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Cheap and Cheerful and Cheap and Miserable vs. Refined and Professional

Cheap and Cheerful and Cheap and Miserable vs. Refined and Professional

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Old Nov 30, 16, 6:47 pm
  #16  
 
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Originally Posted by Lite View Post
Now that the first week of the ab initio training course has been outsourced to a training agency and the course has been cut down from 41 to 25 days, good luck with that. They'll never merge any Fleets and the high turnover model has been lauded by Alex Cruz in Up to Speed, the BA internal staff magazine.
Interesting, especially given the recent trumpeting at Capital Markets Day about investment in premium cabin service training. Sadly, these days it's hard not to be cynical about any noises from BA management regarding genuine intention to improve the product. If you are able to say, what was Mr C lauding - the savings being made or was it an attempt to provide some encouragement to the MF crews?

My personal experience this year is that MF has not been specifically better or worse. I've had great, good, average and (occasionally) mediocre crews across MF, WW, EF, LGW and BACF. The only genuinely bad crew was in ET on one SH sector from LGW. My long haul flying is all J/F and when I've had MF it has been fine, different style to WW certainly but not overall worse. F sectors in the last week with both MF and WW were comparable in service, maybe even a slight edge to MF.
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Old Nov 30, 16, 8:27 pm
  #17  
 
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I find the lack of consistency, or consistent inconsistency in all classes of BA service to be all too common lately. My last few flights have been memorable for each leg being a 180 degree different experience from the other.

IAH-LHR CW - abysmal, LHR-IAH CW one of the best services I've ever had.
LAX-LHR CW - average at best, LHR-LAX WT+ exceptional.

Maybe I've set my expectations so low I'm just thrilled to get hot food, a cold drink and working IFE.
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Old Nov 30, 16, 11:51 pm
  #18  
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Old Dec 1, 16, 12:06 am
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by Greenpen View Post
Remember that the crew are there for your safety; serving stuff is very much a secondary function so need not be done well, if at all. Provided that they told you how to fasten the seat belt and blow your whistle all is fine.
Safety is there first responsibility, but they are also there for service as well. If they weren't BA would just put the minimum required crew on any flight and be done with it.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 1:25 am
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by Lite View Post
Now that the first week of the ab initio training course has been outsourced to a training agency and the course has been cut down from 41 to 25 days, good luck with that. They'll never merge any Fleets and the high turnover model has been lauded by Alex Cruz in Up to Speed, the BA internal staff magazine.

Does this training course include safety training or is it for service only?
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Old Dec 1, 16, 1:39 am
  #21  
 
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Originally Posted by DFB_london View Post
I'm afraid based on experience I could nt agree more. JFK crews mostly good. Mixed Fleet to S Africa generally inconsistent- a few good, a few positive and trying (but patently under trained for F service), some useless and rude.

When BA supposedly pays 12k basic it's no surprise. But don't expect punters to stump up for unpredictable service. There's got to a problem with total lack of training. Who'd have thought BA would do it on the cheap?
A bit like when Avis became a total sham... oh hang on where did the excellent Mr van den Post's replacement come from? Oh yes, the Avis muppet show...
Hey I actually like avis! The main reason I don't rent from them and rent from sixt instead is they have a bunch of rubbish Vauxhaulls and Fords I refuse to be seen in. But that is not the staff's fault!
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Old Dec 1, 16, 1:57 am
  #22  
 
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Funny, I had a brilliant flight LHR-SAN in F with MF (I assume)

Did you complain to the CSD?
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Old Dec 1, 16, 2:12 am
  #23  
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Originally Posted by ANstar View Post
Safety is there first responsibility, but they are also there for service as well. If they weren't BA would just put the minimum required crew on any flight and be done with it.
Several crew members commented that on short-haul, staffing is at the legal minimum already.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 2:30 am
  #24  
 
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The evident lack of experience brings back all too vividly my first few weeks as a waiter in a top hotel in my home town. Asked by guests at one table for the salt & pepper I was so nervous I said I'd go to the kitchen and try and find some, to which one of them just leaned over to the next table and helped themselves. There were no other guests in the restaurant and I felt so stupid! Oh, and let's not even talk about the time when I was given the VIP table to attend to at a company Christmas party because I was the only waiter who was English. I managed to set fire to the table and knock a glass of wine into one of their laps! Being keen I really wanted to do well and tried my best, but the lack of nerves and experience were all too telling...needless to say I didn't stay long!

As for BA, with management keen to get rid of their long-serving staff on old contracts as quickly as possible, it's hardly surprising that you'll be seeing a lot more crew members like this in the First cabin. As one BA employee said on another thread, the passengers will moan at first, but they'll soon get used to it!

Paying less for employees and training will ultimately mean more profits, which falls in line with WW and his 'show me the f'ing money' mindset.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 2:48 am
  #25  
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Originally Posted by headingwest View Post
As one BA employee said on another thread, the passengers will moan at first, but they'll soon get used to it!
By definition, the ones that stay are the ones who "get used to it". It does not follow from this that everybody gets used to it. Some go elsewhere.

Paying less for employees and training will ultimately mean more profits.
Not necessarily. If the lower level of quality of service results in some customers going elsewhere and/or affects your ability to charge as much or more as other carriers, then it is not necessarily the case that the ultimate outcome, other than in the short term, is higher profits. It depends on the balance between what you lose, if anything, and what you save.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 3:01 am
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by headingwest View Post
I managed to set fire to the table...


Paying less for employees and training will ultimately mean more profits, which falls in line with WW and his 'show me the f'ing money' mindset.
Only if the customers keep showing their f'ing money. There comes a tipping point; it seems that more and more regulars are abandoning ship.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 3:04 am
  #27  
 
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I've had some real Mixed Fleet shockers.

Don't want to roll the dice anymore.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 3:06 am
  #28  
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Not to stir the pot, and not that I wholly agree with the OP (albeit it does sound like the flights were poor), but...

We know BA crew are now all joining as MF, and naturally WW numbers are decreasing, so...

Why continue to fly with BA?

The usual answer is that their crew are better than any other airline - even if the Seat, IFE, F&B, etc are not as good.

M
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Old Dec 1, 16, 3:14 am
  #29  
 
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I've found 99% of all BA crews to be exactly the same. Follow the same pattern from boarding to landing and nothing outside of the bare minimum.

Other OW airlines have at least recognised my status at some point even if the majority of the flight remains the same.
This may not matter to some but it does in a small way make me feel welcomed and that can go a long way.
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Old Dec 1, 16, 3:16 am
  #30  
 
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Originally Posted by OttoMH View Post
Did you complain to the CSD?
Completely invisible. What's the point? If they don't even care to check that their staff are ok what hope to we have as passengers.

Oh, fill in a 'constructive feedback' form and get a completely useless reply from CS. I don't give a hoot about avios or compensation, so honestly what's the point if nobody listens? Instead of wasting my time waiting any longer I just went to sleep.

As someone who travels point-to-point on schedule alone, no matter what the airline, I'm not going to put my money where my mouth is, I always have and always will choose on convenience.

If I ever get the impression again that my side of the cabin is completely not up to the job, and I don't feel safe then you will not see me for dust.
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