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The 2018 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261/2004

The 2018 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261/2004

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Old Dec 17, 18, 5:14 am   -   Wikipost
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Link to Text of the regulations in PDF format

How about a Wiki to post EU comp given/denied as well as results for any CEDR or other process. Especially concerning the 787 issue as there are going to be many claims given all the cancellations.

Mine was April 22 BA280 LAX-LHR cancellation 4 days before flight and rebooked on later flight and arrived 4.5 hrs later than origianlly scheduled. BA's response was to deny for "operational" requirements though the 787 "tentatively assigned" G-ZBJG was used instead for a LHR-YUL flight that same day. CEDR filed and awaiting their initial review. Sept 3rd UPDATE: CEDR decision in Article 7 comp awarded in the amount of 600 euro as even though extraordinary circumstances are present in an engine defect as this, BA didn't show that they took reasonable steps to avoid the cancellation as they have known since Oct 2017 of this issue.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 4:56 am
  #1021  
 
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If you look at the profile of those who've received responses / settlement quickly, you'll find that some of them have Exec Club status - this might be the reason they get preferential treatment.

You may also find that as you took matters into your own hands BA may well reject the compensation bit.

Interestingly were you on a single PNR for NCL-LHR-BOS - if you didn't take the 1st sector how did you manage to get the 2nd - or did you panic because they were separate tickets?

Last edited by babats; Jul 31, 18 at 4:59 am Reason: Additional info added
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Old Jul 31, 18, 4:59 am
  #1022  
 
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Yeah, you just need to patient. I may take several weeks to get a reply. That a few persons have reported in this thread of very speedy replies from BA doen't mean that in general BA is this quick at responding - the saying "one swallow doesn't make a summer" still applies here.

For your information earlier this year it took BA 6 weeks to respond to my claim for reimbursement of costs incurred due to luggage delay - so you need to be very patient. Rest assured that you will get a reply eventually. No need to push/remind BA for a reply.

On a different note, I'm surprised that you were actually able to skip the first leg of your ticket without consequences apparently - no issues at check-in at LHR for BOS flight? The remaining flights were still there/in the reservation?
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Old Jul 31, 18, 5:00 am
  #1023  
 
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Originally Posted by babats View Post
If you look at the profile of those who've received responses / settlement quickly, you'll find that some of them have Exec Club status - this might be the reason they get preferential treatment.
I have BAEC status even if it's Bronze! I was flying in CE. Flight got cancelled just as we were about to start boarding due to a CC member injuring herself. Got put on next flight with no meal and bags not turning up until 48 hours later.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 5:24 am
  #1024  
 
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Originally Posted by babats View Post
If you look at the profile of those who've received responses / settlement quickly, you'll find that some of them have Exec Club status - this might be the reason they get preferential treatment.

You may also find that as you took matters into your own hands BA may well reject the compensation bit.

Interestingly were you on a single PNR for NCL-LHR-BOS - if you didn't take the 1st sector how did you manage to get the 2nd - or did you panic because they were separate tickets?
So because I decided to fork out almost £200 and do a mad dash across the country instead of cancelling my own holiday, I might not be entitled to compensation? That's insane! The next available NCL-LHR flight available was for 6AM on the 20th July, so a full 24 hours after my cancelled flight, meaning I would have missed my connection by about 20 hours. It was literally either take it into my own hands or cancel the whole thing. Will be devastated if I'm entitled to nothing because I decided to not cancel my entire holiday, and spend my own money to get there. BA did tell me on the phone on the Thursday morning that they will reimburse the train tickets, so I should at the very least be entitled to that money back.

And I had absolutely no issues at check in at Heathrow. I had spoken to someone from BA on the phone beforehand, and was essentially told 'get yourself to Heathrow if you can', so they may have done something on their side to allow me through, but it wasn't even mentioned at the check in desk at Heathrow. Straight through with no issues.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 5:45 am
  #1025  
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Nobody wrote that you are not entitled to compensation. A simple question was asked, to which you did not answer: where you on a single PNR NCL-LHR-BOS or was that two separate tickets ?
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Old Jul 31, 18, 5:55 am
  #1026  
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Originally Posted by Globaliser View Post
It is a time, but we've been struggling to work out what time zone it's given in (or even whether that's consistent from one occasion to the next).
I think the best we can suggest is to add 6 hours to this, to make it UK time. In this case it seems to work since 10:29 would seem too soon and 12:29 is too late.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:02 am
  #1027  
 
