On-board Injury Advice
#32
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#33
Join Date: Sep 2012
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30,000 BA Avios whether priced at OPS value or BA's is clearly insufficient, and not something OP should accept, and OP should certainly never sign "in full and final settlement" letter that probably ('no doubt' in my expectation) comes with said offer. Trougble is to the UN-Informed 30,000 of anything seems like some big value when in reality offer is just value of circa $200-300
I am sure that the relevant team(s) within BA (or BA's insurers) know exactly what compensation would be due in court for such incident, but will not offer anything near that, unless you ask outright having first taken informed advice.
Interestingly the offer if in writing of 30k avios can be considered an omission of guilt and responsibility by BA in most instances. Having that initial offer gives you the basis to ask for something much fairer + higher in value.
Although "accidental" that should not affect any compensation due, and since such a rare occurence, you'd need legal advice about what is a fare + true value to place upon such injury as a lsrge headache, black-eyes for a few days.
....... It would help if you had some concrete ebidence of such injury(s), ie a)saw a doctor b)took photographs of your face just after iii)took further photos once brusing + black eyes materialised.
I don't know which country OP is from (Sweden ?), but most countries solicitor bodies tend to offer a special low(ish) fixed price advice initial short (30miniute) meeting with a general solicitor, who can advise if you have a claim etc, and on best way forward. Though such solicitors will try to offer to write a letter at extra costly fee, that having seen solicitor you can then write yourself.
I am sure that the relevant team(s) within BA (or BA's insurers) know exactly what compensation would be due in court for such incident, but will not offer anything near that, unless you ask outright having first taken informed advice.
Interestingly the offer if in writing of 30k avios can be considered an omission of guilt and responsibility by BA in most instances. Having that initial offer gives you the basis to ask for something much fairer + higher in value.
Although "accidental" that should not affect any compensation due, and since such a rare occurence, you'd need legal advice about what is a fare + true value to place upon such injury as a lsrge headache, black-eyes for a few days.
....... It would help if you had some concrete ebidence of such injury(s), ie a)saw a doctor b)took photographs of your face just after iii)took further photos once brusing + black eyes materialised.
I don't know which country OP is from (Sweden ?), but most countries solicitor bodies tend to offer a special low(ish) fixed price advice initial short (30miniute) meeting with a general solicitor, who can advise if you have a claim etc, and on best way forward. Though such solicitors will try to offer to write a letter at extra costly fee, that having seen solicitor you can then write yourself.
#34
Join Date: Jun 2013
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The thing that the doctors earn the big bucks to think about and exclude is the small possibility of a fracture at the base of the skull caused by a significant blow to the head. This can produce the classic "panda eyes" sign. I am sure that this was considered by the doctor that the OP consulted and as the professional in situ they were best placed to judge.
Either way it is a sign of a significant blow to the head. 30k Avios is a joke.
#35
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It probably could do with the OP clarifying a few points, but my thought was that the item fall made the passenger crash their head on the seat back in front, causing bruising to the face. Alternatively the item landed on the nose /forehead area. Some of us (certainly self included) bruise very easily, much to the occasional amusement of colleagues.
#36
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Glasses causing bruising when being hit by an object either on the glasses or elsewhere is also a possibility for black eyes.
It's hard to tell without further information how the black eyes were caused but it is not necessarily a sign of a substantial head injury. I've managed to get a black eye by being hit on the head by a piece of luggage a passenger was carrying during boarding on a BA flight, for instance, but it was because I happened to be wearing a pair of glasses and it sort of dug into my face, not because I suffered a fairly bad head injury.
I think a bit more information may be needed to see if 30,000 Avios is remotely reasonable or not. If it is a very transient injury, the stress of going through a claims process may not be worthwhile (particularly as 30,000 Avios, used cleverly, can be worth a lot more than what is likely to be won for a mild transient injury), whereas if there is a lasting issue, then 30,000 Avios would clearly be very inadequate.
One thing that the legal advice (at least generally) can't do is to advise the OP on the best use(s) for 30,000 Avios, so besides seeking legal advice (the advice to seek legal advice in itself is sound, of course), it may well be useful to assess the good use of Avios specifically for the OP, rather than giving it a general, average monetary value to it at 1p/Avios etc. You can get much, much better value than that, but it of course depends on the OP's travel patterns/plans etc. as to what value the OP can get from 30,000 Avios. Something we can truly help with, so that the OP can better assess the route he/she wishes to take.
It's hard to tell without further information how the black eyes were caused but it is not necessarily a sign of a substantial head injury. I've managed to get a black eye by being hit on the head by a piece of luggage a passenger was carrying during boarding on a BA flight, for instance, but it was because I happened to be wearing a pair of glasses and it sort of dug into my face, not because I suffered a fairly bad head injury.
I think a bit more information may be needed to see if 30,000 Avios is remotely reasonable or not. If it is a very transient injury, the stress of going through a claims process may not be worthwhile (particularly as 30,000 Avios, used cleverly, can be worth a lot more than what is likely to be won for a mild transient injury), whereas if there is a lasting issue, then 30,000 Avios would clearly be very inadequate.
