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The 2017 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261/2004

The 2017 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261/2004

Old May 27, 2017, 10:32 am
  #496  
 
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Originally Posted by greyguy1
Can someone please clarify if this outage is eligible?
From what has been said on the Sat 27 May main disruption thread, there are more than a couple of data pointers to a lightning strike or power disruption having affected a BA datacentre. Whether BA decide to argue that this was an act of god or not remains to be seen, it's probably too early to tell.
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Old May 27, 2017, 10:43 am
  #497  
 
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Originally Posted by RandomStan
I'm surprised no-one has yet posted on this thread today, given the complete meltdown at BA this Saturday!

Anyway - I couldn't find a straight answer, but how does EC261 apply to holidays booked via ba.com?

My family and I made two separate bookings for flights to Hong Kong, bundled with hotel rooms for our respective stays.

My mum and sister have their fingers crossed, and might hopefully be rebooked for travel tomorrow.

I will have to cancel, as my stay was only two nights, now reduced to one.

In terms of rebooking and/or outright cancellation, does EU261 still apply given the hotel element, and can we each claim a maximum of €600? Or do we forfeit this with a rebooking or cancellation?

Cheers for the info. Really bad timing - we were actually flying back for a family emergency, but I imagine people like myself and Bank Holiday-goers are more than a little p'eed off at the whole situation and near-complete lack of timely and useful updates...
Sorry to hear of your travel woes RandomStan

I'm not an expert, but it is my understanding that EU261 stands on its own with regard to the flight disruption so if you arrive later than the delay criteria in EU261 you should be due compensation even if you end up abandoning your trip - although be aware that there are some data points in the Sat 27 May disruption thread that BA are making some noises that the root cause it might be an "act of god" and hence compensation would not be automatically due. The BA Holidays T&Cs have the following Section 8:

8. Changes or cancellation by us
8.1. It is unlikely that we will have to change or cancel your booking. If we do make changes then we will inform the person who made the booking as soon as we reasonably can. We reserve the right to make changes that are not significant and to correct minor or obvious errors in your booking details at any time without liability to you.

8.2. We will take reasonable steps to avoid having to cancel your booking. In the unlikely event that we are to cancel your booking we will notify you and we will provide a full refund.

8.3. We are only liable to you for cancellations or significant changes to your booking by us. A significant change is one that we make to your booking before your departure that affects an essential term of your contract. Examples of a significant change includes changes by us to:

your destination area;
your booked accommodation to that of an alternative property of a lower rating;
your departure times or accommodation occupancy periods by more than 12 hours.
increase the package price by more than five per cent (in respect of a Package as defined in clause 1.4).

8.4. Where your booking includes accommodation and/or a flight please note that the following is not a significant change:

A change of rating for the accommodation where the quality of the accommodation has not changed significantly since the time of the booking and the facilities are substantially as set out on our website or equivalent;
A change in the accommodation where substitute accommodation is offered in a similar location and at least equivalent quality (at no additional cost to you);
A change in the particular type of room booked where the substitute room is of at least equivalent quality.
A change to your flight departure time(s) where the revised or substitute departure time is less than 12 hours difference to the departing time.

8.5. We are not liable to pay you compensation even for significant changes to your booking if Clause 11.3 applies.

8.6. If we make a significant change to your booking then, whether compensation is payable or not, you have a choice. You may:

accept the significant change; or
accept substitute arrangements of equivalent or superior quality if we are able to offer this to you; or
accept substitute arrangements of lower quality if we are able to offer this to you together with a refund of the difference in price between the original and the substitute arrangements; or
cancel your booking altogether, in which case we will process a refund in full of all money you have paid us for the booking within 7 days of your request.

8.7. You must tell us which one of the above choices (under Clause 8.6) you make within 7 days of being informed of the significant change we are making, or as soon as reasonably practicable if your departure is less than 7 days from the date you receive notification. If we do not receive notification from you about your choice you are deemed to have accepted the option in Clause 8.6(1) above.

8.8. Unless Clause 11.2 applies, you agree that if a significant change is made to your booking, whichever choice you make under Clause 8.6 above, we will only pay you for losses which may fairly and reasonably be considered as arising naturally (that is, according to the usual course of things) from the significant change we make.


I'm not sure if this helps, but finding the BA Holidays T&Cs is a bit of faff on the BA website.

Last edited by plunet; May 27, 2017 at 10:51 am
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Old May 27, 2017, 10:45 am
  #498  
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Originally Posted by greyguy1
Can someone please clarify if this outage is eligible?
It very likely will, but as yet we have no reliable information on the cause. Duty of care, certainly, compensation very likely. We will be updating here with more helpful information once the cause is known.
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Old May 27, 2017, 11:22 am
  #499  
 
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Originally Posted by plunet
I'm not sure if this helps, but finding the BA Holidays T&Cs is a bit of faff on the BA website.
Cheers, that's been a great help. Currently trying to find alternative arrangements in case BA can't rebook the rest of the family... I couldn't open my voucher and T&Cs earlier today - I think bits of the BA.com site were patchy earlier on...

That's half the battle - next is actually getting BA to refund and compensate! (Well, depending what today's outage was caused by - I'm sure BA will be doing everything possible to avoid compensating sooo many passengers who were due to travel today!)

