What's with everyone today? (help for hand luggage, exit row eligibility and passport
Jun 24, 2018, 2:53 pm
#1
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What's with everyone today? (help for hand luggage, exit row eligibility and passport
Just got off my flight and I'm not entirely sure what's wrong with everyone today. Two (entirely separate) people asked the crew (one of them nicely, the other not at all so) if they could put their carry on luggage in the overhead for them as they could not do so themselves. We are not talking about elderly people but two main in their 50s and 60s respectively. The first had a recently broken elbow (for which I have sympathy, not least because it happened to me, but when i did, I abstained from carrying hand luggage I could not handle myself!). As the flight was busy, a message was sent that anyone could check bags for free so fare was not excuse. The offer was then repeated at the gate.
Moreover, it happens that he was sat in the exit row. Quite frankly, if he could not put his suitcase in the overhead, there is zero chance he could have opened a very heavy exit row door in case that was needed and I was really surprised that the crew did not ask him to change seat. The second mentioned no particular reason. Again, why do people take bags that they cannot fit in the overhead, especially as this is an explicit limitation for BA? I could hear the stewardess was quite annoyed too, explaining that she was not that strong and that the second bag was really heavy.
Upon disembarking, the second passenger also decided that it was fine for him to cut about 20 people in the queue. That was not the queue that I was in or I would have told him what I thought.
Not DYKWIA but nonetheless someone who does not seem to be very conscious of others or interested in setting any limit to what he should impose to others to put himself first. Disappointing.
PS: a really weird guy in the CCR before that but I won't discuss that particular case as those two seem enough for today!
Moreover, it happens that he was sat in the exit row. Quite frankly, if he could not put his suitcase in the overhead, there is zero chance he could have opened a very heavy exit row door in case that was needed and I was really surprised that the crew did not ask him to change seat. The second mentioned no particular reason. Again, why do people take bags that they cannot fit in the overhead, especially as this is an explicit limitation for BA? I could hear the stewardess was quite annoyed too, explaining that she was not that strong and that the second bag was really heavy.
Upon disembarking, the second passenger also decided that it was fine for him to cut about 20 people in the queue. That was not the queue that I was in or I would have told him what I thought.
Not DYKWIA but nonetheless someone who does not seem to be very conscious of others or interested in setting any limit to what he should impose to others to put himself first. Disappointing.
PS: a really weird guy in the CCR before that but I won't discuss that particular case as those two seem enough for today!
Jun 24, 2018, 3:04 pm
#2
Join Date: Nov 2009
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Just got off my flight and I'm not entirely sure what's wrong with everyone today. Two (entirely separate) people asked the crew (one of them nicely, the other not at all so) if they could put their carry on luggage in the overhead for them as they could not do so themselves. We are not talking about elderly people but two main in their 50s and 60s respectively. The first had a recently broken elbow (for which I have sympathy, not least because it happened to me, but when i did, I abstained from carrying hand luggage I could not handle myself!). As the flight was busy, a message was sent that anyone could check bags for free so fare was not excuse. The offer was then repeated at the gate.
Moreover, it happens that he was sat in the exit row. Quite frankly, if he could not put his suitcase in the overhead, there is zero chance he could have opened a very heavy exit row door in case that was needed and I was really surprised that the crew did not ask him to change seat. The second mentioned no particular reason. Again, why do people take bags that they cannot fit in the overhead, especially as this is an explicit limitation for BA? I could hear the stewardess was quite annoyed too, explaining that she was not that strong and that the second bag was really heavy.
Upon disembarking, the second passenger also decided that it was fine for him to cut about 20 people in the queue. That was not the queue that I was in or I would have told him what I thought.
Not DYKWIA but nonetheless someone who does not seem to be very conscious of others or interested in setting any limit to what he should impose to others to put himself first. Disappointing.
PS: a really weird guy in the CCR before that but I won't discuss that particular case as those two seem enough for today!
Moreover, it happens that he was sat in the exit row. Quite frankly, if he could not put his suitcase in the overhead, there is zero chance he could have opened a very heavy exit row door in case that was needed and I was really surprised that the crew did not ask him to change seat. The second mentioned no particular reason. Again, why do people take bags that they cannot fit in the overhead, especially as this is an explicit limitation for BA? I could hear the stewardess was quite annoyed too, explaining that she was not that strong and that the second bag was really heavy.
Upon disembarking, the second passenger also decided that it was fine for him to cut about 20 people in the queue. That was not the queue that I was in or I would have told him what I thought.
Not DYKWIA but nonetheless someone who does not seem to be very conscious of others or interested in setting any limit to what he should impose to others to put himself first. Disappointing.
PS: a really weird guy in the CCR before that but I won't discuss that particular case as those two seem enough for today!
Jun 24, 2018, 3:30 pm
#5
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 646
On this theme, there was a complete idiot (complete with multiple gold bag tags) on the Lcy-flr today. Supposed to be in 12D but insisted that D was always the aisle seat and refused to accept the window seat he had a ticket for. The chap in 12C was very gracious and sat in the window seat instead.
