO outstation. We've never been asked for a copy to be made before or since.
Jul 24, 2018, 1:09 pm
#43
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 756
Jul 24, 2018, 1:21 pm
#44
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,955
Jul 24, 2018, 1:38 pm
#45
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 756
My understanding is that to be truly unaccompanied, the passenger must be 14 or over. If 13 or under, I believe they can be on their own booking reference, but must have an adult booking 'linked' (or be on the same booking reference as the adult), with a parental/guardian consent form. In other words, I'm not sure there's a policy which differentiates nine year old passengers from two year old passengers.
Last edited by newyorklondon; Jul 24, 2018 at 1:55 pm