New Route Announcement: LGW-OAK Oakland, California, starting March 28, 2017
#61
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: London, UK
Programs: Not much these days: BA Silver, Bonvoy Lifetime Gold, HH Gold
Posts: 1,323
Well I'm booked for next Sept on Avios. Had been thinking about a West Coast trip, exploring Oregon and N Cal so this is better located than SFO. Neither of us are Gold any more so hoping the new Gatwick S lounge is at least as good as T5 Galleries Club. But OAK is particularly well located for what we want to do, although I wouldn't think twice about it for a trip to SF city.
OAK - Montgomery St BART is 37 minutes, SFO - Montgomery St BART is 30. Given OAK is a quieter airport, maybe it'll be quicker through there and that would even out...
OAK - Montgomery St BART is 37 minutes, SFO - Montgomery St BART is 30. Given OAK is a quieter airport, maybe it'll be quicker through there and that would even out...
#63
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: New York
Programs: BA, LH, VS, Hyatt, SPG
Posts: 3,813
Curious to know the thinking behind this move, and the launch of FLL, which I suspect has been driven by months of analysis by IAG of Norwegian's business model and performance across all of its markets (and more announcements by IAG airlines are no doubt likely to come).
Choosing routes like FLL and OAK which were only operated by DY from LON obviously limits DY's ability to set prices in the market.
But at the same time, I would have thought the real competitive threat from DY is when they start going to 2+ daily flights to major gateways like BOS and JFK and then they can start going for corporate contracts and will no doubt tailor their offer accordingly.
Choosing routes like FLL and OAK which were only operated by DY from LON obviously limits DY's ability to set prices in the market.
But at the same time, I would have thought the real competitive threat from DY is when they start going to 2+ daily flights to major gateways like BOS and JFK and then they can start going for corporate contracts and will no doubt tailor their offer accordingly.
#64
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
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I would really be surprised. OAK is a nice enough airport but it is San Francisco for all practical purposes. That's why I'm personally a bit puzzled by the "triple bill" of LHR-SFO, LHR-SJC, and LGW-OAK. Unless BA are planning to reduce capacity on LHR-SFO, where even in the winter season they are on two daily, I'm not entirely certain there is the market for all those seats, especially with the competition from UA and DL/VS on LHR-SFO and DY on LGW-OAK. Maybe i'm underestimating the potential, but I just don't see it.
#66
Join Date: May 2007
Location: London, UK
Programs: BA Gold, AA EXP
Posts: 1,140
This doesn't seem much like a new route when BA flies to SFO and SJC just minutes away.
And we're hardly being spoilt here with another route on a clapped-out three-class B777 ex-LGW. As for the FLL/MIA routes, here I'd also rather fly to one of the other airports.
And we're hardly being spoilt here with another route on a clapped-out three-class B777 ex-LGW. As for the FLL/MIA routes, here I'd also rather fly to one of the other airports.
#67
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: London, UK
Programs: BA Gold4life, ICH RA, Hyatt Gold and others
Posts: 693
I would really be surprised. OAK is a nice enough airport but it is San Francisco for all practical purposes. That's why I'm personally a bit puzzled by the "triple bill" of LHR-SFO, LHR-SJC, and LGW-OAK. Unless BA are planning to reduce capacity on LHR-SFO, where even in the winter season they are on two daily, I'm not entirely certain there is the market for all those seats, especially with the competition from UA and DL/VS on LHR-SFO and DY on LGW-OAK. Maybe i'm underestimating the potential, but I just don't see it.
#68
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: London, UK
Programs: BA Gold4life, ICH RA, Hyatt Gold and others
Posts: 693
But why are they trying to take market share from Norwegian? They cant compete on price on any route in any class and the target customer seems very different between the two airlines.
Or is this about undercutting and losing money on routes until competitors give up and move out? I cant see Norwegian giving up anytime soon their cost base must be extremely low to be able to consistently offer such low fares.
What other US destinations do Norwegian serve that BA dont?
Or is this about undercutting and losing money on routes until competitors give up and move out? I cant see Norwegian giving up anytime soon their cost base must be extremely low to be able to consistently offer such low fares.
What other US destinations do Norwegian serve that BA dont?
Of course if they do compete many here will accuse them of being uncompetitive....because they are competing to put a rival out of business presumably. But that argument works both ways!!
The lesson of EZ at LGW is clear to see. LGW is orange now, not after a war but after BA refused to fight (it didn't have the balance sheet at the time, but its a much stronger carrier now and with a vicious cyclical downturn heading our way, it needs to reassert itself in its 2 chosen markets: LHR premium, and LGW Premium Leisure). And just look at the fares EZ can command outside of the few promotional lead in offers. They can be dearer than club Europe of you do a comparison.
So even a dominant LCC can abuse its position!
#69
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#70
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I would really be surprised. OAK is a nice enough airport but it is San Francisco for all practical purposes. That's why I'm personally a bit puzzled by the "triple bill" of LHR-SFO, LHR-SJC, and LGW-OAK. Unless BA are planning to reduce capacity on LHR-SFO, where even in the winter season they are on two daily, I'm not entirely certain there is the market for all those seats, especially with the competition from UA and DL/VS on LHR-SFO and DY on LGW-OAK. Maybe i'm underestimating the potential, but I just don't see it.
There's little land in the peninsula, and the economic expansion has been centered around SF and Oakland, which results in housing expansion in the East Bay.
BA may be a little bit ahead of themselves with this, but there is a strategic element to it as well.
There are about 7 million people in the Bay Area, and OAK is the closest and most convenient airport to more than 2.5 million of them.
#71
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: USA
Programs: BA Silver
Posts: 812
I absolutely do not hate BA. Check through my posts and you'll see that I rate BA crews really, really highly.
I think the hard and soft products in business are poor but I think with 3-3-3 on the 777 in WT is pretty decent.
I try and fly J if I can and will fly EY, EK, QR, SQ, QF, AA and RJ before BA but in M/Y I would fly BA before nearly all of them.
No-one would be happier than me to see BA up their game in J (and come to Charlotte)
I think the hard and soft products in business are poor but I think with 3-3-3 on the 777 in WT is pretty decent.
I try and fly J if I can and will fly EY, EK, QR, SQ, QF, AA and RJ before BA but in M/Y I would fly BA before nearly all of them.
No-one would be happier than me to see BA up their game in J (and come to Charlotte)
Last edited by capin; Nov 2, 2016 at 9:36 am
#74
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Arizona
Programs: BA (GGL G4L), AA (Gold), HH (Diamond); Marriott (Gold)
Posts: 3,011
There's a new terminal scheduled to open soon with a contract lounge that BA will likely use. It's interesting that both MSY and OAK were chosen at times when they're about to open a new terminal, though MSY won't open their new terminal for another year or so iirc.
#75
Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Francisco, where else?
Programs: EXP,EX-CK 2.5mm, now lifetime Platinum, ex-UA1K, Marriott- Platinum, Hertz 5*
Posts: 989
Thanks for the response! I just googled that and can't find mention of a new terminal which would be huge news here in the bay area. I'm going to try out BA's new flight next fall so hoping they have something besides folding chairs and water by then.....