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Club Europe to be introduced on UK domestic flights [launches 01 April 2017]

Club Europe to be introduced on UK domestic flights [launches 01 April 2017]

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Old Mar 31, 17, 6:50 pm   -   Wikipost
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Club Europe and EuroTraveller will be launched on UK domestic routes on 01 April 2017.

What does this mean for those of us with existing bookings for travel from April onwards?
  • If your ticket was booked into J, C, D, R, I, or U fare classes, you will travel in the CE cabin and will enjoy lounge access plus the usual fast track benefits and special meal options that come with CE.
  • If your ticket was booked into the Y bucket, you will be rebooked for free into J (Club Europe) and the above benefits will apply. This should happen automatically well in advance of travel. If your ticket was not issued by BA, you should contact the issuing airline to make sure this change is properly processed.
  • If your ticket was booked into B, H, K, M, L, V, N, Q, O, S, G fare classes, you will travel in the ET cabin and all elements of the airport and cabin experience will the same as before.
  • If your ticket was booked into the X fare bucket (economy class redemption), then you will travel in the ET cabin above. However, if this was part of a longhaul club or first ticket, it may be possible to be rebooked for free into the U (Club Europe) bucket. You will have to call BA to accomplish this change.

Earning Avios and Tier Points
  • Q, O, and G class will earn 125 Avios and 5 TP per sector (no change)
  • K, L, M, N, S, and V class will earn 250 Avios and 10 TP per sector (no change)
  • Y*, B, and H class will earn 500 Avios and 20 TP per sector (no change)
  • R and I class will earn 750 Avios and 40 TP per sector
  • J, C, and D class will earn 1250 Avios and 40 TP per sector.
* Existing Y class bookings are expected to be moved to J and will earn the higher Avios rate.

Spending Avios
  • X will be the redemption class for EuroTraveller
  • U will be the redemption class for Club Europe
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Old Dec 29, 16, 11:14 pm
  #151  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: glasgow, scotland
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Forgive me if this has been covered already, but have we considered the impact of 'Domestic Club' on capacity???

GLA/EDI to LHR and VV often run very full, even with an A321 hence the 767 was introduced to meet capacity, but these are going very soon.

Given that GLA/ABZ/EDI flights may run with a huge club cabin, with a high number of F/J transfer pax and full fare ticket holders, would this not translate as a bit of a disaster if all the middle seats fly empty/blocked?

Particularly, for all the Scottish BA cabin crew/flight crew who struggle to find space to commute to work on the shuttles already, especially after the demise of BMI
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Old Dec 30, 16, 12:43 am
  #152  
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Originally Posted by flyingscotsman View Post
Forgive me if this has been covered already, but have we considered the impact of 'Domestic Club' on capacity???
I am quite sure one of the more persuasive factors as to why introducing Club Europe is it allows BA to figuratively play the sides against the middle, as already happens for flights to the mainland, JER and DUB. So by moving the curtain BA can raise fares, particularly close to departure time, by the standard supply versus demand manipulation.

Now in theory the loss of seats could be quite small. Even on flights that look completely full there could easily be a few empty seats at the back, so with just 3 rows of CE this would just amount to moving the seats to the front. But as you say, staff standby, at peak time, is going to be tricky. GLA and EDI shouldn't be so bad, there is always LGW and LCY, and there are so many off peak services that staff will just have to wait a few hours, but that can't be said of ABZ, NCL and MAN, and the latter has a lot of staff travel.