Last edited by RandomStan; May 27, 2017 at 11:36 am
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Old May 27, 2017, 12:31 pm
  #500  
 
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Thanks for the above info. This trip was specifically planned for a meeting of friends from across the country. Not suitable to re-book as it was for tonight.
From previous experience how long might it be before we get the emails that DUB ground staff said would happen?
I take it that ba will not voluntarily let us know if compensation will be due under EU regs.
Thanks
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Old May 27, 2017, 12:37 pm
  #501  
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Originally Posted by Stormbel
Thanks for the above info. This trip was specifically planned for a meeting of friends from across the country. Not suitable to re-book as it was for tonight.
From previous experience how long might it be before we get the emails that DUB ground staff said would happen?
I take it that ba will not voluntarily let us know if compensation will be due under EU regs.
Thanks
According to the main discussion thread there is now some MMB functionality on BA.com so that is the place to go to to see if you can cancel your flights for a refund. You will also be able to submit a claim for EC261 compensation on BA.com - whether it qualifies for EC261 is yet to be established (I think it very likely) but there is nothing preventing you from claiming now.
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Old May 27, 2017, 12:57 pm
  #502  
 
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My flight to Pisa was cancelled today due to the IT chaos. I have managed to obtain a one way flight tomorrow with another airline as I did not want to risk a rebooking taking several days. I would welcome any advise on what next steps i should take/ compensation I should expect as i want to take my return flight with BA. My concern with asking for a refund is that i will not be able to take the return leg. Any advise would be gratefully recieved.
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:00 pm
  #503  
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EC 261/2004 will assure affected passengers both a "duty of care", e.g. hotel, food & local transport to the extent reasonably possible and the option of a full refund to the original form of payment without penalty or fees. Rescheduling as soon as possible or at a later date are also options.

Whether cancellation compensation will apply is fact-dependent and there has been no official determination of the cause. That cause and the reasonable measures available to prevent it will likely determine the result.

In a massive situation such as this, I suspect that BA will make a unitary decision and stick to it. If BA opts to simply pay, that takes time. If it asserts an extraordinary circumstance, this will not be case-by-case.
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:00 pm
  #504  
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Originally Posted by dgreen678
My flight to Pisa was cancelled today due to the IT chaos. I have managed to obtain a one way flight tomorrow with another airline as I did not want to risk a rebooking taking several days. I would welcome any advise on what next steps i should take/ compensation I should expect as i want to take my return flight with BA. My concern with asking for a refund is that i will not be able to take the return leg. Any advise would be gratefully recieved.
As it was BA who cancelled your outbound flight your return will not auto cancel. Contact BA in a day ore two and let them know you made your own arrangements to get to your destination and that you will be returning on the original flight.
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:27 pm
  #505  
 
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Originally Posted by Tobias-UK
As it was BA who cancelled your outbound flight your return will not auto cancel. Contact BA in a day ore two and let them know you made your own arrangements to get to your destination and that you will be returning on the original flight.
Many thanks Tobias-UK
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:32 pm
  #506  
 
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Our FCO-LHR was cancelled this evening.

Have a hotel etc. But no options to rebook etc... will they auto rebook me?
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:35 pm
  #507  
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Originally Posted by ABJ92
Our FCO-LHR was cancelled this evening.

Have a hotel etc. But no options to rebook etc... will they auto rebook me?
Keep checking, they may well allow online rebooking. Otherwise call up or go to FCO tomorrow. It is unlikely to auto rebook (this typically happens for advance cancellations, rather than previous ones).

I'll use this point to say that until we know the exact cause I don't know for sure whether this is EC261 eligible in terms of compensation (but it seems to be heading that way from what I can make out). Right to care will apply however for rebooking.
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Old May 27, 2017, 1:50 pm
  #508  
 
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Originally Posted by Tobias-UK
According to the main discussion thread there is now some MMB functionality on BA.com so that is the place to go to to see if you can cancel your flights for a refund. You will also be able to submit a claim for EC261 compensation on BA.com - whether it qualifies for EC261 is yet to be established (I think it very likely) but there is nothing preventing you from claiming now.
So I need to cancel my return flights? When I talked to the ground crew, and mentioned that a rebooking wasn't suitable she never mentioned the need to cancel my return trip.

*I have just had a look and the outbound trip looks just like it did before I got to the airport. Both sectors say that they cannot be cancelled online and prompts me to phone ba.

Last edited by Stormbel; May 27, 2017 at 1:55 pm
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Old May 27, 2017, 2:19 pm
  #509  
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Originally Posted by Stormbel
So I need to cancel my return flights? When I talked to the ground crew, and mentioned that a rebooking wasn't suitable she never mentioned the need to cancel my return trip.

*I have just had a look and the outbound trip looks just like it did before I got to the airport. Both sectors say that they cannot be cancelled online and prompts me to phone ba.
It looks like you will have to call, you will be entitled to a full refund or rebooking to a date in the future. You may be entitled to other compensation, watch this space.
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Old May 27, 2017, 2:34 pm
  #510  
 
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What I don' t understand is why BA is unwilling to re-book on any carrier in the passenger' s ticketed cabin. It should be up to the passengers to decide, not the airlines. I don't know if this ( and EU compensation) would cost BA much but it would just be one more cost of doing business. The argument that this increases fares is a false one too as BA competes with so many airlines that they wouldn't they wouldn' t dare increase fares for fear of loosing business.
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