Dec 13, 2016, 11:12 pm
Last edit by: NWIFlyer
Routes to/from LGW*/LCY/STN are NOT affected. Only flights to/from LHR* are potentially affected. If you think you may be affected, post 2714 (click here) may be helpful.
*The LGW-JFK flight has seen a lot of cancellations for the current strike period.
Current strike period:
Next announced strike period:
Previous strike periods:
Routes affected:
As a possible indication, for the fifth strike period BA announced the following cancellations:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/27910044-post2131.html as well as flights to and from Doha on all affected days (17 - 20 February).
Mixed fleet routes are listed here, though note that other (non Mixed Fleet) flights from Heathrow are also being cancelled.
Note for context in terms of how many routes might actually be affected: there are about 4000 members of MF (of which ~2,700 are Unite members and therefore eligible to take industrial action) and 15,000 total cabin crew
Background Details from BA:
Strike 19th July-1st August
2nd August-16th August
Background Details from Unite:
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...ty-pay-levels/
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...refuses-talks/
Latest negotiating position:
Talks at ACAS in June appear to have failed, with a further two week strike commencing 1st July announced on 16th June.
Key upcoming dates:
Ballot results for industrial action:
*The LGW-JFK flight has seen a lot of cancellations for the current strike period.
Current strike period:
- None
Next announced strike period:
Previous strike periods:
- 25th December 2016 from 00:01 for 48 hours. (Strike action was suspended following ACAS discussions and revised offer.)
- 10th & 11th January 2017
- 19th January 2017 for 72 hours until 21st January
- 5th-7th & 9th-11th February 2017
- 17th-20th February 2017
- 22nd-25th February 2017
- 3rd-9th March 2017
- 16th-19th June 2017 (suspended pending further ACAS talks)
- 1st-16th July 2017
- 19th July-1st August 2017
- 2nd-15th August 2017
- 16th-30th August 2017
Routes affected:
As a possible indication, for the fifth strike period BA announced the following cancellations:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/27910044-post2131.html as well as flights to and from Doha on all affected days (17 - 20 February).
Mixed fleet routes are listed here, though note that other (non Mixed Fleet) flights from Heathrow are also being cancelled.
Note for context in terms of how many routes might actually be affected: there are about 4000 members of MF (of which ~2,700 are Unite members and therefore eligible to take industrial action) and 15,000 total cabin crew
Background Details from BA:
Strike 19th July-1st August
2nd August-16th August
Background Details from Unite:
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...ty-pay-levels/
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/br...refuses-talks/
Latest negotiating position:
Talks at ACAS in June appear to have failed, with a further two week strike commencing 1st July announced on 16th June.
Key upcoming dates:
- Latest negotiated position (@ 23rd Oct 2017) between BA & Unite to be balloted. Rumoured that the union is recommending acceptance.
Ballot results for industrial action:
- First ballot, November 2016: Yes 79.5%, No 20.5%
- Second ballot, December 2016: Yes 70%, No 30%
- Third ballot, March 2017: Yes 56%, No 44%, turnout 72%
BA 'Mixed Fleet' cabin crew dispute [agreement reached]
Feb 13, 2017, 7:14 am
#2101
Community Director
Join Date: Jan 2009
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I think it's pointless to quote regulations as it seems our laws can be ignored by Judges who can quote "Human rights" and make up their own (as in the case of Pimlico Plumbers V an alleged self employed person who magically became an employee when it suited him). There seems to be more and more grey areas in laws these days with conflicting legislation (ie Human Rights V employment law) being used with Judges deciding rather than Parliament and it needs sorting out.
In the specific case of MF fleet, I have no idea if Unite has any plans to challenge BA's withdrawal of bonus payments for 2016, but if they did it would need the independent judiciary to decide if what BA had done was lawful, given I have no doubt Barristers could present any number of counter arguments depending which part of law they chose to rely on.
Feb 14, 2017, 5:50 am
#2102
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Ancaster, ON, Canada
Programs: BA Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 487
Sorry to bring this back to the practicalities, but I thought I read that BA were publishing their contingency plan today? I haven't seen anything. I am flying to MCO from LGW on Friday, so I think I'm highly likely to be affected.
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
Feb 14, 2017, 5:52 am
#2103
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Switzerland / Estonia
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Posts: 6,525
Sorry to bring this back to the practicalities, but I thought I read that BA were publishing their contingency plan today? I haven't seen anything. I am flying to MCO from LGW on Friday, so I think I'm highly likely to be affected.
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
Feb 14, 2017, 5:52 am
#2105
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
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Posts: 42,878
Sorry to bring this back to the practicalities, but I thought I read that BA were publishing their contingency plan today? I haven't seen anything. I am flying to MCO from LGW on Friday, so I think I'm highly likely to be affected.
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
Also LGW routes are not affected, only LHR and only MF routes. Based on that I really wouldn't be concerned with your MCO-LGW flight.