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Originally Posted by fransknorge View Post
Nobody wrote that you are not entitled to compensation. A simple question was asked, to which you did not answer: where you on a single PNR NCL-LHR-BOS or was that two separate tickets ?
Wow, ok, Iím not sure what I did to deserve a response with such snark and attitude? Iím a complete newbie to all this, and specifically signed up and posted to this forum to ask others far more knowledgeable than me for advice. I wasnít having a go at anyone or getting annoyed, simply expressing my incredulidity at possibly not being entitled to compensation for paying out my own money and not cancelling my holiday. If you read that in a different way then I apologise, but I was shocked at reading that, as I thought in my situation compensation would be practically guaranteed, so I simply expressed shock at that not being the case.

I also did answer the question in the second half of my post, although apparently not clearly enough. It was one ticket, one single booking, NCL-LHR-BOS. I had no issues when getting to Heathrow with the second part of my journey.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:02 am
  #1028  
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Updated: OP answered the one vs. two ticket question while I was posting. So, ignore that part below. To be fair, while OP is frustrated, the questions asked here are legitimate and determine what will happen. There was no snark from others and if one cannot answer the harder questions, here one simply goes away. With BA, one simply loses the claim.

Whether OP was on a single PNR is irrelevant. The proper question is whether OP was on a single ticket NCL-BOS with a connection at LHR or on two tickets, even if in the same PNR, one ticket being NCL-LHR and the second being LHR-BOS. If the former, it is likely that BA simply did not cancel the entire ticket in light of the flight cancellation and ensuing backup, by the time OP boarded at LHR. If on two tickets, OP, the no show on NCL-LHR would not affect the onward LHR-BOS ticket.

OP may need to resubmit because some of this is an EC 261/2004 claim and the rest is seeking a customer service gesture. A lot will also depend on the one vs. two ticket issue, which OP really does need to answer. As to why this claim has not been expeditiously processed, it seems that BA can do a good job once it has determined that an event is compensable. E.g., everybody on a series of flights departing a given airport on a given day between specified times. Those claims are easy because they fit a bucket subject to compensation. OP's situation is much more complex and also the claim is for items which fall outside the Regulation and thus require evaluation from a customer service perspective.

1. Here, when BA cancelled the flight, OP had the option of cancelling or rerouting and was apparently afforded the reroute option, e.g. NCL-BOS to LHR-BOS. There was no delay in arrival and the time parameters for reroutes were waived by OP's choice of self-help. So, no delay compensation.

2. The train ticket is a claim against travel insurance and will be defrayed by the refund due for the NCL-LHR segment which was cancelled. BA might choose to pay for the train ticket as a customer service gesture, but there is no legal requirement (although BA does owe OP a duty of care which would cover a meal or two along the way)

Last edited by Often1; Jul 31, 18 at 6:29 am
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:06 am
  #1029  
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Originally Posted by rachel333 View Post
And I had absolutely no issues at check in at Heathrow. I had spoken to someone from BA on the phone beforehand, and was essentially told 'get yourself to Heathrow if you can', so they may have done something on their side to allow me through, but it wasn't even mentioned at the check in desk at Heathrow. Straight through with no issues.
Yes - it sounds like they fixed it so you could start at BOS.

You won't be entitled to EU compensation as you weren't late arriving into BOS (from what I can see). If BA have told you they will pay the train fare, then they should honour that. If they don't request them to play back the call
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:22 am
  #1030  
 
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Updated: OP answered the one vs. two ticket question while I was posting. So, ignore that part below. To be fair, while OP is frustrated, the questions asked here are legitimate and determine what will happen. There was no snark from others and if one cannot answer the harder questions, here one simply goes away. With BA, one simply loses the claim.

Whether OP was on a single PNR is irrelevant. The proper question is whether OP was on a single ticket NCL-BOS with a connection at LHR or on two tickets, even if in the same PNR, one ticket being NCL-LHR and the second being LHR-BOS. If the former, it is likely that BA simply did not cancel the entire ticket in light of the flight cancellation and ensuing backup, by the time OP boarded at LHR. If on two tickets, OP, the no show on NCL-LHR would not affect the onward LHR-BOS ticket.

OP may need to resubmit because some of this is an EC 261/2004 claim and the rest is seeking a customer service gesture. A lot will also depend on the one vs. two ticket issue, which OP really does need to answer. As to why this claim has not been expeditiously processed, it seems that BA can do a good job once it has determined that an event is compensable. E.g., everybody on a series of flights departing a given airport on a given day between specified times. Those claims are easy because they fit a bucket subject to compensation. OP's situation is much more complex and also the claim is for items which fall outside the Regulation and thus require evaluation from a customer service perspective.

