No seatbelts for infants!

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Old Dec 5, 17, 8:17 pm
  #31
 
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Their comment about the brace position is probably valid, but statistically you're more likely to experience turbulence than a crash. Good luck holding on to a toddler during turbulence.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 12:11 am
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Originally Posted by trooper View Post
The best method in practice is for the child to have their own seat. Its not exactly Rocket science. Are there any countries that REQUIRE each pax to have a seat? In my opinion THEY would be the ones who were "right".
The explanation given by the dismal scientists at the FAA is that they would really like to require all infants to be in a car seat in their own plane seat, but their statistics show that the increased cost to families in terms of additional tickets would encourage too many to them to chose to drive to their USA domestic destination rather than fly the whole family. And a baby in a parents' lap on a plane is several orders of magnitude safer on the trip than a baby in a car seat in a personal car/SUV/minivan.

So it's a trade off for greater safety throughout the transit process.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 1:15 am
  #33
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Latam Chille strange rule

Todllers can seat in Business Class only if they have separate sit and approved car/airplane seat!!!
so inflant belt not needed at all....but sepearate seat needed....in Economy no problem....

, good what I find out at Rio before boarding for connection to SCL where we have 3 seats in IPC
(2 Adults ,1 4 YearOld and 1 Year old toddler) in the end we got refund for tickets and extended our stay at Rio for 7 more days but we couldn't spend Easter 2016 on Easter Island
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Old Dec 6, 17, 3:52 am
  #34
 
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Originally Posted by kb9522 View Post
For someone who claims to be so concerned about their child, I find it strange that you have not considered an FAA approved car seat.
Originally Posted by EfficientTraveller View Post
A US seat would resolve the BA issue but they canít be used in the UK (to/from the airport) or EU so this is not really a practical option for most parents especially given the low risk associated with having a lap child. Would it not be more sensible for BA to permit the use of UK/EU approved seats that are designed for use on aircraft? It is very counter intuitive to have to purchase a US seat to secure a child on a UK carrier to a destination that may well not be in the US.
Plus, the OP was on a South African airline (Comair), so ZA CAA rules would trump UK CAA, EU, and US FAA rules/approval. This thread is showing that what is required in one country can be forbidden in another...
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Old Dec 6, 17, 5:59 am
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Originally Posted by JAXBA View Post
Plus, the OP was on a South African airline (Comair), so ZA CAA rules would trump UK CAA, EU, and US FAA rules/approval. This thread is showing that what is required in one country can be forbidden in another...
Which rules apply to a flight that crosses borders, e.g. UK -> SA in this instance and the reverse? Would it be that of the departing country or that of where the airline is registered (which might not always be obvious)?
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Old Dec 6, 17, 6:00 am
  #36
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Originally Posted by john205 View Post
Which rules apply to a flight that crosses borders, e.g. UK -> SA in this instance and the reverse? Would it be that of the departing country or that of where the airline is registered (which might not always be obvious)?
Operating procedures are usually those of the country of registration.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 6:49 am
  #37
 
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Originally Posted by LondonLondon View Post
Hello everyone - first time post after a long time lurking...

We have seen this a few times on Comair when travelling with a toddler and a baby. As mentioned above, it is due to the South African regulations. However, the crew happily have us child extension seatbelts after we pointed out that we would prefer the potential risk from seatbelt buckle injuries to that from turbulence. My understanding is that they are carried on all flights but not proactively offered.
Interesting. We just got back and had 2 internal flights with Comair. Both cases no belt for the little one. But to be honest I don't know what the right answer truly is re safety in the event of something going wrong, and in any case he wriggled like crazy when awake anyway (he's a very active 15m) so it's pretty much moot whether we have one or not (as it was on the LHR to / from JNB flights) so I didn't give it much thought, and just did as I was told.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 7:58 am
  #38
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BA are far from being the only airline that won't allow rear facing only car seats to be used on board, I was surprised to find out quite how many there are
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Old Dec 6, 17, 10:48 am
  #39
 
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Originally Posted by john205 View Post
Which rules apply to a flight that crosses borders, e.g. UK -> SA in this instance and the reverse? Would it be that of the departing country or that of where the airline is registered (which might not always be obvious)?
Regulations apply from the country in which the aircraft is registered.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 1:17 pm
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Originally Posted by PJSMITH0 View Post
Or USA you don’t need to wear a helmet
Many US states require a helmet.

