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Cancelled flight and 2nd flight delayed. EU 261 compensation twice or not?

Cancelled flight and 2nd flight delayed. EU 261 compensation twice or not?

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Old Dec 20, 16, 5:11 pm
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Cancelled flight and 2nd flight delayed. EU 261 compensation twice or not?

My friend was booked on a flight that was cancelled and joined a flight the next day.

The next day, boarded the plane and the flight did not take off till about 5 hours later.

What is the EU 261/2004 compensation expected here? Can one make a double claim? The flight number for the new flight was not the usual flight number.
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Old Dec 20, 16, 5:31 pm
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From what I understand, EU 261 is based on two paths;

- Denied Boarding
- Late Arrival (departure is irrelevant)

RE. Point 1. If your friend had a boarding pass and was denied boarding then thats the first payment

RE. Point 2. It took off 5 hours late, sure, but how late did it arrive? I believe that determines whether or not you get the second payment... .

[As an aside, I'm pretty sure BA will see this as one payment only given their history...]
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Old Dec 20, 16, 5:41 pm
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Not sure where "denied boarding" comes into this as nowhere is it remotely suggested that OP's friend was denied boarding.

OP's friend was on flight 1 which was cancelled and he was apparently rebooked (OP says "joined" but we will presume this to mean rebooked) onto flight 2 which departed 5 hours late (let us presume that it arrived 5 hours late as well).

EC 261/2004 looks at the time of arrival at the final ticketed destination as compared to the originally scheduled time of arrival. That is a readily calculated number of hours and depending on whether this was a Type I, II or III flight, compensation of somewhere up to EUR 600 is due. In addition, BA had a "duty of care" which would cover meals and perhaps a hotel if an overnight was involved.

If OP would care to provide the specifics, a specific answer could be provided.
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Old Dec 20, 16, 6:37 pm
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
If OP would care to provide the specifics, a specific answer could be provided.
An important specific is the reason for cancellation/delay. If it's fog, BA owes nothing (apart from duty of care expenses).
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Old Dec 20, 16, 6:39 pm
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Originally Posted by chimambu View Post
My friend was booked on a flight that was cancelled and joined a flight the next day.

The next day, boarded the plane and the flight did not take off till about 5 hours later.

What is the EU 261/2004 compensation expected here? Can one make a double claim? The flight number for the new flight was not the usual flight number.
No, there's no possibility of multiple claims.

Originally Posted by CountryKerry View Post

[As an aside, I'm pretty sure BA will see this as one payment only given their history...]
I'm pretty sure that BA will see this as one claim because that's how the legislation is written.

Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
That is a readily calculated number of hours and depending on whether this was a Type I, II or III flight, compensation of somewhere up to EUR 600 is due.
Assuming of course that the reasons for the cancellation and subsequent delay fall under the scope of the legislation.
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Old Dec 20, 16, 8:02 pm
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Originally Posted by chimambu View Post
M
The next day, boarded the plane and the flight did not take off till about 5 hours later.
.
Specific flight details are needed.

Delay in take off makes no matter as it is based on difference between scheduled and actual arrival times.

And again it depends on the reason for the delay.
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Old Dec 20, 16, 9:01 pm
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BA would probably consider the 5 hour delay to the 2nd day flight as a continuation of the delay to the first one. The OP mentioned that the flight number the next day wasn't the usual, which might mean 'BA123' became 'BA9123' or 'BA123P' and BA treat this as a 29 hour delay.
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Old Dec 20, 16, 10:57 pm
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Originally Posted by chimambu View Post
What is the EU 261/2004 compensation expected here? Can one make a double claim?
Assuming that both flights were delayed due to reasons within the airlines control (and not weather) then a double claim would be possible IF the passenger took a refund on the first cancelled flight and then purchased a new ticket on the new flight which was subsequently delayed. If the passenger was rebooked onto the alternate flight then there is only one delay from the original flight to the eventual arrival time
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Old Dec 20, 16, 11:09 pm
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Originally Posted by golfmad View Post
No, there's no possibility of multiple claims.



I'm pretty sure that BA will see this as one claim because that's how the legislation is written.



Assuming of course that the reasons for the cancellation and subsequent delay fall under the scope of the legislation.
There is nothing in the legislation that i have read that states that this would be one claim

The 1st claim is due to cancellation and rebooking
The 2nd claim is an unrelation claim due to a delay of the new booking

What does it state in the legislation that such a situation is a single instance?
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Old Dec 20, 16, 11:25 pm
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I am going to take a guess that flight 2 could fall under Article 3. 3
3. This Regulation shall not apply to passengers travelling free of charge or at a reduced fare not available directly or indirectly to the public.
Whilst passenger will have purchased a valid ticket for flight 1, they have not purchased a ticket for flight 2 and would have been invol rerouted
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Old Dec 20, 16, 11:49 pm
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Originally Posted by caz312 View Post
I am going to take a guess that flight 2 could fall under Article 3. 3
3. This Regulation shall not apply to passengers travelling free of charge or at a reduced fare not available directly or indirectly to the public.
Whilst passenger will have purchased a valid ticket for flight 1, they have not purchased a ticket for flight 2 and would have been invol rerouted
The passenger is not travelling free of charge since the passenger has paid for a ticket and has been rebooked onto that flight

If the airline gave a full refund to passenger for flight 1 when rebooking to flight 2, then indeed would be travelling on a free ticket
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Old Dec 21, 16, 2:36 am
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Hmm I had this happen once and did get compensated twice. So I was paid for the cancellation of the first flight and then paid for the delay of the 2nd flight. However, the flight I was rebooked on was a normally scheduled flight not a special flight number. It sounds like maybe all the passengers were put on a 'new' flight which was actually a continuation of the first one with a new number.
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Old Dec 21, 16, 3:50 am
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Veering slightly OT (but still related), I presume if downgraded and delayed you would get paid twice
- once would be a partial refund
- second would be compensation

(so technically not compensated twice)

just a random thought...
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Old Dec 21, 16, 8:57 am
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Sort of. But, remember that Downgrades are refunds and not compensation. If your flight is cancelled and you are then rebooked onto a subsequent service, but in a lower class, without getting into the vagaries of why the flight was cancelled, the passenger would have a cancellation compensation claim, the amount determined by distance (Type I, II or III). In addition, the passenger would be entitled to a refund of 75% of the ticket's segment cost.

This is, however, entirely different from the situation where the second flight is also cancelled. That is because EC 261/2004 bases compensation on a ticket and it looks only at the arrival time at the "final ticketed destination". Thus, whether you are ticketed on one flight which arrives 5 hours late or sequentially on 2 or 3 flights each are cancelled and you arrive 10 or 20 hours late, you are still only entitled to the compensation for the number of hours you are delayed at that destination.

Take the hypothetical of a passenger with a single ticket LHR-JFK. His flight is cancelled and he is rebooked for the same flight the next day. That flight arrives at JFK 5 hours late. Thus, the passenger arrives at his final ticketed destination, e.g. JFK, 31 hours late. Under EC 261/2004, the compensation for a flight of that distance is EUR 600. It is not EUR 1,200 because he suffered two delay/cancellations, but rather one delay of 31 hours at his final ticketed destination on one ticket.

Last edited by Often1; Dec 21, 16 at 10:34 am
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Old Dec 21, 16, 11:01 am
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From the foregoing, it appears as if it is just a 29 hour delay then and just one compensation due.

Had a text message about 4 hours before the first flight cancelling the flight and asked to come back the next day at same time. Had not checked in and therefore had no boarding pass for the original flight. The 2nd flight arrived 5 hours late.

Thanks for the responses.
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