Oct 28, 2015, 5:04 am
Last edit by: beltway
From BA.com (28 October 2015)
On 2 February 2016, we’ll be making some changes to the Executive Club pricing structure for reward flights originating or terminating in the United States of America.
The change will only affect shorter routes on American Airlines, Alaska Airlines, and TAM Airlines with reward flights now starting from 7,500 Avios, rather than 4,500 Avios, plus taxes, fees and carrier charges from $5.60 USD. The majority of North American reward flight prices will remain unchanged.
Take a look at the examples in the table below to see how our pricing structure will change.
Source: http://www.britishairways.com/en-gb/...reward-flights (thanks KARFA)
For more information on redeeming awards in North America, see Using BA Avios for Awards on AA / US (merged threads).
On 2 February 2016, we’ll be making some changes to the Executive Club pricing structure for reward flights originating or terminating in the United States of America.
The change will only affect shorter routes on American Airlines, Alaska Airlines, and TAM Airlines with reward flights now starting from 7,500 Avios, rather than 4,500 Avios, plus taxes, fees and carrier charges from $5.60 USD. The majority of North American reward flight prices will remain unchanged.
Take a look at the examples in the table below to see how our pricing structure will change.
Source: http://www.britishairways.com/en-gb/...reward-flights (thanks KARFA)
For more information on redeeming awards in North America, see Using BA Avios for Awards on AA / US (merged threads).
Band 1 redemptions for USA domestic flights will be priced as Band 2 from 02 Feb 2016
Oct 28, 2015, 7:44 am
#76
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Texas
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 279
Amen -->
I happen to have a lot of regular destinations between 550 and 650 miles, and they are always at least $300 round trip. So this was a huge deal for me... I just got back from a trip from Texas to Iowa with my wife, toddler and infant. It cost 27k miles RT and about $30. Same trip now costs 45k, roughly the same using AA miles on Citi reduced mileage awards.
I booked over 30 flights at the 4,500 rate in the past 2 years, and another 3-4 in F. So I saved probably $10-15k. Time to book another 20-30 awards before Feb. 1st!
Hate to see it go but was nice while it lasted... for two CC sign-ups, over $20,000 in mainly Y flights aint bad!
I booked over 30 flights at the 4,500 rate in the past 2 years, and another 3-4 in F. So I saved probably $10-15k. Time to book another 20-30 awards before Feb. 1st!
Hate to see it go but was nice while it lasted... for two CC sign-ups, over $20,000 in mainly Y flights aint bad!
Oct 28, 2015, 8:00 am
#77
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: BOS
Programs: UAL Premier Gold, HHonors Gold, B6 Mosaic
Posts: 135
Yes, I'd often rather take Megabus (especially with their $1 fares) or Amtrak (if it's reasonably priced) than redeem 4,500 Avios and $5.60 to go from NYC to Philadelphia or Boston or DC. Why? Because it takes an hour to get to the airport from Manhattan, and hour to fly, an hour to get from the airport, etc, etc., when the bus/train goes from city center to city center and takes ~2 hours to/from Phila. and ~4 hours to/from Boston/DC. You're not saving that much time. I'd rather save my Avios for routes where flying is the only option.
And I do think it will increase sAAver availability because virtually no one on AAdvantage was redeeming 12.5k miles for LGA-DCA sAAver redemption, for example (terrible value). Certainly not 20k for a standard redemption.
And I do think it will increase sAAver availability because virtually no one on AAdvantage was redeeming 12.5k miles for LGA-DCA sAAver redemption, for example (terrible value). Certainly not 20k for a standard redemption.
But BOS-DCA? Talk about a nightmarish drive - it's through the most densely populated section of the country. If not done in the middle of the night, it can take 9 hours door to door, so here flying over driving is probably the single best instance of time cost savings in the USA. Will miss those 4500 redemptions, but as I'm over leveraged somewhat in Chase UR I suppose I could redeem BOS-BWI instead (though at a fixed, and not nearly as lucrative, redemption value).
Oct 28, 2015, 8:00 am
#78
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL, AA 1MM LT GLD, SPG PLAT, National Exec Selc, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 8,278
Yes, I'd often rather take Megabus (especially with their $1 fares) or Amtrak (if it's reasonably priced) than redeem 4,500 Avios and $5.60 to go from NYC to Philadelphia or Boston or DC. Why? Because it takes an hour to get to the airport from Manhattan, and hour to fly, an hour to get from the airport, etc, etc., when the bus/train goes from city center to city center and takes ~2 hours to/from Phila. and ~4 hours to/from Boston/DC. You're not saving that much time. I'd rather save my Avios for routes where flying is the only option.