One thing that the legal advice (at least generally) can't do is to advise the OP on the best use(s) for 30,000 Avios, so besides seeking legal advice (the advice to seek legal advice in itself is sound, of course), it may well be useful to assess the good use of Avios specifically for the OP, rather than giving it a general, average monetary value to it at 1p/Avios etc. You can get much, much better value than that, but it of course depends on the OP's travel patterns/plans etc. as to what value the OP can get from 30,000 Avios. Something we can truly help with, so that the OP can better assess the route he/she wishes to take.
Last edited by LTN Phobia; Aug 16, 2017 at 2:00 pm Reason: Typo + additional info
#38
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 877
Hi Bud,
As a claims manager, let me use some of my skills for once!
First question what have they stated the offer is as "good will" or "admission"? This is a important aspect, since no accident report was filled the question is was it in the flight log. Before you look at any settlement you need to consider has liability been conceeded as they accepted they were in the wrong or are they suggesting it was accident and act of god or no negligance.
Secondaly, how long did the injury last? The CJU has time scales and each injury has a different value. Additionally emotional termol etc. Have you had any flash backs or it affected any future flights?
Thirdly, what do you value Avios or Money? Depending on what you value more it will help advise.
Respond and I will assist and advise
As a claims manager, let me use some of my skills for once!
First question what have they stated the offer is as "good will" or "admission"? This is a important aspect, since no accident report was filled the question is was it in the flight log. Before you look at any settlement you need to consider has liability been conceeded as they accepted they were in the wrong or are they suggesting it was accident and act of god or no negligance.
Secondaly, how long did the injury last? The CJU has time scales and each injury has a different value. Additionally emotional termol etc. Have you had any flash backs or it affected any future flights?
Thirdly, what do you value Avios or Money? Depending on what you value more it will help advise.
Respond and I will assist and advise
#39
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 469
It think it's been explained above but just to add my opinion. There is a difference between an apology (also known as service recovery) for which Avios are an appropriate offer.
There is another category of refund which is for more serious failings to deliver a key part of a service.
Compensation is a whole different kettle of fish though and refers to compensating you for actual costs caused. So, as has been said above, did you have to pay for any of the doctor or medical bills? Did you miss work? Did you not do an activity that you had already pre-booked? On top of that there is the cost to yourself of the emotional impact of the incident and only you can decide what that is. You come across as a very reasonable person so I imagine you will not want to exaggerate it but then also don't underplay it as well.
From the initial report and if no costs were incurred then I would probably be happy with the offer as Avios are valuable to me (work pay for WT+, I get to fly CW) but as has also been said, a lot depends on your personal valuation of the amount.
There is another category of refund which is for more serious failings to deliver a key part of a service.
Compensation is a whole different kettle of fish though and refers to compensating you for actual costs caused. So, as has been said above, did you have to pay for any of the doctor or medical bills? Did you miss work? Did you not do an activity that you had already pre-booked? On top of that there is the cost to yourself of the emotional impact of the incident and only you can decide what that is. You come across as a very reasonable person so I imagine you will not want to exaggerate it but then also don't underplay it as well.
From the initial report and if no costs were incurred then I would probably be happy with the offer as Avios are valuable to me (work pay for WT+, I get to fly CW) but as has also been said, a lot depends on your personal valuation of the amount.
#40
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This is still compensation ,The person is being compensated for something that went wrong
#41
Join Date: Jan 2017
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Posts: 469
There's a nuance in the language and the use of language... Difficult to split the lines but I would put "compo" in a different camp to "my IFE didn't work" which is what I was trying to do here.
#42
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As far as the OP goes, only he is really in a position to decide whether the compensation offer for that event is something which he is happy to accept.
Last edited by Dave Noble; Aug 16, 2017 at 4:19 pm
#43
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 469
I think we agree... I do think there is a differentiation between "service recovery" = something you should have had and didn't and "compensation" which is for something bad that happened that incurred cost. But it's silly semantics!
#45
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Plymouth, UK
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Posts: 1,159
Sounds like BA are trying to palm the OP off with a better than normal Avios amount.
If it were me I'd refuse their offer of 30,000 Avios and wait until I was certain that there were not any unforeseen consequences. I'd fully document everything and also seek the advise of an injuries lawyer.
I suspect that even without further consequences (let's hope that there are none) the actual going rate for compensation for this kind of injury is considerably more than offered. I'd also want it in cash... why should I have to spend it with BA?
If it were me I'd refuse their offer of 30,000 Avios and wait until I was certain that there were not any unforeseen consequences. I'd fully document everything and also seek the advise of an injuries lawyer.
I suspect that even without further consequences (let's hope that there are none) the actual going rate for compensation for this kind of injury is considerably more than offered. I'd also want it in cash... why should I have to spend it with BA?