Sep 29, 2016, 2:55 am
Last edit by: Aus_Mal
This thread is for opinions on the concept of Buy on Board, concerned with the rights or wrongs of the decision to introduce it.
An information thread exists for your questions, particularly if they are on factual matters, here:
Buy on board: Information guide for BA shorthaul economy services
There is a separate thread for experiences, anecdotes, reactions and related comments, which is to be found here:
Buy on board: Experiences and reactions from BA's shorthaul economy services
Useful sub-links
chongcao posted a comparison of other oneworld airlines' BOB prices
Not happy about these changes?
If you have an existing booking, you may be able to complain and get 1000 Avios or cancel for free until 28 days before departure. BA's complaint form.
However, in November 2016, phone calls to BA indicated that "no refunds would be given as food & drinks were complimentary and not part of the T&C."
An information thread exists for your questions, particularly if they are on factual matters, here:
Buy on board: Information guide for BA shorthaul economy services
There is a separate thread for experiences, anecdotes, reactions and related comments, which is to be found here:
Buy on board: Experiences and reactions from BA's shorthaul economy services
Useful sub-links
chongcao posted a comparison of other oneworld airlines' BOB prices
Not happy about these changes?
If you have an existing booking, you may be able to complain and get 1000 Avios or cancel for free until 28 days before departure. BA's complaint form.
However, in November 2016, phone calls to BA indicated that "no refunds would be given as food & drinks were complimentary and not part of the T&C."
Buy on board: Implemented on BA short haul - opinions on the concept
Oct 9, 2016, 3:39 am
#1426
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 63,714
Was just on a Cathay Pacific flight from Hong Kong to Bangkok... 3 hour flight, full meal with a hot roll (all delicious might I add!), nice strong cutlery, two glasses of wine and tea to finish. A lovely seat with lots of leg room too. Blows BA out of the water, especially considering this is "short haul"
On BA the cheapest return fare is Ł91, though Ł120 is probably a fairer and easier to obtain comparison fare. In Club Europe it's Ł400 return and that's widely available.
On Cathay the cheapest return fare is Ł570 in economy and in business class it's Ł1400!
Oct 9, 2016, 3:40 am
#1427
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
In practice I suspect they will be able to operate flights to all remaining EU member states because it is EU policy that new air service agreements with non-EU countries allow all EU airlines to fly to/from all EU countries. UK domestics might be a real problem.
Not a good time to spend any money at all on re-branding LGW shorthaul if it turns out to be wasted by 2019.
Oct 9, 2016, 4:42 am
#1428
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
Posts: 17,007
In practice I suspect they will be able to operate flights to all remaining EU member states because it is EU policy that new air service agreements with non-EU countries allow all EU airlines to fly to/from all EU countries. UK domestics might be a real problem.
Not a good time to spend any money at all on re-branding LGW shorthaul if it turns out to be wasted by 2019.
Not a good time to spend any money at all on re-branding LGW shorthaul if it turns out to be wasted by 2019.
Oct 9, 2016, 5:01 am
#1429
Join Date: Aug 2016
Programs: BAEC - Lowly blue
Posts: 282
Yes and it has the pricing to match it. You have chosen a good example here of why this development is happening. HKG to BKK is about the same distance as LHR-LIS. Both routes have a lot of competition on them, probably more so on the BKK route. Plenty of services to choose from too on both airlines.
On BA the cheapest return fare is Ł91, though Ł120 is probably a fairer and easier to obtain comparison fare. In Club Europe it's Ł400 return and that's widely available.
On Cathay the cheapest return fare is Ł570 in economy and in business class it's Ł1400!
On BA the cheapest return fare is Ł91, though Ł120 is probably a fairer and easier to obtain comparison fare. In Club Europe it's Ł400 return and that's widely available.
On Cathay the cheapest return fare is Ł570 in economy and in business class it's Ł1400!