And I do think it will increase sAAver availability because virtually no one on AAdvantage was redeeming 12.5k miles for LGA-DCA sAAver redemption, for example (terrible value). Certainly not 20k for a standard redemption.
And I do think it will increase sAAver availability because virtually no one on AAdvantage was redeeming 12.5k miles for LGA-DCA sAAver redemption, for example (terrible value). Certainly not 20k for a standard redemption.
Back to the point - I don't think AA's shuttle redemption are bad values, certainly not in Y. A $300 o/w ticket on the Shuttle is quite common. 12.5K is a very good value for that. I certainly have redeemed for them.
I seriously doubt that this will have much (if any) positive impact for customers looking for increased award availability on AA metal using BA points. As it is, award availability on AA metal has been gamed big time by AA management in order to devalue AA miles. And my bet is that AA will further tighten the screws on award availability even after this.
But I think we can agree, this BAEC change will have next to know impact on AA mileage availability.
Last edited by Prospero; Oct 28, 2015 at 8:25 am Reason: Combine posts. Please use multi-post when replying to two separate posts
Oct 28, 2015, 8:04 am
#79
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: BA
Posts: 954
Yeah, I think we can just chalk this up to being to each their own. I'm just not a bus person. The idea of queuing on the street and getting motion sick trying to read on board while stuck in traffic on the NJT is exactly the type of nightmare that inspires me to work hard so I have other travel options.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:04 am
#80
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 4
This was a pretty big bummer to see this AM. I'm military and one of the amazing privileges we get is taking space available hops. BA 4500 rewards were helpful in my strategy it get close to home in the US and hopefully take a cheap reward flight last minute back home. Guess the minimum will probably be 10K UA reward for these cases.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:08 am
#81
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL, AA 1MM LT GLD, SPG PLAT, National Exec Selc, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 8,278
Oct 28, 2015, 8:08 am
#82
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Arizona
Programs: BA (GGL G4L), AA (Gold), HH (Diamond); Marriott (Gold)
Posts: 3,011
Keep in mind that there are 3 devaluations together over the past 12 months that make this a much bigger devaluation:
* decrease in avios earned on cheaper economy fares
* decrease in avios earned via Chase for non-BA spend from 1.25 avios to 1 avios per dollar spent
* increase in avios needed for band 1 NA flights
And of course this is only for sAAver level availability, of which AA has reduced availability.
Based in PHX, we've made use of avios for a domestic journey exactly once, as the availability is usually not there when we need it. We had a last minute trip, PHX-RNO. Availability was only in F, so we spent 72000 avios for the 1.5 hour flight for two adults, two kids, and a baby. It was still a better value than the $400/person cash fare, but at the new rates cash might have been a better value.
I'm guessing the new rates can allow BA to offer specials when they feel like it, eg offer a reduced rate closer to the current rate, but only when it suits them rather than all the time.
Regardless, it's yet another step in slowly boiling away the perks of the program.
* decrease in avios earned on cheaper economy fares
* decrease in avios earned via Chase for non-BA spend from 1.25 avios to 1 avios per dollar spent
* increase in avios needed for band 1 NA flights
And of course this is only for sAAver level availability, of which AA has reduced availability.
Based in PHX, we've made use of avios for a domestic journey exactly once, as the availability is usually not there when we need it. We had a last minute trip, PHX-RNO. Availability was only in F, so we spent 72000 avios for the 1.5 hour flight for two adults, two kids, and a baby. It was still a better value than the $400/person cash fare, but at the new rates cash might have been a better value.
I'm guessing the new rates can allow BA to offer specials when they feel like it, eg offer a reduced rate closer to the current rate, but only when it suits them rather than all the time.
Regardless, it's yet another step in slowly boiling away the perks of the program.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:09 am
#83
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: BOS
Programs: US, AA, Delta, BA, Hilton, Marriot, HYATT
Posts: 433
You don't understand it because most likely you haven't been in the position to redeem North American awards. As many have posted, the issue is that for connecting itineraries, you have at least 2 segments, i. e. a minimum of 15,000 avios, which is more than the flat 12,500 American requires for all North American awards, regardless of number of connections, i. e. 0, 1, 2, etc. Thus, an Avios redemption on AA or AS is ONLY a good idea if you can find a non-stop flight to your destination, which can be impossible for many depending on where they are located. And those carriers generally make available connecting itineraries more available than non-stop flights as they usually command a premium. Thus, with a redemption in Y realistically costing more than what AA charges and the same goes for F redemptions, the BA programs became a lot less attractive for US residents. I got a BA card last year for the bonus Avios just for these short-haul redemptions but come renewal time, I'll cancel it as the reason I got it is going away. Yes, 7,500 is not much worse but in the grand scheme of things, it's a major change.