On the other hand, at the moment these are the flights that are most impacted by excess hand baggage during winter months, so another view is that by introducing Club Europe BA is reducing the passenger load to something more balanced for the aircraft's configuration.
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Old Dec 30, 16, 12:47 am
  #153  
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I was just thinking that the densification of A320/321 also helps increasing capacity. This of course would not only apply for busy domestic flights, but shorthaul in general.
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Old Dec 30, 16, 12:57 pm
  #154  
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Originally Posted by navylad View Post
Do we think the MAN-BRE flights will also go to 2 tier?
Originally Posted by Worcester View Post
Don't know for sure but this is run by Sun Air as a franchise and as such is not part of Cruz's writ. They run their own business and make their own decisions, if they have not offered a Club Europe yet I doubt this will change things.
I agree. Sun-Air of Scandinavia paint their planes and crew in BA colours, use the Executive Club to win some corporate contracts, use BA to publish their fares and schedules, and other than that, do their own thing. They don't even provide feed to BA mainline. It is quite a weird relationship really, it seems to be the airline equivalent of sharing a wardrobe with someone you don't really know and hardly ever see.

I don't believe that Sun-Air or Comair plan to introduce buy on board either.

In fact I don't really know Sun-Air pretend to be BA, and perhaps the relationship will be strained if Cruz wants more money out of them in exchange for the reduced-value brand he will now provide.

Originally Posted by flyingscotsman View Post
Given that GLA/ABZ/EDI flights may run with a huge club cabin, with a high number of F/J transfer pax and full fare ticket holders, would this not translate as a bit of a disaster if all the middle seats fly empty/blocked?
It's not a disaster for BA as long as they get more money... you know the BA motto of course.
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Old Dec 30, 16, 3:07 pm
  #155  
 
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Originally Posted by corporate-wage-slave View Post
See a similar answer in post 132 above, it may be you currently have the A321 midhaul aircraft and as a Silver you aren't getting further forward at the moment. The aircraft could well change before then anyway, if the service fills up it's not the most efficient aircraft for this service.
Thanks to both Tobias-UK and C-W-S ... 'confused no more
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Old Dec 31, 16, 8:30 am
  #156  
 
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Lounges are going to suffer as a result.

Not sure it's a great idea for 45min flights.

Useful for TP runs though.
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Old Dec 31, 16, 8:38 am
  #157  
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Originally Posted by mmxbreaks View Post
Lounges are going to suffer as a result.

Not sure it's a great idea for 45min flights.

Useful for TP runs though.
You can already get 20 TPs on domestic flights when in booking classes J, Y, C, D, R, or I so I am not sure why this change is going to make any difference to the current state of play.

Why would a Club Europe cabin on domestic flights have much impact on lounge usage?
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Old Dec 31, 16, 9:43 am
  #158  
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Originally Posted by mmxbreaks View Post
Lounges are going to suffer as a result.

Not sure it's a great idea for 45min flights.

Useful for TP runs though.
There might be fewer people in the lounges as I would imagine the Y bucket would cease to qualify for access.

CE works well enough on LGW-JER or LHR-BRU so don't see why longer flights like LHR-INV or LHR-EDI should go without.
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Old Dec 31, 16, 1:29 pm
  #159  
 
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Well all the original shuttle routes were badged as class of service 'C' irrespective of fare paid or booking class, and this still appears on the boarding pass, it is just that the onboard service and crew staffing levels have dropped.
Back in the day Club did not have an empty middle seat either....
some B757s ( Belvoir Castle was one) were adapted for shuttle flights with an extra 20 seats or so compared to regular 757s - There was no problem serving 185 hot breakfasts or hot evening meals back in the day.....
A lot has changed since then of course but I do wonder about the potential loss of capacity.....
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Old Dec 31, 16, 1:37 pm
  #160  
 
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Will it definitely happen?

Maybe they're waiting to see if they get lots of complaints from Club and First connectors about having to pay for drinks. If they don't, happy days, leave it as it is.
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Old Dec 31, 16, 1:40 pm
  #161  
 
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Originally Posted by MarkFlies View Post
Will it definitely happen?

