DYKWIA | 2018 edition
Jul 10, 2018, 1:33 pm
#421
Join Date: May 2012
Programs: BA Gold, HHonors Diamond, IHG Platinum, Senior Railcard & Bus Pass
Posts: 983
The passenger didn’t just fail to understand the relatively confusing lounge access rules. He was creating a rumpus, was demanding and arguing. He certainly sounds like the DYKWIA to me.
Last edited by WickedStepMother; Jul 10, 2018 at 1:35 pm Reason: Quote problems!
Jul 10, 2018, 1:41 pm
#422
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: Some
Posts: 5,231
Sounds a bit like you disagree with the access rules rather than anything else. They are perfectly simple. You should also note they had access to the perfectly good MH lounge but refused to go, it's not like they were being relegated to sitting in the terminal.
Last edited by lost_in_translation; Jul 10, 2018 at 1:48 pm
Jul 10, 2018, 1:55 pm
#423
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,114
OT (Mr Gammon wasn’t me BTW!), but when did the QR access rules in T4 change? I used it around 15 months ago when flying MH and it was the highlight of the flying part of the trip...
Jul 10, 2018, 1:56 pm
#424
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: Some
Posts: 5,231
If you were in MH J or F then you will have had access as a result of that (and still would today). If you were in MH Y there hasn't been any change in access rules, you shouldn't have been granted access and got very lucky!
Jul 10, 2018, 2:04 pm
#425
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL (for now) and Lifetime Gold, Marriott fan thanks to Bonvoy Moments
Posts: 5,114
MH J. So flying MH J you get access but OWE flying QR you don’t - interesting. I knew they had the separate lounge for OWE status pax in DOH. One to remember if I ever countenance Y travel from T4 (not going to happen...)
Jul 10, 2018, 2:22 pm
#426
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: London
Programs: BA Silver (for now)
Posts: 1,000
QR lounge in T4 last evening waiting patiently for QR16, I was sitting within sight of the entrance when I heard a man's raised voice so looked up. Someone who I can only describe as a Mr Gammon together with twenty something year old son was creating a rumpus and was demanding access to the lounge waving his gold card. The two staff members explained very patiently and quietly that the lounge is reserved to first and business class customers and that status cards don't grant access. Mr Gammon went ever more red as he told them they were wrong, did not know what they were talking about and that he knew as a BA gold member he could access any lounge and it didn't matter which class he was traveling in.
Staff again explained that he could access the MH lounge or the SkyTeam lounge but that the QR lounge was reserved to first and business passengers. Mr Gammon was having none of it gold card still waving and demanding the presence of someone who knew the rules as these two people didn't. Supervisor duly attended, listened to one round, reiterated the access rules, Mr Gammon argued and supervisor replied that if he was so discontent then she could arrange to offload him from his flight and return him landside and if that wasn't what he wanted he should leave the lounge immediately. Mr Gammon was by now scarlet, son not much better but saying he would be taking the matter 'further, much further, much, much further' he left the lounge.
I was in 11A - favourite seat (Qsuite) on the A35K with champagne in hand when Mr Gammon and son boarded somewhat late in the piece complete with BA gold tags on hand luggage, there was a queue stretching back from Y and he paused by my seat. I looked up, smiled, wished him good evening and sang the praises of QR and how marvellous the service was unable to resist adding that I had been relaxing and had dinner in the lounge and was now ready for sleep to which he grunted and all the more as he was eased to one side as a crew member brought me a cold towel and pjs.
I hope economy class lived up to his expectations. I did wonder if he was in transit at DOH and would have the same row all over again about the lounges there but fortunately never caught sight of him again.
Staff again explained that he could access the MH lounge or the SkyTeam lounge but that the QR lounge was reserved to first and business passengers. Mr Gammon was having none of it gold card still waving and demanding the presence of someone who knew the rules as these two people didn't. Supervisor duly attended, listened to one round, reiterated the access rules, Mr Gammon argued and supervisor replied that if he was so discontent then she could arrange to offload him from his flight and return him landside and if that wasn't what he wanted he should leave the lounge immediately. Mr Gammon was by now scarlet, son not much better but saying he would be taking the matter 'further, much further, much, much further' he left the lounge.