Feb 14, 2017, 5:57 am
#2106
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Ancaster, ON, Canada
Programs: BA Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 487
Feb 14, 2017, 5:58 am
#2107
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Peterborough, UK
Programs: BA Silver; IHG Spire; Avis P+; Global Entry
Posts: 1,505
Sorry to bring this back to the practicalities, but I thought I read that BA were publishing their contingency plan today? I haven't seen anything. I am flying to MCO from LGW on Friday, so I think I'm highly likely to be affected.
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
I can't be late for a meeting the next day but I could travel the day before. Would BA switch me to a flight the day before at no cost? I'm a GCH in CW......
EDIT: KARFA got there first
Feb 14, 2017, 7:57 am
#2108
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Brexile in ADB
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Posts: 7,067
I think it's pointless to quote regulations as it seems our laws can be ignored by Judges who can quote "Human rights" and make up their own (as in the case of Pimlico Plumbers V an alleged self employed person who magically became an employee when it suited him). There seems to be more and more grey areas in laws these days with conflicting legislation (ie Human Rights V employment law) being used with Judges deciding rather than Parliament and it needs sorting out.
As has been mentioned before on this thread, Pimlico Plumbers or any other business does not have to be in business, no one is holding a gun to their head. If they find UK law to be too onerous perhaps they should shut up shop or move abroad, I am sure there will be plenty of other companies willing to take their place....
Feb 14, 2017, 8:09 am
#2109
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
Posts: 17,007
I think it's pointless to quote regulations as it seems our laws can be ignored by Judges who can quote "Human rights" and make up their own (as in the case of Pimlico Plumbers V an alleged self employed person who magically became an employee when it suited him). There seems to be more and more grey areas in laws these days with conflicting legislation (ie Human Rights V employment law) being used with Judges deciding rather than Parliament and it needs sorting out.
Parliament specifically required the courts to consider this matter by creating a distinction between employees and workers.
There was no mention of any human rights law. I think you may be thinking about a different case?
Feb 14, 2017, 9:15 am
#2111
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Feb 14, 2017, 9:23 am
#2112
Join Date: Oct 2008
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 883
What is the end game to resolve this dispute?
It it seems that as long as the strikes have no major impact on the day to day operation, that BA have no incentive to improve their offer to the MF crew.
With BA not having an incentive to improve their offer, at what point do continued strikes and loss of earnings impact the MF crew to the point where they return to work without an improved offer from BA?
How do MF crew therefore get an improved offer from BA when there is no incentive for the other side to engage?
It it seems that as long as the strikes have no major impact on the day to day operation, that BA have no incentive to improve their offer to the MF crew.
With BA not having an incentive to improve their offer, at what point do continued strikes and loss of earnings impact the MF crew to the point where they return to work without an improved offer from BA?
How do MF crew therefore get an improved offer from BA when there is no incentive for the other side to engage?
Feb 14, 2017, 9:25 am
#2113
Join Date: May 2016
Location: London
Programs: BA Gold, Accor Gold
Posts: 1,427
I flew on Friday (strike) night on a MF route to Basel.
Didn't notice any difference (apart from a gorgeous young lady manning the boarding gate desk, not in BA uniform) and we left only 5 mins late and the CE service was as normal.
Didn't notice any difference (apart from a gorgeous young lady manning the boarding gate desk, not in BA uniform) and we left only 5 mins late and the CE service was as normal.
Feb 14, 2017, 9:39 am
#2114
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2002
Programs: Mucci des Hommes Magiques et Magnifiques
Posts: 19,066
What is the end game to resolve this dispute?
It it seems that as long as the strikes have no major impact on the day to day operation, that BA have no incentive to improve their offer to the MF crew.
With BA not having an incentive to improve their offer, at what point do continued strikes and loss of earnings impact the MF crew to the point where they return to work without an improved offer from BA?
How do MF crew therefore get an improved offer from BA when there is no incentive for the other side to engage?
It it seems that as long as the strikes have no major impact on the day to day operation, that BA have no incentive to improve their offer to the MF crew.
With BA not having an incentive to improve their offer, at what point do continued strikes and loss of earnings impact the MF crew to the point where they return to work without an improved offer from BA?
How do MF crew therefore get an improved offer from BA when there is no incentive for the other side to engage?
Feb 14, 2017, 9:45 am
#2115
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: UK
Programs: Lemonia. Best Greek ever.
Posts: 2,266
Never.....
One of the best known corporate negotiators of the 1970s, the General manager of a very large UK Corporate, always said that he would never allow a strike to happen unless he knew how to get the strikers back to work. Even Jack Jones admired this person.
That Co had a few strikes in those crazy days, but kept itself out of the papers, and always knew how to get the strikers back to work.
However, I'm not sure that BA has negotiators of this calibre, and if they did, s/he would not stay as Willy takes a very personal interest in this stuff, and has had a habit of interfering..
That Co had a few strikes in those crazy days, but kept itself out of the papers, and always knew how to get the strikers back to work.
However, I'm not sure that BA has negotiators of this calibre, and if they did, s/he would not stay as Willy takes a very personal interest in this stuff, and has had a habit of interfering..
