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Would you turn down a really good job if the travel policy was all Y?

Would you turn down a really good job if the travel policy was all Y?

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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:00 am
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Being a Brit, it's easy to understand that the salary bump is a good one. It's obvious that the base salary is well into the 40% tax step, so a £2,000 net increase to cover the Y travel is close to £3,000 gross.

If the travel was a couple of times a year, sure, Y is fine. But once a month means a ton of jetlag and probably weekend flying. The money's no good when most of your off/family time is spent in airports or asleep! So for me, unless the job was amazing, it'd be easy to make my decision.

Flights are a business expense, so you've just been offered close to £3k to upgrade each monthly flight. Assuming (a) you're allowed to upgrade and (b) the tickets bought are upgradable then I'd take the job. You'll be swimming in status, and all your flights will be in J. However, if the tickets bought are not upgradeable or the company insists you sit in Y regardless, then for monthly LH flights I'd turn the job down.

This ignores any other travel policy limits such as only cheapo hotels etc.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:05 am
  #107  
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Originally Posted by PETER01 View Post
You don't look too bad for your age really but as for the 36 inch waist sounds like you have a faulty tape measure
Well, it could also be the tape measure of either Mr. Marks or Mr. Spencer?

[Though apparently they have been increasing the sizes of their clothes on the sly, to prevent upsetting their customers, kind of the opposite to BA I suppose].

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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:08 am
  #108  
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Originally Posted by PETER01 View Post
Give me a shout if you are needing any more assistants. I can start right away.
There will be a job in September, £40k (with all J / 4 Star travel policy) if you’re interested. Details on HFP nearer the time.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:11 am
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There is a wealth of interesting perspectives in this thread, but I'll throw a couple of other things I've not seen mentioned.

The first is those on this forum are often those who have reached a certain level of seniority in their careers. They may have valuable skills and expertise that put them in a strong position in terms of negotiating benefits, and might have experience of conducting such negotiations. Importantly, many of us here have the wherewithal to walk away from an offer that is sufficiently unattractive, confident of finding something else. I am not sure of the OP's circumstances, and the offer of £24k per month extra is a considerable amount, so perhaps he/she is in this position - but this is not a given. For a relatively junior applicant to be too picky may not always be so easy.

The second is that it depends on the sector, which also links to something which has been mentioned here before in terms of public perception: someone working for an NGO, the government, or a university may find themselves with different restrictions, including (potentially) being unable to upgrade themselves even if they can afford it, there are no ticketing restrictions, and there is availability. The OP has said this is a US company, so it doesn't perhaps apply here, but this may factor into other people's considerations.

The long and short of it is that one would have to weigh up very carefully the situation one is in, and the benefits on offer: it may not be so easy to walk away.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:15 am
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Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave View Post
Well, it could also be the tape measure of either Mr. Marks or Mr. Spencer?

[Though apparently they have been increasing the sizes of their clothes on the sly, to prevent upsetting their customers, kind of the opposite to BA I suppose].

An industry term called "Vanity Sizing". All brands do that so in reality you could be a 38 and they call it a 36.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:15 am
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Originally Posted by PETER01 View Post
Give me a shout if you are needing any more assistants. I can start right away
​​​​​
Originally Posted by Raffles View Post
There will be a job in September, £40k (with all J / 4 Star travel policy) if you’re interested. Details on HFP nearer the time.
Now there's an idea if the current work becomes too tedious…
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:22 am
  #112  
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I would have done so when I was younger but I'd think twice now.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:25 am
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I negotiated J for all long haul flights when I joined my present company. However, it was a verbal discussion and I never had it put in writing. I was then moved departments and the new department insisted on all Y. I refused to fly Y but accepted PE. Needless to say, I rarely get asked to fly long haul now. (I enjoy the job otherwise so have not caused too much of a fuss).
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:26 am
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It all depends om you current position. My boss told me never to accept a new role in another company if the salary increase you would get is less than 20%. If you are unemployed it is something different. Your deal doesn’t look bad but only if you book your flights directly with BA and not through an agent. You can litterally do nothing upgrade wise if it is a TA booking which way I moved a lot of my travels to AF. They are more flexible when it comes to TA bookings. And you’ll gave to be in the higher Y buckets to be able to double upgrade with money from Y to J with BA. Did it once on a LHR JNB sector at the airport and it cost £900. And that’s a long sector. So if you travel longhaul once a month I guess you’ll be safe. But be careful! I started my job with max 2 round trips a year to SA in Y and now it is twice a month. It has taken a toll on my body, my health and my fitness. For those who say it is waste of money for the company should reconsider what they say. It is not human to fly on a Sunday night to JNB, go straight to work and fly back on Thursday all in Y and that twice a month. Some of my colleagues even fly down for a 4 hourmeeting and fly the same evening back to the UK all in Y. It is insane.
To make our travel a bit easier, and to avoid spending our own money, sone of us

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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:29 am
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Originally Posted by Raffles View Post


J only contracts still exist in the City - I had one for 16 years (everyone got it, even the PAs) - and my assistant has one now.

That said I might take the £24k extra if it could be applied to travel and therefore go untaxed. One trip a month would be a wash.