1. Here, when BA cancelled the flight, OP had the option of cancelling or rerouting and was apparently afforded the reroute option, e.g. NCL-BOS to LHR-BOS. There was no delay in arrival and the time parameters for reroutes were waived by OP's choice of self-help. So, no delay compensation.

2. The train ticket is a claim against travel insurance and will be defrayed by the refund due for the NCL-LHR segment which was cancelled. BA might choose to pay for the train ticket as a customer service gesture, but there is no legal requirement (although BA does owe OP a duty of care which would cover a meal or two along the way).



3.
Can I clarify the re-route option? I was not offered a re-route option. There was no other flight they could place me onto. There is no NCL-BOS route, if I wanted to go on holiday I had to somehow get to Heathrow. All I was told by BA was that they could put me on a NCL-LHR flight 24 hours later, which obviously was of no use, as I would have missed my connection then by about 20 hours. So it was find a way to get to Heathrow on my own, or cancel my holiday. Those were my only options.

The reason why I am shocked people are saying I wonít be entitled to compensation, is because of this:

2. If we inform you of a cancellation less than 14 days before the planned departure date that arises from causes within our control (rather than extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided by all reasonable measures), unless:
  • We inform you of the cancellation between 7 and 13 days before the scheduled time of departure and offer an alternative route that allows you to depart no more than two hours before the scheduled time of departure and to reach your final destination less than four hours after the scheduled time of arrival; or
  • We inform you of the cancellation less than 7 days before the scheduled time of departure and offer an alternative route that allows you to depart no more than one hour before the scheduled time of departure and to reach your final destination less than two hours after the scheduled time of arrival.

Its the final bullet point that throws me. BA cancelled my flight with 9 hours notice, and offered no alternate route, that allowed me to depart no more than one hour before the time of departure and reach my final destination less than 2 hours after the scheduled time
of arrival. BA offered absolutely nothing. I paid for the train ticket myself, got there myself, BA had absolutely nothing to do with it. Thatís why Iím expressing shock at the fact that because I paid my own money and got myself there, as BA offered nothing, that therefore doesnít entitle me to compensation.

What about the cost of the NCL-LHR flight? I paid for a flight that was ultimately cancelled. Surely they have to reimburse me for that? My parents actually and through the exact same thing 2 years ago, but in the reverse direction (they flew from the US into Heathrow, and then the LHR-NCL connection was cancelled) and they did receive the 250 euros compensation.

I appreciate all of the advice given though, thank you everyone! I guess Iíll just have to wait it out!
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:32 am
  #1031  
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Originally Posted by rachel333 View Post
Its the final bullet point that throws me. BA cancelled my flight with 9 hours notice, and offered no alternate route, that allowed me to depart no more than one hour before the time of departure and reach my final destination less than 2 hours after the scheduled time of arrival. BA offered absolutely nothing. I paid for the train ticket myself, got there myself, BA had absolutely nothing to do with it. That’s why I’m expressing shock at the fact that because I paid my own money and got myself there, as BA offered nothing, that therefore doesn’t entitle me to compensation.
Actually, BA did offer you an alternative route to get to your destination. Instead of flying Newcastle-Boston, they arranged for you to fly Heathrow-Boston so that you arrived at the originally scheduled time. That is the reason that you may not be entitled to compensation. (Note: "may not", not "will not".)

If, in addition, BA agreed to pay the expenses you incurred in getting to the new start point, then obviously BA should pay that.

If you had not made those arrangements, would you really have had to cancel your holiday? At worst, you'd probably have ended up getting to Boston about 24 hours late. Many of us have been in that position. If that had happened, you would undoubtedly have been entitled to compensation. Unless you were flying there to start a cruise immediately, or there was something else equally time-critical, missing a flight or a connection is not the end of a trip.

BTW: You may know this already, but as a new member you have a 5-post limit in the first 24 hours, or something like that. So we will all understand it if you hit that limit and can't post again until the limit expires.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:36 am
  #1032  
 
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Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave View Post
I think the best we can suggest is to add 6 hours to this, to make it UK time. In this case it seems to work since 10:29 would seem too soon and 12:29 is too late.
Except that 11:29 does not fit either, as my notes show I spoke to Customer Services airside at around 11:15. So maybe it was 10:29 somewhere in the system, but that had not propogated to the local displays or checkin counter. At the time of checkin the flight was still showing as delayed until12:50, and the comment at checkin was "it's delayed but we hope it will go earlier!" No mention that the inbound aircraft had not actually left the IOM. I don't appear to have a record of exactly when I checked in my bags, but I guess it was just after 10:30, as I basically went thru security, found a seat, turned on my phone, opened the BA app and found that the flight had been cancelled. At that stage it was still showing delay on the local monitors, so I was near the front of the mayhem at the customer assistance desk airside.

