ahmetdouas

More and more people agree with you. That is why

"In 2016, Ryanair was both the largest European airline by scheduled passengers carried, and the busiest international airline by passenger numbers."[3]

Took that straight from Wikipedia!

ComputerCommuter

I flew back from Brno in the Czech Republic on Monday last week with Ryanair, my first trip with them in over 10yrs. I have to say IMHO there is now very little differentiating between the two from a EuroTraveller perspective other than interior and price. I picked up a Ryanair ticket for Ł9. Yes nine! Leg room is the same, BoB, 3+3 layout. Also keep in mind BA are about to "enhance" the seat pitch soon, making it worse than Ryanair. I'm not an advocate of MoL but If you can put up with boarding via stairs and an interior designed by some who is colour blind, then the rest is, on paper, much of a muchness

Arctic Troll

LTN is inconvenient from Central London because you have to get a shuttle bus from the railway station. It's a faff.

The convenience of STN depends on where you are in London. When I lived in Muswell Hill I could get to STN quicker than I could get to LHR, and cheaper too if I didn't want to slum it on the Piccadilly Line. Crossrail will change things, definitely, but right now LHR really isn't that convenient from the City or Docklands.

As for when I lived in leafy Hertforshire, LTN was a ten minute drive and LHR was a nightmare schlep around the M25.

As for the OP's question, whether you travel BA or on one of the LCCs depends on what boxes you want to tick. If I had a Silver or Gold BAEC card I'd probably stick with BA because of the benefits that comes with those cards.

I used to prefer BA because I didn't have to think, I got the snack and the G&T and I got an allocated seat rather than a gate scrum and I got the cabin crew who weren't just trying to sell things. I paid more but I got more.

But U2 and FR now have allocated seating, though you pay if you want to choose your allocated seat. BA make you pay to choose a seat and, whilst they swear blind theoretical seating preferences don't apply to HBO fares, coincidentally I now get the exact opposite seat on BA to the preference in my BAEC account. U2 charge less for a G&T than BA do, and FR provide much much nicer coffee.

I've not noticed horrific upselling with FR cabin crew. They come through the cabin with the trolley, and then with the duty free, but so do BA cabin crew now. Sure, BA don't sell scratchcards (yet!), but with headphones in it's not exactly a huge nuisance. The on-time fanfare is naff but then again so is the nauseating film BA show with the little girl who loses her teddy bear.

The only advantage with BA is their frequency; if a flight gets cancelled, they'll have another one in a few hours. The LCCs, at best, might only fly daily and, at worst, weekly.

I still think attempting to compete with LCCs on price alone is a foolish strategy. For point-to-point travel BA can't compete on price and most people don't care whether they fly from LHR or STN. And for connecting long haul traffic you just upset people who've paid Ł100s to be told it'll be another six quid if you want a drink on the short haul flight.

LiviLion

The horrible interiors are no-more on FR.

This is what is getting rolled out across the fleet at the moment:



Actual legroom (exit row) from last flight:

headingwest

As I noticed on my last 2 Ryanair flights. A pleasant surprise was the fact that the advertising on the overhead lockers has completely disappeared.

OK, if I want to fly around London a couple of times BA is great, but why pay extra ŁŁŁŁs for that privilage when you don't really need it!?

Arctic Troll

I never minded the yellow. Or the adverts on the locker doors.

The new seats are like ironing boards, though, they've enhanced all the padding away. Still, at least it gives me a bit more legroom.

navylad

Many thanks to the OP for another BA/LCC post.

May I ask why, when what is included in the price of your separate HBO fare that you purchased, if this didn't meet your needs, wants and desires, you didn't buy your ticket elsewhere? Is this because you would of had additional expense, time and inconvenience to transfer to a different airport? Is it because you didn't read what you were purchasing and skipped through the offer to select seats and purchase baggage? Because you have status and though after a long flight, you could have a nice bite to eat if you wanted in the lounge and as much drink as you wanted and wouldn't necessarily need another drink on a short flight?

Genuinely curious

Also would be great if the balance of fairness if you could let us know how much you paid for the HBO fare rather than quoting what you employer paid for a completely separate flight.

I don't really get the issue of pricing up a G&T separately personally given a lot of airlines and indeed decent bars seam to do the same, but then I don't drink so perhaps I"m missing something.

I've never flown FR, but do have friends that are current or former employees of them, in my mind at least, they really are not an ethical company (if you do fly them, feel free to gift a drink to your pilots- I understand they have to bring their own tea bag).

Tuggster

FR Flog scratch cards lol FR 1 BA 0

ahmetdouas

Just a note.
I booked an FR return last week, and paid 2 GBP each way for a pre-allocated window seat.
BA would have charged around 20 GBP each way. That's 10 times the price.

nivsy

Goodness, that actually looks smart when I think and compare with crumbs and stains on my last BA A320...and the CC actually complain about turnaround times not good for cleaning - compare that to RYR......

LiviLion

What like #BALowPayNoWay ?

FR CC looks not too bad and this page is quite honest:

http://become-cabincrew.com/airlines/ryanair.html

barnet

SAS do at least give you free tea and coffee and water. Anything else has to be paid for.

ukgooner

OK in that sprit let me run through some of your points.