Maybe they're waiting to see if they get lots of complaints from Club and First connectors about having to pay for drinks. If they don't, happy days, leave it as it is.
Last I heard was they had told shareholders they were going to do. I have seen comments on here that it's due in march, so sounds definite (until proven not to work and quietly reversed).
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Old Dec 31, 16, 1:57 pm
  #162  
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From the 2016 shareholders meeting:
Alex Cruz: In Club, as I was mentioning to you before, we are not just investing in Club World, as I was saying, but we are going to reintroduce Club in domestic flights. We believe that there is an opportunity to serve many of our customers which today are either point to point from Heathrow but also connecting on longer-haul flight. We will be reintroducing Club class in domestic flights next year.
Subsequent questions:
Alexia Dogani (Goldman Sachs): Thank you. I also had three questions. Just firstly, I am interested in the comments Alex made about their investment in Club in the domestic BA network. I remember a couple of years ago, I think Willie you said that you felt that there was a bit of structural change in the premium cabin in Europe. Do you still feel the same?
[...]

Willie Walsh: Okay. It is like premium short-haul. It was funny. Again, I was looking at the slide there is that we are going to extend Club Europe to UK Domestic. I thought that is funny we have a note to leave Europe and we are going to take the UK Domestic market Club Europe. We are going to call it Club Brexit or something like that.

I do not think I was wrong. The levels of demand for the premium product in short-haul are structurally lower than it was historically. I do not whether it has bottomed out. It has probably recovered a little from where it went to. You got to remember though that there is a big difference in the yield we are getting to what we historically got. It is not just the combination. It is the combination of the demand and the yield. There is still definitely a case which is what I have always felt for BA to retain that product. That has been proven. We have said that overtime. I think with Aer Lingus when I was there, it was not a decision that I took when I was at Aer Lingus to remove the premium short-haul product. It was clear that the trends in Ireland were very different and that the demand was going to disappear.

I don’t know, Stephen, whether you want to comment on that from an Aer Lingus point of view. I think BA, because of the market of which it operates at Heathrow, there will always be sufficient demand to justify the product. The volumes that we have seen, they are much more price sensitive than it would have been historically. Therefore, it is not something that there is going to be huge investment in.

Stephen Kavanagh: [Here I believe speaking about Aer Lingus] Just to confirm that, we do not have that level of absolute demand that justified the reinstatement of a cabin, but what we are looking is something that Vueling has done with the seat free in the first number of rows. It is a proxy for a cabin but without for us the complexity or the cost, and the yield expectations are moderate in that regards. I think it is a case of cutting one’s cloth. What is appropriate for BA is obviously a different demand environment in the London market. I can see, obviously, with flow onto long-haul services, consistency in business product, is of real value. That is just not appropriate for the Aer Lingus market. We are looking to differentiate and segment just in different ways.
The transcript is at the following memorable URI: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/External...55959849748487

Last edited by Calchas; Dec 31, 16 at 2:04 pm
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Old Dec 31, 16, 6:20 pm
  #163  
 
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wasnt the staff ratio in the 'good old days' of full 757's and 767's serving hot mesls and drinks to everyone higher then?
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Old Dec 31, 16, 9:22 pm
  #164  
 
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Yes. As posted by me earlier, the crew numbers have come down.
Think it was seven crew on a 757 (185 seats ish max) -now four on an A320
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Old Jan 4, 17, 9:12 am
  #165  
 
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Hi Everyone,

I'm curious as to what might happen in my scenario, and wondered what your thoughts were - I am looking to book a flight from EDI to LHR at the beginning of April and have the option of either paying cash or avios on the preferred flight. I have just done a dummy booking and it looks like a mid-haul a321 has been rostered as the front CW cabin is available to me to select seats. This would be nice as I would be travelling with someone for who a proper business class style seat would be something that they would not normally experience. My concern though is that if I book and select the seats now, and BA subsequently introduce Domestic CE before the flight, will we be booted out? Would method of payment have any affect on this? I am pondering that any introduction wouldn't happen before Easter as it doesn't give them very long to market the new service etc and to get punters sucked in? Any thoughts?

Cheers

Sheppy
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