WW says BA may purchase 2nd-hand Airbus A380s

Old Jan 18, 16, 4:45 am
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WW says BA may purchase 2nd-hand Airbus A380s and Boeing 777-300ERs

- British Airways may purchase five to six 2nd hand Airbus A380s, and separately, Boeing 777-300ERs, says Willie Walsh.
- Iberia could jointly operate A380. Oil price low enough to extend life of A340s at IB.
- Won't exercise existing options, too expensive, in a blow to Airbus. Could BA take Malaysia Airlines' spare RR-powered A380s? TG and SQ also have surplus A380s.
- WW regrets not taking Boeing 777-300ERs sooner.
- WW says BA "very interested" in returning to IKA, Tehran

Full report by aviation journal Leeham News has more interesting news including on Boeing 777-300ERs.

Walsh gave the example of IAG’s aircraft fleets where he announced that it is looking to lease five to six used Airbus A380 in addition to the ones that British Airways (BA) already have on order. These could be aircraft for BA only use but also for a joint BA and IBERIA operation...So the A380 works extremely well for us and we are prepared to increase our fleet beyond the 12 we are planning to get. We will then do something unusual for BA, we will go for used aircraft and lease them. It shows how BA has changed; we are prepared to adapt to a changing market and to take opportunities that come our way.
Another opportunity we also look at is leasing 777-300ERs. We brought the 777-300ER late into our fleet, to late actually. It is a very effective and flexible aircraft. We now see that we could need more and once again we are prepared to lease these. Again something that the old BA would not do.
A final example of how we react to changes in the market is the question of the A340-600 in IBERIA’s fleet. These are really good aircraft for IBERIA’s South American destinations. But it is not a great aircraft with fuel at $120 a barrel. At $60 or below it is a very attractive aircraft, so while we might have planned to replace it at a certain time previously we now see no reason to look into changing that aircraft as long as the fuel price stays at the present low levels.
- One of the few possible candidates is Malaysia Airlines' fairly new going-spare six A380s because they are also powered by Rolls Royce engines. BA/IAG will clearly want a consistent operational fleet and engines to match. MAB seems likely to shift very cheaply.

- SIA has 5 early-build A380s powered by RR up for disposal. Unlikely to be taken by BA, if this CAPA report is to be believed - fuel performance for SIA is poor among these early builds. TG keen to axe 6 RR-powered A380s (first delivered in 2012). EK earliest A380s also unlikely to interest BA because the early models are also powered by rival Engine Alliance.

Last edited by SinoBritAsia; Jan 18, 16 at 6:49 am
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Old Jan 18, 16, 4:47 am
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Good news
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Old Jan 18, 16, 4:49 am
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Interesting!

I head this rumour from some crew on a Christmas flight, but put it down to galley chat as WW had apparently been on the record previously saying 12 A380's would be the limit!
Perhaps even BA are noticing the A380 affect which Singapore & Emirates have mentioned - whereby pax go out of their way to try and fly them?

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Old Jan 18, 16, 4:56 am
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Won't be surprised if that's just part of re-negotiating the options - with "cheap" second-hand A380s available in the market, and no new orders in quite some time now, Airbus should be willing to re-open discussions on pricing.
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Old Jan 18, 16, 4:58 am
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I've noticed some days in the W16 schedule, BA are down to one 777 a day to LAX - a big drop from the daily double A380!
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Old Jan 18, 16, 4:58 am
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Mrs Gaxxy always gets excited about the forward upper CW cabin on the a380. I'll take it over a 777 over-wing vibrating dorm!

Edit: I think Mec72 also raises a very valid point!
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:00 am
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A fleet of six aircraft of the same type is not going to have the same cost efficiency as a larger fleet. There are a very limited market for second hand A380s and MH with it's difficulties may not be in a great bargaining position. BA might get a very good deal out of it.

Interesting that WW has stated categorically that the A380 is over priced at the current deal. Airbus don't seem to have covered their costs on the program, I wonder then if the muted extended A380 is not going to happen.
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:02 am
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Originally Posted by mec72 View Post
Won't be surprised if that's just part of re-negotiating the options - with "cheap" second-hand A380s available in the market, and no new orders in quite some time now, Airbus should be willing to re-open discussions on pricing.
+1. Seems logical.
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:03 am
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Originally Posted by Worcester View Post
Interesting that WW has stated categorically that the A380 is over priced at the current deal. Airbus don't seem to have covered their costs on the program, I wonder then if the muted extended A380 is not going to happen.
Yes, it's been very quiet on that front.
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:10 am
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Originally Posted by mec72 View Post
Won't be surprised if that's just part of re-negotiating the options - with "cheap" second-hand A380s available in the market, and no new orders in quite some time now, Airbus should be willing to re-open discussions on pricing.
I agree. I cannot really see BA flying second hand!
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:13 am
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I always think it's instructive to look at the leasing firms. As far as I am aware, Amedeo is the only lessor to place orders for A380s (20, the first of which is due to be delivered this year), but it cannot find any potential customers. It even has a glossy page on its website peddling them - http://www.amedeo.aero/a380/

Unfortunately for Airbus, the A380 seems like a plane that only makes sense for a handful of airlines - at its current price at least. But BA is obviously a prime candidate with its slot constraints. Would BA lease? I am not sure of IAG's strategy on leasing v buying.
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:14 am
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WW says BA may purchase 2nd-hand Airbus A380s

Why not?
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:16 am
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Originally Posted by mec72 View Post
Won't be surprised if that's just part of re-negotiating the options - with "cheap" second-hand A380s available in the market, and no new orders in quite some time now, Airbus should be willing to re-open discussions on pricing.
Maybe it could be a plan to take both! Like take the MAB planes for cheap and make the poor oneworld friend even more alive and cash-fluid to feed its KUL flights, and get discounts from Airbus to take more or even shift the never-appearing last 8 QF A380s to BA on the cheap!
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:17 am
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Originally Posted by mikeyfly View Post
I've noticed some days in the W16 schedule, BA are down to one 777 a day to LAX - a big drop from the daily double A380!
Is that the two days at Thanksgiving?
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Old Jan 18, 16, 5:19 am
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Originally Posted by Sixth Freedom View Post
I agree. I cannot really see BA flying second hand!

Aren't most of the Gatters fleet second hand (some ex LHR fleet, some from outside IAG entirely).
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