Watching Air Emergency one night (don't remember the particular crash-but it was US), the FA advised a woman with lap child to assume the crash position and hold the child against the floor-those where the airlines guidelines. Mother lived. She never saw her child again. A crash is always unlikely, but I simply cannot see how its possible to secure a baby 8-30 pounds with your arms/hands in the event of an emergency. After that, we get a seat and put them in it.
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Old Dec 6, 17, 10:49 pm
  #41
 
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Originally Posted by EfficientTraveller View Post
It seems clear that the safest option is to have an infant secured in an airline approved car seat in their own seat so why do BA make this impossible?

A number of UK car seats (including the very popular Maxi Cosi Pebble) are approved for aircraft use and designed to be able to be secured with the lap belt. However, they are designed to be fitted rear facing (the same way they are used in the car) but BA only permits forward facing seats to be used on its flights. Given new EU car seat regulations require children to rear face until at least 15 months (and recommend it for as long as possible), BAs position practically makes it near impossible to use a car seat for most infants. BA also apparently require than any seat has a 5 point harness - another requirement that doesnít match car seat requirements as most use a 3 point design.

Have any of the posters that recommend the separate seat option for under twos managed this successfully on BA with a modern car seat?
The safest way of traveling with infants is with a car seat. BA's regulations don't make sense at all (forward versus rear-facing). They don't even allow car seats for infants under 6 months, when they are at their most fragile. That is outrageous from a safety standpoint. I just wouldn't fly with BA. I've heard their customer service is horrendous, anyway. Whatever airline you fly with, definitely print out their rules from their website; in my experience, flight crew more often than not do not know their own rules with regards to car seats.

As for a 5 point versus 3 point harness, are you sure yours is not a 5 point? Every car seat I've looked at has a 5-point harness system.
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Old Dec 7, 17, 2:48 am
  #42
 
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Originally Posted by Marilu View Post
They don't even allow car seats for infants under 6 months, when they are at their most fragile. That is outrageous from a safety standpoint.
But newborns are not supposed to be placed in car seats for hours at a time. So I guess banning car seats for very young babies is good for the vast majority of infants who travel safely, but less so in the event of a serious incident.
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Old Dec 8, 17, 3:46 pm
  #43
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Originally Posted by theddo View Post
The assumption with a seat belt extender is that you will crush your child during a severe accident, but the child will not fly through the cabin to injure someone else. Those incidents are rare, but that's the general gist of it.

You have already decided against safety if you fly with a child in your lap, so I'm not really interested in the totally irrelevant opinions you may have on how that is safe.
This is an obnoxious way to voice your opinion or criticize someone you do not know without the full set of facts. Consider this:
The most dangerous part of any airplane trip is the drive to and from the airport. Given this, if there is a choice between spending money on an extra seat on the plane and spending money to take a larger and safer vehicle to the airport, the money is almost certainly better spend on the latter.

Of course, if you have unlimited resources, you might choose to do both. However, every parent makes decisions--implicitly or explicitly--regarding safety. The decision to take a child out of the house, to take them on a plane (even in a car seat), to take them in a car, to expose them to places that might have lower standards of safety or healthcare than the place in which you live, etc. all have safety risks. A very rational person, however, can conclude that the benefits outweigh the risks. Even you, taking your child on a trip (with a car seat) increased the risk to that child. I do not blame you (I made the same decision), but let's at least pause to acknowledge that we are making trade offs and that other rational people could disagree.
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Old Dec 8, 17, 5:08 pm
  #44
 
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Originally Posted by windowontheAside View Post
But newborns are not supposed to be placed in car seats for hours at a time. So I guess banning car seats for very young babies is good for the vast majority of infants who travel safely, but less so in the event of a serious incident.
They're not supposed to be placed in their car seats all day every day. A few hours while flying is fine.
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Old Today, 9:49 am
  #45
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Aa

Originally Posted by CBear View Post
They're not supposed to be placed in their car seats all day every day. A few hours while flying is fine.
The recommended time is no more than 2 hours in a car seat at a time, indeed when my 16m old was born I was recommended no more than an hour
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