Oct 9, 2016, 5:09 am
#1430
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Skywards (enhanced Blue !), Oman Air Sindbad Gold
Posts: 6,394
Yes and it has the pricing to match it. You have chosen a good example here of why this development is happening. HKG to BKK is about the same distance as LHR-LIS. Both routes have a lot of competition on them, probably more so on the BKK route. Plenty of services to choose from too on both airlines.
On BA the cheapest return fare is Ł91, though Ł120 is probably a fairer and easier to obtain comparison fare. In Club Europe it's Ł400 return and that's widely available.
On Cathay the cheapest return fare is Ł570 in economy and in business class it's Ł1400!
On BA the cheapest return fare is Ł91, though Ł120 is probably a fairer and easier to obtain comparison fare. In Club Europe it's Ł400 return and that's widely available.
On Cathay the cheapest return fare is Ł570 in economy and in business class it's Ł1400!
Let me say straight off that I'm very, very nervous about contradicting this post, given the esteem in which I hold its author (and you will know I really mean that, c-w-s, in the light of our very enjoyable chat at the MIA lounge this past August
)I flew the HKG-BKK sector myself with CX earlier this year - and although I used a mix of cash + Avios to pay, I don't remember them being priced at anything like the example fares quoted here.
So with an eye to my next need to fly this same route, I have just checked out fares for likely dates in February of next year, and they come out like this :
Lowest economy return (books as O class) is HKD1862 inc taxes
Lowest business return (books as D class) is HKD6162 inc taxes
Using CX's own currency conversion chart, these equate to Ł198 and Ł658 sterling respectively.
Given how dramatically different these are from the figures quoted by c-w-s .... have I by chance got things horribly wrong
I have my hands ready to hold up if so !
PS I did my pricing on CX official site.
Oct 9, 2016, 5:15 am
#1431
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: BAEC Silver, IHG Diamond
Posts: 7,733
I find CX rather expensive for internal Asian flights.
Last time I was out there, Air Asia and Jetstar were doing economy flights with luggage etc. for Ł50-Ł60 compared to CX at over Ł400 for the same route.
I definitely wouldn't consider them unless I was using Avios and even then, probably for business rather than economy (unless circumstances dictated otherwise).
Last time I was out there, Air Asia and Jetstar were doing economy flights with luggage etc. for Ł50-Ł60 compared to CX at over Ł400 for the same route.
I definitely wouldn't consider them unless I was using Avios and even then, probably for business rather than economy (unless circumstances dictated otherwise).
Oct 9, 2016, 5:19 am
#1432
Fontaine d'honneur du Flyertalk
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Morbihan, France
Programs: Reine des Muccis de Pucci; Foreign Elitist (according to others)
Posts: 19,161
Thats a reasonable position take but BA does not offer LCC fares. I have just looked at both easy jet and Ryan air web sites and they are offering fares from Ł15.99 to Ł34.99 on their respective landing pages. Clearly these are capacity constrained but at these levels I don't have an issue with baggage fees and buying food.
BA if you look hard enough can offer Ł35 to AMS but it takes 5 clicks to find that this fare is from LGW and the cheapest from LHR is Ł55. baggage fees are extra
I suspect there would be far less chatter about this if BA had done two things.
1. Not used the word upgrade when describing the change
2. Offered BAEC Silver and Gold complimentary tea /coffee and perhaps a drink.
Service recovery seems to suggest they recognise internally the balls up they made of this.
BA if you look hard enough can offer Ł35 to AMS but it takes 5 clicks to find that this fare is from LGW and the cheapest from LHR is Ł55. baggage fees are extra
I suspect there would be far less chatter about this if BA had done two things.
1. Not used the word upgrade when describing the change
2. Offered BAEC Silver and Gold complimentary tea /coffee and perhaps a drink.
Service recovery seems to suggest they recognise internally the balls up they made of this.
