Tricialac

Hi... thanks for your answer. Im just confused as from reading different threads and websites it seems I can only calculate distance from the first delayed flight which would be the LHR-MAD and allow me only 250 Euros. Obviously your number is much more attractive but where is your info from? Personal experience? I just want to make sure I get things right before I send off my letter. I assume you are calculating 600 Euros from YVR-EAS?

pinosan

Hello,

I believe you should try to go for the 600 € and, if necessary, refer to the Folkerts case (C-11/11) as authority for the proposition that, as regards connecting flights which are part of a single reservation, once that there is an eligible incident in a flight covered by the Regulation (no problem in your case), the amount of the compensation must be calculated from the first departure point up to the last arrival point.

In scenarios such as yours companies try to mix up the notion of entitlement with the amount of compensation.

It is true that Folkerts referred to a flight from the EU to a non-EU country, but -on the basis of equality of treatment- I see no reason not to treat the opposite scenario in a similar way. The inconvenience for the passenger is the same, and it depends on the whole duration of the journey.

You can even rely on the recent interpretative guidelines of the European Commission:
Good luck.

Swampz64

Would BA not argue they caused a 40 minute delay but cannot be resonsible for the subsequent ATC delay in getting the flight away?

OttoMH

A quick data point on the new 'enhanced' Avios alternatives from yesterday.

€250 or 25,000 Avios as BA Gold

vbroucek

I do not think that losing your assigned take off slot and then waiting for a new availability can be blamed on ATC. That's simply poor management, not ATC caused delay...

warakorn

I would like to inform you that I have escalated a claim against BA to a claim agency.

Arrival delay was 3 hours and 30 minutes. Ticket was PHL-LHR-MUC.
Cause: LHR-MUC plane went tech.
BA paid me EUR 250.
I demanded EUR 600.
BA refused again and again stating that only the shorthaul flight was delayed. My argument that I have purchased a ticket PHL-MUC was ignored.
The collection agency just wrote me that they've sued BA in German court for paying the rest (EUR 350).
Another (lower) court in Germany ruled against Lufthansa that the whole distance of the journey counts.
Let's see what happens next.

The airline of Alex Cruz deserves this.

If I won this case and got the money into my account, I'd escalate that matter further to the Civil Aviation Authority of the UK. In my eyes, the AOC of an airline should be revoked if it becomes clear that the only way to the rightful compensation is a court fight. You may laugh at me, calling me naive. But I will try it nonetheless. I have enough of these games by airlines. Honestly, I will lobby hard with my MEP that BA should loose all flying rights into the EU after March 2019.

SK AAR

You are kidding right?

Loose all EU flying rights? I bet then the repricocal will happen to EU carriers flying to UK.

warakorn

If I needed a visa to just visit the UK, I have no motivation to fly to there anymore. Loosing traffic rights to the UK -there are worse things that could happen to Air France, Lufthansa and Eurowings.
It could be a zero sum game, because BA cannot sipphon pax from EU airport anymore (flying to the US, for instance).

My company does business with UK suppliers. However, we can easily switch away from them.
When MP are saying that we would be put into the same queue like citizens from India, Indonesia and China -> then this indicates to me that Dutch, Finnish, German, French ... nationals need visa to enter the UK. That would be a strong incentive for many business people in the EU to not extend contracts to UK companies anymore.

Markmac43

corporate-wage-slave - Thanks for clarifying , will submit the claim(s) accordingly and see where we get. ^

hb133

I'm posting here as the flights were booked on BA tickets / numbers but outbound operated by QR. Booked from LHR - CMB recently. The flight from LHR arrived in time for the connection in Doha, however the DOH-CMB flight was delayed by over 3 hours, resulting in an arrival delay of 3 hours 30 minutes.

As it was booked as a straight (125 stock) ticket from LHR to CMB, I'm pursuing QR for €300 per passenger (based on a 3+ hour delay on a distance of more than 3,500km). We confirmed with Qatar staff that it was delayed due to a technical issue and therefore not extraordinary circumstances (every other flight departed on time...)

Now, if my connection had been missed (e.g. due to a late arrival on the LHR-DOH flight), I know this would be a clear case for compensation from looking at CAA / EU261 documents. However, I can't find anything anywhere regarding a delay on the second flight on a single ticket.

Any suggestions?

corporate-wage-slave

You will be unlikely to recover the money here, unless you take legal action or QR decides to be nice to you. Also I don't see the reason for the delay, which may also be relevant here. Essentially the CAA and others believe you should be covered, but Qatar, AA and a number of airlines do not agree, and won't normally pay out on second leg cases outwith Europe. The CAA is trying to take action against them on a "licence to operate" basis but this is a slow process. It's further complicated in that the EC261 ruling isn't totally clear on this in terms of wording for non Community carriers. Having said that, any case that got to appellate level I am nearly certain the court would say that if it was on one booking, the animus of the Regulation should apply throughout. AA at least tend to give a customer service gesture, Qatar isn't renown for being able to do this.

So by all means ask, but if you get a decline, your only option is MCOL, and even that isn't a definite path.

The 125 ticket isn't relevant here, it's only relevant if there is a cancellation or downgrade. So this is essentially a Qatar issue. When buying tickets for travel on non Community airlines, this factor is worth bearing in mind.

hb133

Thanks CWS - I edited to say it was for 'technical reasons'.

MCOL isn't that much hassle here and probably worth a shot but do I do that first or escalate to CAA prior to MCOL? For €600, it goes some way to compensating for a lost first afternoon on holiday...

corporate-wage-slave

Personally I doubt the CAA can do much to help. They will process your complaint to Qatar, but you first need to exhaust all remedies inside Qatar, then go to the CAA. MCOL would therefore be faster, but just to reiterate that it may not work in your favour here, there isn't a definitive entitlement here.

serfty

No it is not clear, being that there is a conflict between a binding High Court authority and a later, contradictory view from the CJEU in these types of cases (connection delays between EU and non EU carriers at a non EU port).

The CJEU held in Air France SA v 'Folkerts' that for the purposes of calculating compensation arrival at the claimant’s final destination should be used as the criteria. This was on the basis of the inconvenience of the delay was destination based, rather than at connecting port(s).

A little under two years beforehand in 'Sanghvi', the High Court, following 'Schenkel', determined that Regulation 261 was only concerned with individual flight components of any journey, and that the claimant’s second flight was outside the scope of Article 3.

There was another case 'Gahan', where the judge (using 'Folkerts') distinguished that both flights were of a Community Carrier and fell within the scope of Regulation 261.

Misco60

British Airways has failed to respond to my letter before action in respect of a cancelled flight on 23 March, and thus I am about to initiate a claim using MCOL.

I have a couple of questions about this process:

1. What address do I use for British Airways on the online claim form? (Is it just the PO Box 1126 address?)
2. How is British Airways made aware of the claim that I have made against them?

I've read (and re-read) this thread and its predecessors but couldn't find that information. Apologies if I've missed it - and feel free to point me in the direction of the thread where I can find it.

Is MCOL still the better course of action? Are there any benefits to using CEDR instead?

Thanks.