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BA to sell OF on 744s as J [inc removing F from PHX, LAS & YVR]

BA to sell OF on 744s as J [inc removing F from PHX, LAS & YVR]

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Old Jun 18, 14, 1:40 pm
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BA to sell OF on 744s as J [inc removing F from PHX, LAS & YVR]

As I reported earlier, after some discussions with BA staff/management, it seems that the GDS has been altered to sell OF on 744s as J. I can find LAS as the first example, starting from the winter season. Therefore, OF 744s will be assigned to specific routes (i.e. routes that need J capacity but not F). My talks to BA management earlier in the year said that these routes would be LAS, CPT and YVR (although he did say there could be others).

Looking at random dates for the LHR-LAS service, F is zeroed out.

He confirmed to me that when this did happen, those being sat in the F section of the J class cabin would be status holders, naturally. Therefore if you are on one of these selected routes, Golds/Silvers can now choose a seat in the F cabin, provided of course that the F cabin needs to be opened to accommodate the J load. Now the question for some of you will whether to be sat in 64A/K or 1A in OF.

This will also eliminate the 50,000 Avios compensation as a result.

It should also be stated that BA are in the process of doing this now, and it remains to be seen whether these OF 744 aircraft will still operate as F (with the 50,000) Avios compensation or soley as CW on every route they serve (which would be terribly hard for Revenue management to predict due to AC swaps). I would think the first would be the case. Assign them to some specific routes that do not warrant F, but do require 66 CW seats and continue to sell them as a F product on other routes but with the compensation. This way BA saves the compensation amount on some specific routes while giving them more CW capacity.

Personally I see this as a very positive move and will establish product consistency to BA's most privileged pax. For those booked in F, watch out if you are on a non-premium mid-J 744 route!

Last edited by LTN Phobia; Jun 24, 14 at 7:39 pm Reason: Clarification [+title change by a mod]
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Old Jun 18, 14, 1:53 pm
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Phoenix and Vancouver are coming up as 747 routes which won't be selling F.

Cape Town still showing F available on BA44/45 but no F on the 58/59.

Looking very much like BA are allocating the last remaining old first 747's on to specific routes.

Last edited by 1HourPhoto; Jun 18, 14 at 2:07 pm
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Old Jun 18, 14, 1:56 pm
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Damn ... just as BA starts putting the A380 on the IAD run.

Oh, well, another 'First' world problem.
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Old Jun 18, 14, 1:59 pm
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Originally Posted by 1HourPhoto View Post
Looks like you can add Phoenix and Vancouver to the list of 747 routes which won't be selling F.

Are BA allocating the last remaining old first 747's on to specific routes.
Yes, these OF (all? or at least most of which are mid-J 744s) aircraft will be allocated to specific routes and will in effect become its own subfleet (like the 772s over the 77Ws). Therefore, a 52-CW mid-J aircraft will increase by 14 to 66-J with no F (in name).
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:11 pm
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What happens to existing bookings in F (booked as F, obviously) that end up as OF which is sold for some amount of time (between now and the date of the flight) as J?
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:13 pm
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Ok..... I wonder how many in 64k would prefer to be in 4F.......
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:16 pm
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Originally Posted by nickerss View Post
What happens to existing bookings in F (booked as F, obviously) that end up as OF which is sold for some amount of time (between now and the date of the flight) as J?
Well, F is no longer a cabin being sold on these flights and the F fare code is zeroed out, and will presumably soon be eliminated from the GDS. Therefore, the airline will be forced to downgrade the pax to CW and pay the necessary compensation as a result. F is no longer a cabin operated by these aircraft (even if the OF cabin is there in the flesh, it is now considered CW).

Also, it is worth nothing that on the above routes (LAS, PHX, CTP, YVR) F is no longer open for bookings.
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:18 pm
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Hmm.
I guess the figures must indicate a >52J load (in Winter) often enough to go with this option.
I wonder what the financial numbers would have looked like if they'd instead opted to sell ALL the seats as F reward seats (without the 50k rebate)? Would have been an opportunity to let the BAEC side of the house have a few months in the saddle.

Sad in a way. I like OF. Looks like I may not get to fly it again
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:22 pm
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So J only to LAS from both LHR and LGW.

With PHX gone as well, it limits the West Coast options as LAX in F is very hard to find.
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:23 pm
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Originally Posted by littlefish View Post
Hmm.
I guess the figures must indicate a >52J load (in Winter) often enough to go with this option.
I wonder what the financial numbers would have looked like if they'd instead opted to sell ALL the seats as F reward seats (without the 50k rebate)? Would have been an opportunity to let the BAEC side of the house have a few months in the saddle.

Sad in a way. I like OF. Looks like I may not get to fly it again
Or, IMHO, it is a way to save money on the food/ F associated products on routes where F is no utilised in a profitable manor. Therefore they can just add on come CW food/toiletries and, at the end of the day, add to their profit.

It should be noted the F cabin shall be blocked off if the load of CW is 52 or lower. It will only be opened when necessary.

I would like to know how the inventory structure on these routes will work though. Will they be assuming 66 CW seats or 52 (and if the first, could make flying CW on these routes quite cheap as presumably more I class seats would be for sale).
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:24 pm
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Originally Posted by irmster View Post
So J only to LAS from both LHR and LGW.

With PHX gone as well, it limits the West Coast options as LAX in F is very hard to find.
SFO and SEA both have, and are still showing, F service; but yes, a drastic decline in F availability.
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:26 pm
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Ignore please
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:47 pm
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Only 65J seats will be sold so configuration is 65J/36W/235M on following routes:

BA43 CPT
BA85 YVR
BA275 LAS
BA289 PHX
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:49 pm
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Some, potentially, surprising routes having F taken out there. Does this give an indication of where the 787-9s & -10s might go first?
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Old Jun 18, 14, 2:54 pm
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Originally Posted by BA0197 View Post
He confirmed to me that when this did happen, those being sat in the F section of the J class cabin would be status holders, naturally. Therefore if you are on one of these selected routes, Golds/Silvers can now choose a seat in the F cabin, provided of course that the F cabin needs to be opened to accommodate the J load. Now the question for some of you will whether to be sat in 64A/K or 1A in OF.
On my future PHX flight in November, F class is zeroed out, however the F seat map wasn't merged into the CW one yet...
Hopefully it'll happen soon... I think I prefer OF over the UD...
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