What i am trying to say is that this could be a nine-day wonder. If no one buys, then they'll give up. I have seen it all before. Who else remembers that when CE came along there was nothing offered whatsoever on Paris or Amsterdam - all the crew worked Club. On longer flights ET collected their meals on the way into the aircraft. Lasted no time at all - it was inoperative. can you imagine two crew members on a busy AMS managing to serve everyone and take their cards? No one seems to to have thought of the practical product delivery side. They rely on the pricing that not a lot will be bought - but when they do there is always trouble.
The other thing that one must remember is that not one Low Cost (with the possible exceptions of those operating flights for Iberia or Lufthansa fly out of Heathrow).
What is clear is that nothing seems to have stirred people up more than this change - I just hope that they all complain to the airline rather than just here.
Oct 9, 2016, 5:19 am
#1433
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 63,714
However my core point still stands, Cathay - and Asian legacy carriers generally - charge a lot more for their service than European legacy airlines.
Oct 9, 2016, 5:44 am
#1434
Join Date: Sep 2013
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Skywards (enhanced Blue !), Oman Air Sindbad Gold
Posts: 6,394
Fair enough c-w-s.
And yes, Asian legacy carriers can be pretty pricey for regional sectors.
Likewise Qantas on (some) domestics. Earlier this year I flew MEL-PER and was astonished to find that their lowest biz class return was coming out at over AUD2000. In the event I redeemed EK Skywards miles (although that wasn't exactly cheap either, at 76K miles). The positive was that QF's claim that their newly-configured A330's offer the best biz seat on any domestic route did - IMO - stand up (or should be that be lie-flat ......:- to scrutiny.
Anyway, think I must be well off-topic by now, apologies.
And yes, Asian legacy carriers can be pretty pricey for regional sectors.
Likewise Qantas on (some) domestics. Earlier this year I flew MEL-PER and was astonished to find that their lowest biz class return was coming out at over AUD2000. In the event I redeemed EK Skywards miles (although that wasn't exactly cheap either, at 76K miles). The positive was that QF's claim that their newly-configured A330's offer the best biz seat on any domestic route did - IMO - stand up (or should be that be lie-flat ......:-
to scrutiny.Anyway, think I must be well off-topic by now, apologies.
Oct 9, 2016, 1:53 pm
#1435
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: London, Strathaven
Programs: BA (Gold). Various other statuses
Posts: 1,466
This evening we landed at a London airport after a short haul flight (details withheld to protect all involved). As we were waiting to disembark we were chatting to the crew and the question of BOB came up. The SCC asked us what, as Gold Card holders (they obviously knew who we were), we felt about it. We advised that we had already switched many of our shorthaul flights next year to easyJet. She wasn't surprised and started to say how she was not looking forward to the prospect. Unfortunately the ground crew knocked at the door and we were unable to find out more. I wonder what other crew think about it?
Oct 9, 2016, 6:58 pm
#1436
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: ORD
Programs: US Air, UA BA LH AI DELTA MARRIOTT CHOICE SGP
Posts: 9,883
Right - let me make myself quite clear. I dislike this move more than I can say. It is like watching a relative of whom one is fond moving from a nice house to a council flat on a sink estate.
What i am trying to say is that this could be a nine-day wonder. If no one buys, then they'll give up. I have seen it all before. Who else remembers that when CE came along there was nothing offered whatsoever on Paris or Amsterdam - all the crew worked Club. On longer flights ET collected their meals on the way into the aircraft. Lasted no time at all - it was inoperative. can you imagine two crew members on a busy AMS managing to serve everyone and take their cards? No one seems to to have thought of the practical product delivery side. They rely on the pricing that not a lot will be bought - but when they do there is always trouble.
The other thing that one must remember is that not one Low Cost (with the possible exceptions of those operating flights for Iberia or Lufthansa fly out of Heathrow).
What is clear is that nothing seems to have stirred people up more than this change - I just hope that they all complain to the airline rather than just here.