I was in 11A - favourite seat (Qsuite) on the A35K with champagne in hand when Mr Gammon and son boarded somewhat late in the piece complete with BA gold tags on hand luggage, there was a queue stretching back from Y and he paused by my seat. I looked up, smiled, wished him good evening and sang the praises of QR and how marvellous the service was unable to resist adding that I had been relaxing and had dinner in the lounge and was now ready for sleep to which he grunted and all the more as he was eased to one side as a crew member brought me a cold towel and pjs.
I hope economy class lived up to his expectations. I did wonder if he was in transit at DOH and would have the same row all over again about the lounges there but fortunately never caught sight of him again.
Hopefully Mr Gammon enjoyed what he paid for in Y.
Jul 10, 2018, 2:36 pm
#427
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: Some
Posts: 5,231
All QR lounges other than the OWE and OWS lounges at DOH operate on a policy of allowing access to passengers departing in J and F class on Oneworld flights only.
Jul 10, 2018, 4:24 pm
#428
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: United Kingdom
Programs: BAEC Blue, Flying Blue Silver, Hilton Gold, Marriot Gold
Posts: 817
I don’t hold status with Oneworld or any airline for that matter, but I thought it was a rule of the alliance that you have to let OWE and OWS into your lounge?
Jul 10, 2018, 4:24 pm
#429
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,881
Jul 10, 2018, 4:28 pm
#430
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK
Posts: 17,005
Jul 10, 2018, 7:20 pm
#431
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,372
All OW airlines are required (again, with some exceptions like those listed above), are required to offer lounge access to their F and J passengers, and all OWS and OWE members traveling on their metal. So, those passengers can access the appropriate lounges that operate under the OW agreements (a OWE on AA LHR-PHL can access the CX F lounge in LHR, for example), or a specific lounge that the airline contracts with (AA ex-HKG F and J passengers, and OWS and OWE passengers can use the CX or QF lounges, or the Plaza Premium lounge AA contracts with).
However, there are lounges operated by OneWorld airlines that operate outside of those agreements, and the airlines are free to restrict access. The Concorde Room at LHR T5 is accessible only to BA F passengers. The QR Al Safwa First and Al Mourjan Business lounges at DOH are accessible only to F and J passengers, respectively traveling on a OW airline. Same with the QR lounges at LHR and CDG.
Just because the lounge is operated by a OW airline doesn't by default (although they are the exception) mean that they are a OW lounge, if that makes sense. And the airline isn't running afoul of the rules as long as they are provisioning lounge access to OW elites traveling on their metal. So QR can absolutely restrict access at the LHR lounge to OW F and J passengers and exclude OW elites, as long as they are also provisioning lounge access in some other way to those elites, which they are by contracting with the SkyTeam Lounge, and because they have access to the MH lounge (which must admit those elites and to which all F and J OW passengers have access to, as well).
Sorry that was long-winded.
Jul 10, 2018, 11:29 pm
#432
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Vale of Glamorgan
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,989
I was in 11A - favourite seat (Qsuite) on the A35K with champagne in hand when Mr Gammon and son boarded somewhat late in the piece complete with BA gold tags on hand luggage, there was a queue stretching back from Y and he paused by my seat. I looked up, smiled, wished him good evening and sang the praises of QR and how marvellous the service was unable to resist adding that I had been relaxing and had dinner in the lounge and was now ready for sleep to which he grunted and all the more as he was eased to one side as a crew member brought me a cold towel and pjs.
Jul 10, 2018, 11:53 pm
#434
Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club, easyJet and Ryanair
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: UK/Las Vegas
Programs: BA Gold (GGL/CCR)
Posts: 15,913
Jul 11, 2018, 1:44 am
#435
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: London
Programs: Hilton, IHG - BA, GA, LH, QR, SV, TK
Posts: 17,005
Reporting them here gives a smile, and perhaps reminds us that none of us is immune from providing such displays. Indeed, the self-deprecating reports of readers’ very own bouts DYKWIA behaviour are often the funniest of these reports.
However, a narrator glorying in spiteful behaviour to individuals who have caused no harm, belittling them from a position of privilege in front of their family, makes me uneasy. I certainly wouldn't delight in it. It’s simply not the sort of style I’d like to see promoted as acceptable in FT.
I can see that this view might colour me as po-faced. But that really isn’t me
