OldFruity

Flew LHR -PRG last night. I was fortunate enough to be ensconced in row 1 and was surprised to see the Captain suddenly appear from behind the curtain at about min 30 - IPAD in hand. He proceeded to interrogate the IPAD data and initiate conversation with us individually (not just small talk) before moving down the 9 rows of CE!. He did not appear to be in a hurry to return to his assigned seat .e.g. I asked him about the quality of the ATC service into Prg, which he said was quite good, and told him that I was involved with ATC training. Coincidentally after the outbound leg (no Capt visible) I was sent a BA survey which seemed to be more focused than before on the visible interaction of the Capt with the customer. So my question is : Is this a new BA policy for the Capt to engage with the customer ?. If so, is it still or was it ever, BA policy for there to be 2 crew to be in the cockpit at any time. personally I would prefer that the IPAD stay with the CSM / CSD and the Capt stays up the front.

OF

florens

I can't imagine that BA has the 2 crew on flight deck policy as I have seen pilots quite often leave the cockpit in order to use the lavatory or chat with cabin crew for a couple of minutes without another cabin crew entering the cockpit meanwhile.

corporate-wage-slave

It's not totally unusual, there have been threads about it here before. I tend to keep a few questions up my sleeve so I don't come across as completely witless when a member of the flight crew come through brandishing iPads.

The TellBA surveys do cycle between different aspects of the flight experience. I reckon it is something like 60% lounge focus, 25% cabin crew focus, 10% airport focus and 5% flight crew focus, very approximately,. I haven't kept a proper tally. This is on the basis of going for the full survey from the smartphone link rather than the 3 question text replies. For flight crew the usual questions are along the lines of "did the flight crew make welcoming announcements?", "did they appear at the door on departure?".

KARFA

My understanding is that there isn't any regulatory requirement in Europe for two people in the cockpit at all time - although I seem to remember EASA were consulting on it. Some airlines have decided to implement their own policy, some have not. BA doesn't seem to be one that has introduced any such policy of two people in the cockpit at all times.

I haven't seen that kind of interaction before OldFruity so can't comment on that aspect.

Oxon Flyer

Are you sure it was the Captain, rather than a Captain ?

OF

OldFruity

Oxon Flyer. Yes defo The Capt - 4 bars and the F0 was introduced as the pilot flying the leg on boarding. I appreciate that crew come and go from the cockpit as nature requires, but this episode appeared more like a planned company requirement. i.e a responsibility for one of the flight crew to interact with the pax along with their other more obvious duties and responsibilities ( operate the acft in a safe manner). I am all for BA asking for feedback through various surveys etc in an attempt to improve / evolve a product, but this episode, whereby a flight crew member spent what I would say was a considerable amount of time out of the cockpit (and not necessarily on his own volition if it has become a company directive) felt a little unnerving for me at least. Flight time 1.35 Capt absent from flight deck 15-20 mins ? I just wondered if anyone else had experienced anything like this interaction and I would be interested to see if this type of planned interaction is identified here on the forum as being more frequent / involved.

Globaliser

I think that what Oxon Flyer was wondering - and I have certainly been wondering - is whether the captain who came out with the iPad was not an operating crew member, so that when he was coming through the cabin there were still two pilots operating the aircraft.

'andad

Remember the flight where the winscreen was shattered and one of crew was 60% sucked out of the windscreen frame (it was the captain I assume as it was the left seat, not that it matters) ? How different that result would have been with only one flight crew in place, and pls don't tell me that at least he wouldn't have been sucked out if cruising the cabin. Other crew held on to him, still mostly outside the aircraft, to a safe landing. Frostbite, that's all, in this case.
After German Wings, why take the risk?

Globaliser

That is what people said after 11 September 2001 about locked flight deck doors.

Yet look at how many people have been killed since then by locked flight deck doors.

In fact, it's possible that the captain of the BA flight that you mention could have been an additional casualty of locked flight deck doors, because the person who hung on to him for most of the remainder of the flight was one of the cabin crew, who IIRC was able to get into the flight deck quite quickly. What would happen today? It's a matter of speculation, but I don't think that we can be sure that the "obvious" safety measure of locked flight deck doors would have contributed to that captain's safety.

DYKWIA

Yes, that was my thought. I've just got off an EasyJet flight where there were 2 captains and a FO.

LTN Phobia

Are you sure if it wasn't the third crew (training captain doing a route check or something, if not a positioning one or doing an observation flight?)?

ajamieson

If the captain in question thought it was appropriate, that's good enough for me.

My only issue with these chats is that its always the good CSMs/flight crew that take the time and never the ones that actually need some feedback.

'andad

A fair point, taken, re locked flight doors. But surely there is no such downside to having 2 crew on the flight deck at all times, albeit that one of them for a short time may have little idea of flying the aircraft ?

ahmetdouas

On a long flight (over 2 hours), things are much more relaxed so it is easy for a cockpit crew member to go for a walk or a chat when the plane is in cruise. If something comes up, the cockpit crew member can call the captain/first officer to return immediately, so no issue there.

When I had a jump-seat ride on a European airline, the Captain actually never left the cockpit, but the First Officer left the cockpit several times over the 4 hour flight. Each time he did so, he had to allow a member of the cabin crew in before he could leave. So he had to check if any were available by looking at the camera and checking to see if there were any cabin crew at the front galley. I think the policy differs per airline.

In fact I even remember a time where the Captain and Purser were having a 'heated discussion' in the cockpit over something and the First Officer was waiting outside in the front galley for like 10 minutes! When I tried to use the front galley bathroom, he told me to go to the one in the back!

Globaliser

IIRC, this has been discussed before (particularly in the aftermath of the 4U accident), and what was communicated by BA staff here was the conclusion that BA policy has been deliberately left as it is for good reason.