What i am trying to say is that this could be a nine-day wonder. If no one buys, then they'll give up. I have seen it all before. Who else remembers that when CE came along there was nothing offered whatsoever on Paris or Amsterdam - all the crew worked Club. On longer flights ET collected their meals on the way into the aircraft. Lasted no time at all - it was inoperative. can you imagine two crew members on a busy AMS managing to serve everyone and take their cards? No one seems to to have thought of the practical product delivery side. They rely on the pricing that not a lot will be bought - but when they do there is always trouble.
The other thing that one must remember is that not one Low Cost (with the possible exceptions of those operating flights for Iberia or Lufthansa fly out of Heathrow).
What is clear is that nothing seems to have stirred people up more than this change - I just hope that they all complain to the airline rather than just here.
Oct 9, 2016, 8:12 pm
#1437
Join Date: Aug 2013
Programs: BA Silver, Velocity Gold
Posts: 329
Fair enough c-w-s.
And yes, Asian legacy carriers can be pretty pricey for regional sectors.
Likewise Qantas on (some) domestics. Earlier this year I flew MEL-PER and was astonished to find that their lowest biz class return was coming out at over AUD2000. In the event I redeemed EK Skywards miles (although that wasn't exactly cheap either, at 76K miles). The positive was that QF's claim that their newly-configured A330's offer the best biz seat on any domestic route did - IMO - stand up (or should be that be lie-flat ......:- to scrutiny.
Anyway, think I must be well off-topic by now, apologies.
And yes, Asian legacy carriers can be pretty pricey for regional sectors.
Likewise Qantas on (some) domestics. Earlier this year I flew MEL-PER and was astonished to find that their lowest biz class return was coming out at over AUD2000. In the event I redeemed EK Skywards miles (although that wasn't exactly cheap either, at 76K miles). The positive was that QF's claim that their newly-configured A330's offer the best biz seat on any domestic route did - IMO - stand up (or should be that be lie-flat ......:-
to scrutiny.Anyway, think I must be well off-topic by now, apologies.
Oct 10, 2016, 1:59 am
#1438
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 1,173
I've just had my last flight with free BA SH catering, PRG - LHR and was treated to a biscuit, despite usually getting a single wrap (Band 2 I think)....
Have moved all my revenue bookings to other airlines, so will now only being flying on Avios redemptions.
Have moved all my revenue bookings to other airlines, so will now only being flying on Avios redemptions.
Oct 10, 2016, 4:48 am
#1439
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: London UK
Programs: BAEC Silver,, Oman Air Gold
Posts: 747
I got the reply, today, to my letter to Mr Cruz about the recent changes. Interestingly, it came by email not by post which saves BA 55p I suppose. None of my specific points were addressed and it was just the cut and paste sections which others have replied to.
I visited my godson in Worcester this weekend who is getting married in January in Austria and I had to explain to him that not only would he not get free champagne when travelling out to MUC, he would have to pay for his drinks on BA from now on. He's a reasonably frequent leisure flyer but wasn't aware of the changes. His reactions was interesting: "BA can't do that - if we'd known that we would have gone with Easyjet".
And so it begins...!
I visited my godson in Worcester this weekend who is getting married in January in Austria and I had to explain to him that not only would he not get free champagne when travelling out to MUC, he would have to pay for his drinks on BA from now on. He's a reasonably frequent leisure flyer but wasn't aware of the changes. His reactions was interesting: "BA can't do that - if we'd known that we would have gone with Easyjet".
And so it begins...!
Oct 10, 2016, 4:57 am
#1440
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold; Flying Blue Life Platinum; LH Sen.; Hilton Diamond; Kemal Kebabs Prized Customer
Posts: 63,714
But champagne isn't available in ET now? It's for CE passengers and lounge users, neither of which is changing. He will have a new option to buy champagne in ET after the changes, however.