Jun 24, 2018, 3:37 pm
#7
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Thankfully the majority of us are decent folk although I'm sure even I'm capable of getting up someone's nose.
Jun 24, 2018, 3:46 pm
#8
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If I had suspicion like this that a passenger was not able to handle the exit door, I would have a quiet word with the crew. I have done so in the past (passenger obviously too frail to handle the door, due to old age). It is a safety issue and it is reasonable to raise it (with due discretion) with the crew for them to handle.
Jun 24, 2018, 8:33 pm
#9
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(1)For some planes [777s on AA] some exit doors only require pulling a LARGE door handle, no lifting is required.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
Jun 25, 2018, 12:24 am
#10
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Aircraft was an A320 and both passengers were tall, so that was not the issue.
The suggestion of mentioning my surprise occurred to me but as the crew member who had been asked to put the first luggage up saw perfectly well the gentleman sit in the exit row (indeed she had to tell him she had to put his second bag up too) it would have amounted to questioning her judgement openly which I’m always a bit reluctant to do. Discretion not an option either as I was in a window seat on a full flight near them both. In fact I suspect the full flight may have been the issue as moving the man would have meant also moving someone else.
having done the door opening and evacuation procedure myself (as part of exercise when invited by another airline to attend crew training - fun!!) and having also had a recovering broken elbow, I can honestly say that I would not have been able to be an effective emergency exit passenger then (even weeks after I stopped needing a sling) and I suspect many passengers currently allowed in exit rows would not. The A320 wing doors definitely need significant elbow effort as they need some flipping before you can eject them.
The suggestion of mentioning my surprise occurred to me but as the crew member who had been asked to put the first luggage up saw perfectly well the gentleman sit in the exit row (indeed she had to tell him she had to put his second bag up too) it would have amounted to questioning her judgement openly which I’m always a bit reluctant to do. Discretion not an option either as I was in a window seat on a full flight near them both. In fact I suspect the full flight may have been the issue as moving the man would have meant also moving someone else.
having done the door opening and evacuation procedure myself (as part of exercise when invited by another airline to attend crew training - fun!!) and having also had a recovering broken elbow, I can honestly say that I would not have been able to be an effective emergency exit passenger then (even weeks after I stopped needing a sling) and I suspect many passengers currently allowed in exit rows would not. The A320 wing doors definitely need significant elbow effort as they need some flipping before you can eject them.
Jun 25, 2018, 12:26 am
#11
Join Date: Mar 2017
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(1)For some planes [777s on AA] some exit doors only require pulling a LARGE door handle, no lifting is required.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
(2) On "traditional" overwing exits, such as the A320, you have about a 3kg pull to release the door and then it's about a 15kg weight to lift and control (some are up to 25kg) , all at a strange body angle. That's assuming it is in perfect condition and they often are not so requiring a little extra force or a bit more of a twist. In one case a couple of years ago on a new aircraft the cabin trim was inaccurately fitted the only way to release the door was to have it at the "perfect height". You do need to be fit to hold an awkwardly shaped 15kg weight at arms length. It's issues like this that led to the "Cranfield door" as seen on the 737-800 (and later) which hinges up in a gull wing fashion.
I think the point I'm making in a roundabout fashion is that if you cannot lift your bag into the overhead locker due to temporary or permanent physiology then you should not be sat in the exit seat(s) on an aeroplane with traditional over-wing exits and probably shouldn't be in the exit row at all.
Jun 25, 2018, 12:28 am
#12
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(1)For some planes [777s on AA] some exit doors only require pulling a LARGE door handle, no lifting is required.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
(2)On most other planes you have to remove the emergency door, which can be done with horizontal motion. Putting luggage in the overhead bin requires lifting it upward. So exit door can be done, the luggage could be an issue for some pax.
(3)If someone is not tall even though they can (still) get luggage into the bin, getting it out could be a problem if the compartment is sloped downward.
Jun 25, 2018, 2:03 am
#13
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The suggestion of mentioning my surprise occurred to me but as the crew member who had been asked to put the first luggage up saw perfectly well the gentleman sit in the exit row (indeed she had to tell him she had to put his second bag up too) it would have amounted to questioning her judgement openly which I’m always a bit reluctant to do.
Jun 25, 2018, 2:20 am
#14
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 756
Presumably it's a very sensitive area. My experience is that CC ensure verbal affirmation from pax. But, yes, if CC think pax is not telling the truth, mistaken, or just in denial, what't the next step?
Jun 25, 2018, 2:22 am
#15
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What would you say, though, if pax says "I'm fine and able to perform the duties required of me?" I've never seen another pax question the capability of an exit row pax to undertake their duties in the unlikely event of an emergency after pax has affirmed their ability to do so. I'm also not sure I've ever seen CC do this (before, yes, but not after).
Presumably it's a very sensitive area. My experience is that CC ensure verbal affirmation from pax. But, yes, if CC think pax is not telling the truth, mistaken, or just in denial, what't the next step?
Presumably it's a very sensitive area. My experience is that CC ensure verbal affirmation from pax. But, yes, if CC think pax is not telling the truth, mistaken, or just in denial, what't the next step?