I guess we could also look at when the inbound BA3283 was cancelled - but I don't seem to be able to find that now on Expert Flyer. (Not that I am an expert user of EF)

Last edited by PWOZUK; Jul 31, 18 at 6:39 am Reason: add not re inbound
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:40 am
  #1033  
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Some of your frustration is in misunderstanding the terminology and what you did and did not have.

You were ticketed NCL-BOS with a connection at LHR. But, LHR is simply a place where, in your case, you were to change planes. As you were on a single ticket, if you had been rerouted 20 hours later, BA would also have placed you on the LHR-BOS flight a day later or perhaps some other carrier's flight should BA not have availability. You would be due EUR 600 in cancellation compensation as well as a duty of care which might have included a hotel and meal vouchers (should you choose to remain around the airport rather than at home, all depending on your choice).

Also, at your option, you could have cancelled your ticket for a full refund or postponed and been rebooked at a later date of your choosing. Again, your option.

You chose self-help. That is entirely understandable in your situation and I frankly would have done the same thing. But, you did not depart NCL or LHR more than one hour before the scheduled time of departure for the respective flights and you did not arrive in BOS late (so far as we know). Thus, your travel was within the parameters of EC 261/2004. Again, the choice of travel by train was yours to make. Perhaps BA might have agreed to pay for a ticket if asked and perhaps it might still reimburse as a gesture. But, you will find that your travel insurance is likely more availing of a GBP 180 payment than BA.
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:43 am
  #1034  
 
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Sorry - I feel that I have taken this thread off topic somewhat. At this point it's totally academic as to what the time the flight was cancelled. It's the reason that matters to my EC261 claim and no doubt BA will have something to say on that when they get to process my claim, as submited on-line.

Last edited by PWOZUK; Jul 31, 18 at 6:49 am Reason: typo
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Old Jul 31, 18, 6:44 am
  #1035  
 
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Originally Posted by Globaliser View Post
Actually, BA did offer you an alternative route to get to your destination. Instead of flying Newcastle-Boston, they arranged for you to fly Heathrow-Boston so that you arrived at the originally scheduled time. That is the reason that you may not be entitled to compensation. (Note: "may not", not "will not".)

If, in addition, BA agreed to pay the expenses you incurred in getting to the new start point, then obviously BA should pay that.

If you had not made those arrangements, would you really have had to cancel your holiday? At worst, you'd probably have ended up getting to Boston about 24 hours late. Many of us have been in that position. If that had happened, you would undoubtedly have been entitled to compensation. Unless you were flying there to start a cruise immediately, or there was something else equally time-critical, missing a flight or a connection is not the end of a trip.

BTW: You may know this already, but as a new member you have a 5-post limit in the first 24 hours, or something like that. So we will all understand it if you hit that limit and can't post again until the limit expires.
But they didnít arrange for me to fly Heathrow-Boston. That was already part of my booking. I had already bought and paid for a ticket Heathrow-Boston. And I caught that flight. So Iím not attempting to claim anything for that. Its simply NCL-LHR Iím claiming for.

After reading the responses on here, Iím now somewhat unsure what type of ticket I had? There was only one booking, and one booking reference, but there may have been separate tickets within that. Someone with more knowledge than me might be able to clarify. But when the 6AM NCL-LHR flight was cancelled, my online check in for the 11:15 LHR-BOS was still active. They were still actively allowing me to check in for the Boston flight, even when the first half of the booking was cancelled. So that possibly suggests they were treat as two separate tickets within the same booking? Iím unsure.

But that again highlights my point. They were treating LHR-BOS as a separate check in, and I was able to check in for that flight despite the first leg being cancelled. So surely they canít claim that they offered me LHR-BOS as an alternate, as that was already on my booking? They offered me no alternate for NCL-LHR, and thatís the part Iím trying to claim for. The fact that I was able to get their at my own time and expense should surely be irrelevant (although I understand they may not see it that way).

Also thank you for the warning about the post limit. I really appreciate everyoneís advice!
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