A friend who is an IT consultant has a ‘highest cabin’ clause written into his contracts, ie F if available. People are happy to pay it.
My company (An American multinational chemical manufacturer) has a J-only policy for middle-to-big fishes, and I know of some technical guys that have to travel a lot (2-3 weeks per month) that managed to get the same policy. Even in the corporate travel policy there is a paragraph stating that the standard policy (<5h Y, >5h J) is open to exceptions if you can justify the reasons.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:35 am
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My company has a flexible travel policy, with the provision that we must do what is in the best interests of the company (and, potentially, be ready to defend that). That probably makes more sense than an "only J" or "only Y" policy, since those don't take unique circumstances (such as unusually high fare differentials, flight timings, etc.) into account.

The way I apply this is to calculate my hourly wage by the number of hours of productivity the company will gain due to travel in a higher class of travel. For red-eye flights, I also count the extra night of hotel and expenses due to arriving a day early. Given the low differentials usually available for a higher class of travel, it almost always turns out to be cheaper for the company for me to travel LH in a higher class of travel. (Usually, the calculation means that SH in Y is cheaper, and that is fine.)

(They also let us book our own hotels, which I appreciate as I can often find cheaper rates than those available through the official travel agent.)

In general, the thing that would concern me most about a job with a rigid travel policy is the rigidity of their policies. I prefer places where common sense prevails over rigid policies. If they don't trust me to be able to apply common sense to travel, where else will they ignore my judgment in favor of rigid policies? (I'm not saying this applies to your job; however, that's what I would examine rather than focusing on the travel policy in isolation.)
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:41 am
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About 10 years ago I was an employee of a global financial services firm, but worked with a subsidiary that had employees literally all over the world on a weekly basis, and they used a small, local, responsive travel agent who seemed to be able to help with all the IRROPs that would happen. I asked when I started flying to their office on a fortnightly basis if I could pay the differnence between Y (travel policy) and J, and they were happy with that. That was the first year that I got Gold, and haven't looked back since - they have a lot to answer for ;-).

In terms of the original post, if the job was that good, and the travel was to (say) JFK rather than (say) SYD, then I'd take it - the path not taken and all that.

Currently as the Head of HR if a candidate started asking me about the T&E policy during the interview process it would start the alarm bells ringing for me...
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:42 am
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Originally Posted by schrodingerdog View Post
My company (An American multinational chemical manufacturer) has a J-only policy for middle-to-big fishes, and I know of some technical guys that have to travel a lot (2-3 weeks per month) that managed to get the same policy. Even in the corporate travel policy there is a paragraph stating that the standard policy (<5h Y, >5h J) is open to exceptions if you can justify the reasons.
I've worked for 2 companies in my working career. In theory both have had the same policy 6hrs+ & J, otherwise Y. In practice the policy in both is "what will the client reimburse", usually Y only, in which case throw the policy away you are going Y. If we are lump sum you are going Y, irrespective of policy, unless you have clout. In one of those companies, there was a catch all that said you can travel J irrespective of duration if you travel "regularly" with no definition of what that meant.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:45 am
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I once worked for a US company who had an all Y travel policy including the CEO. I never really felt the corporate jet they used was all Y.
And it's amazing how when the vice-presidents flew how they always had a customer in tow and so had to fly with their customer who had a business or fist policy.
Mind you the latter was also used by many at lower levels too.
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Old Mar 3, 18, 5:48 am
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Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave View Post
The way company travel is booked makes a big difference, there must be 2 dozen ways of doing it. Here are just a few examples to highlight the issues:
1) Large company has inhouse travel, a multi-million dollar spend on BA, including access to BT/IT (bulk/inclusive Tours) ticketing. It pay via immediate direct debit or invoicing
2) Medium company outsources medium travel spend to CWT, Amex etc, with direct GDS access, payment by corporate credit card typically. Maybe has some deals with BA and different deals with other oneworld airlines.
3) Small company books travel on corporate credit card but it's in the name of the traveller, and is booked via BA.com
4) Very small company gets traveller to book themselves and claim back.

You won't get POUGs on 1 or 2, perhaps 3 too. You can't have an AUP on 1. You may be able to UUA 2, 3, 4. Now 4 and perhaps 3 is effectively the best option in this area since (e.g. you can call within 24 hours of booking and upgrade to WTP for just the fare difference and no change fee).

Essentially it's all about ticket ownership, Know Your Customer, and whether the fares are public/published or not. Option 4 is the only one guaranteed to have ticket ownership with BA, known BAEC customer and published fares. A BT/IT ticket is at the other extreme - perhaps ticketed on AA, perhaps a BT/IT fare, not published, payment detached from the traveller.

And as I say there are dozens of variants in between.
Duly educated, and appreciated, thanks. My business related travel (effectively) falls under 4), I hadn't appreciated the lack of flexibility that would come from e.g. 1)

Edit: thanks for also clearing up something that puzzled me. A year or two ago I was travelling fairly regularly on EDI-LHR-YUL with a colleague. I was getting regular POUG offers on the YUL-LHR leg while he never did (180 quid into W, 450 into J). The difference was he was an employee booked through the corporate TA, whereas I was contract and booking my own travel directly on BA.com, so I guess that explains it....

Last edited by BertieBadger; Mar 3, 18 at 6:26 am Reason: Add notes on POUG
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