Although in later posts you add in factors that would apply if you booked a through ticket, you started this on a point to point journey where you chose an HBO fare. And yes these do not come with a seat choice not the option to check a bag.

if these things are important - why not book the all inclusive fare which is only a little more? The HBO fares are clearly the lowest possible fare BA offer and if you want to buy on price alone then you forgo some of the extras. I like the way you think this is BA nickel-and-diming you - but isn't this your nickel-and-diming in your approach to flying?

Above all I don't think the way you buy a service automatically makes it the same as another service - the service itself is the differentiator as you go on to explore.

So at a price point thats now presumably palatable for you you give a grudging complement about the lounges, security etc. but say they would take it a away in a heartbeat - whats that all about? Does that fact technically something could be withdrawn make it of less value? And why is the food offering "terrible"? it might not be the best lounge experience in the world, but the food is certainly better than any Admirals club which you'd be more familiar, and is at least on a par with many in-airport restaurants depending on your taste (i do quite like Wagamama)

Moreover its a clear big differentiator in the product mix which the LCC dont try to compete with. This is all about the loyalty scheme - something you've overlooked as Ryanair don't offer such a feature.

Which you established just by walking through? You mean because it doesn't have big reclining chairs?

Im not going to go into CE here - plenty of threads do that - but it can be a very good value for money option if you value extra space (the middle seat free is nice right?); some nice meals and much more personal service than you can experience in an economy cabin

You're familiar for paying for alcohol in economy right? as you'd do that in the states. A big gripe appears to be the pricing so the fact they didn't display a price for the G&T together. But lets assume the price is what it is. Whats wrong with separate pricing? What would you do if you wanted two gins and one tonic. Or One Gin and two tonics? Im certainly not surprised by seeing the pricing for liquor and sodas separately - this isnt a cocktail bar.

Actually this was true just a few weeks ago - but times change. Except for sandwiches which were replaced with crisps longer ago. And as for the price you paid - who knows what the lowest prices are at the moment on that route. Maybe you bought exactly the same fare class ticket or perhaps you didn't. I imagine you paid quite a lot less in real terms given the US$ exchange rate, which is tough for an airline when many of its costs are in US$

Just because something is free doesn't make it desirable - and again, while BoB is a concept is shared by many airlines you have to look at the underlying choice and offer to compare. Otherwise It's like saying all supermarkets are the same because you have to pay for your groceries!

Still this is the most obvious and controversial of the changes, and I cede that many really do seem to have chosen BA on the basis of a free G&T on board.

Looking at your post in more detail I think you are not seeing the bigger picture at all. You've constructed a big picture for yourself, back combed the things that prove your point and dismissed or belittled the things that are unhelpful to your argument.

At the end of the day you had a premium airport experience, benefited form a loyalty scheme, still enjoyed complementary catering in the lounges, could have chosen a premium cabin for a relatively modest further cost - all things not offered by Ryanair. The way you buy some aspects of a flight (seat res, baggage charges, food and drink) may becoming more similar, but you still have to look in the round at the whole experience - including the range and quality of food on board, the BA people and their care (particularly when things go wrong).

If you genuinely don't value these differentiators (or see much quality in these differentiators) then of course you'd be crazy to spend more flying BA over Ryannair. Bit with a bit of forward planning you can fly BA in short haul economy for far less than you used to years ago- thats a fact. And if some of these measures help to ensure BA can still serve such an intensive short-haul network, then that has to be a good thing.

RockyRobin

The difference I suffered over the weekend on a return from STN to BTS was that the over wing aisle seats had the full arm rest on Ryanair which made it very cramped indeed. However I agree the onboard experience is the same as BA.

The gate experience (priority Q) system worked at both ends apart from the usual snide comments from people in the other queue...

The only hiccup was that I couldn't get the belt to fit on the way out and they wanted to move me out of the exit aisle. I quickly showed them my legs were too long to fit in the Standard seat. I thought I was going to be deplaned for being too tall...

Eventually I got the belt to fit just. Interestingly on the way back the belt fitted ok, now I will be reluctant to book Ryanair again.

navylad

It is quite honest; as it states

1. FR CC must bring their own food and drink (except they have the same liquid restrictions going through security so effectively have to either pay expensive prices in the airport or onboard if they wish to have a drink with their lunch.

2. FR CC have to pay for their own training, obviously the training company wish to make a profit on this as well and certainly isn't the best training in the industry (I'm sure we've all seen the inside documentaries where cheating in the CCA exams, not setting foot on a plane and training concentrated on sales technique rather than safety; but one can hope that they have since improved).

3. FR CC do not have the best working conditions in the industry- yes they are employed by a third party and their contract isn't necessarily in the country in which they are based, enabling reduction in employee protection.

4. FR can decide where to base you, and move you when they like, difficult if you wish to start a family or set down routes and buy a property for example.

5. What your career site also doesn't point out is the reports that FR can decide to put any CC on forced unpaid leave.

If you think that's not too bad, I'd hate to think what you thought was bad.