If its not for OW, I will never fly BA.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:11 am
#84
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Availability is down because load factors are up. They are trying to game the inventory to sell seats, not devalue the program. AA is known for having much more sophisticated revenue management systems than US - this is why there is a change on LUS routes.
But I think we can agree, this BAEC change will have next to know impact on AA mileage availability.
But I think we can agree, this BAEC change will have next to know impact on AA mileage availability.
Keep in mind that there are 3 devaluations together over the past 12 months that make this a much bigger devaluation:
* decrease in avios earned on cheaper economy fares
* decrease in avios earned via Chase for non-BA spend from 1.25 avios to 1 avios per dollar spent
* increase in avios needed for band 1 NA flights
And of course this is only for sAAver level availability, of which AA has reduced availability.
Based in PHX, we've made use of avios for a domestic journey exactly once, as the availability is usually not there when we need it. We had a last minute trip, PHX-RNO. Availability was only in F, so we spent 72000 avios for the 1.5 hour flight for two adults, two kids, and a baby. It was still a better value than the $400/person cash fare, but at the new rates cash might have been a better value.
I'm guessing the new rates can allow BA to offer specials when they feel like it, eg offer a reduced rate closer to the current rate, but only when it suits them rather than all the time.
Regardless, it's yet another step in slowly boiling away the perks of the program.
* decrease in avios earned on cheaper economy fares
* decrease in avios earned via Chase for non-BA spend from 1.25 avios to 1 avios per dollar spent
* increase in avios needed for band 1 NA flights
And of course this is only for sAAver level availability, of which AA has reduced availability.
Based in PHX, we've made use of avios for a domestic journey exactly once, as the availability is usually not there when we need it. We had a last minute trip, PHX-RNO. Availability was only in F, so we spent 72000 avios for the 1.5 hour flight for two adults, two kids, and a baby. It was still a better value than the $400/person cash fare, but at the new rates cash might have been a better value.
I'm guessing the new rates can allow BA to offer specials when they feel like it, eg offer a reduced rate closer to the current rate, but only when it suits them rather than all the time.
Regardless, it's yet another step in slowly boiling away the perks of the program.
Last edited by Prospero; Oct 28, 2015 at 8:24 am Reason: Combine posts. Please use multi-post when replying to two separate posts
Oct 28, 2015, 8:15 am
#88
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA GGL, AA 1MM LT GLD, SPG PLAT, National Exec Selc, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Silver
Posts: 8,278
They gamed the award inventory to devalue the program. The transition to more than two tier award ticket pricing in each class of service was a scheme deliberately conceived and pursued to reduce the costs of redemption tickets and maximize revenue collected from all paid tickets regardless of point of sale/sales agent -- that includes BA award tickets for AA/US metal flights.
(1) Reducing saver award availability is consistent with fuller planes. Nothing more nothing less.
(2) Moving to the tiered AAnytime award system frankly made sense and seems entirely fair. The concept of taking a seat for free on a busy holiday travel day when fares are sky high should rationally cost more than redeeming a seat on a normal day.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:20 am
#89
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2012
Programs: BA Gold, QF WP
Posts: 12,551
Exactly. Also availability on BA is far worse. I was looking for BOS - ATL and couldn't find any availability on BA in coach and there is availability in F for 38,000 Avios (I can buy economy ticket for $140). American has number of flights for 12.5K. I would rather prefer revenue based than pay fuel surcharges.
If its not for OW, I will never fly BA.
If its not for OW, I will never fly BA.
BA has access to all AA MileSAAver award availability, so if you see it on AA.com (at MileSAAver rates) it can be booked through BA with avios.
Oct 28, 2015, 8:24 am
#90
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: BOS
Programs: US, AA, Delta, BA, Hilton, Marriot, HYATT
Posts: 433
Also sometimes BA says there is availability and it errors out in the last page when booking. I called BA and they said its "fake availability" and not bookable. Without multi city option its a pain to search individual segments.
Last edited by virtuo0; Oct 28, 2015 at 8:32 am