Raffles

Are you seriously - seriously - trying to tell me that in your opinion, a system which just happens to select (probably) the only ticket in the cabin which would not qualify for downgrade compensation is not a coincidence? Especially when there are plenty of solo passengers?

And the fact that no attempt is made to ask other passengers, especially those travelling solo, if they would be happy with £500 instead so this couple can travel together is not part of the same strategy?

It would have been 10 minutes work by someone in the call centre to call the, let's guess, 8 solo passengers in the cabin last night to try to find a volunteer.

SQ called me once to ask if I'd be happy to move my pre-booked F seat back by 1 row so a couple could be together!

Can I help you

BA has always overbooked by 1 if possible, can they not both be moved to another flight with two seats?

bigmerv

I think most of this debate is pointless as none of us can know the reasons why the pax was downgraded, and we have imperfect information which means that all we can do is guess - however, from a purely short-term economic perspective it would make sense for BA to take this approach, so @Raffles may well be proven right.

There are two things that are interesting about the current situation.

1. I am not sure that any claim would be limited to EU compensation, as there is an added commercial element relating to the 2-4-1 voucher and the customer's relationship with AMEX, and the fact it is a reward granted in the context of a regulated financial relationship adds extra spice! If I were bringing proceedings, I would sue both BA and AMEX, and throw in a complaint to the FCA or whoever it is that deals with these sorts of things.

2. If we really do want to find out the reasoning behind the downgrades, this would be revealed if a case were ever taken to court as BA would have to disclose it during the litigation process. For that reason, if it is true that FLY selects 2-4-1s as a priority downgrade, I would imagine BA would be very unwilling to let a case proceed to trial and would likely settle beforehand. Even if @Raffles is wrong about FLY, I doubt BA would want to let a case go to court and risk setting a precedent if they lose, or creating bad publicity even if they win. Nor would AMEX want this. The upshot being that if I ever found myself in this situation, and was not happy with the compensation offered (£500 would be fine for me on a JFK flight, not so much on one to SYD or if I was downgraded to W or Y), I would litigate.

Raffles

BA has settled all cases to date that I know of, albeit with gagging orders and albeit that these were settled out of court.

KARFA

I am not trying to tell you anything with regards to downgrade policy - I don't know exactly how BA does it but then neither do you.

I am trying to suggest if you are going to going around claiming FLY proactivley downgrades those on companion vouchers you should have proper proof to back it up. Your sample size is not statistically significant enough when compared to the dataset to come remotely close to sustaining your assertion. This is basic scientific methodology. You are letting a statistically insignificant sample size drive your hypothesis.

SK AAR

I certainly understand BA's take on this. For a "free ticket" there should be no EC 261/04 comp. and GBP 500 seem very generous in this situation.

It is beyond me why BA continues to accept AMEX 241 redemptions.

DYKWIA

It's like that now... but it used to be constantly stated on here that BA didn't oversell in F. If I had the Jerry Search Robot, I'm sure I could dig out lots of threads saying exactly that.

seat 13a

Absolutely.....

Tobias-UK

You really should limit your advice/assertions to areas where you have knowledge. This statement is misleading, your reader should take legal advice.

Gomac

That's a good point would there be a fixed delay/cancellation sum under E261 if they were moved onto a later flight, rather than have %sum of nothing. That's even more worrying BA are not willing to put you on to later flights with availability.

Bluebirdnick

As regards evidence for the conspiracy theory : how many times has the cardholder been downgraded, rather than the companion?

ahmetdouas

I really suspect BA doesn't want to pay compo.

I mean even me a lowly Blue in the good old days got cash for agreeing to take a JFK flight an hour later!

mrpacifist

I wonder how Amex will act facing the devaluation of this product. It is becoming more and more obvious. And customers won't be willing to pay a credit card for years to come if it continues to happen more and more frequently as awareness will spread. Anyway this is so disappointing.

corporate-wage-slave

If you go through Jerry's links, you will see:
- sometimes it's the Amex cardholder
- sometimes it's not the Amex cardholder
- sometimes it's the ranking status cardholder
- sometimes it's not the ranking status cardholder
- sometimes it's someone else in the group but not on the 2-4-1.

NoY

+1 ^^^