Speedbird Julie

Hear hear. It's known as RISK capital for a reason...

RoyalSwazi

I’ve never done any work related to public procurement myself, but these comments do not surprise me the least. I have several close friends who do, and some of the stories they tell are shocking. Some examples:

1) A new online examination system was handled by one (1!) person who had no background neither in IT or education. Of course the system crashed on day 1
2) Price is often weighted extremely high (90% is not unusual). Quality or ability to deliver suffers as a consequence
3) Trams that were too long, too heavy and could not handle the cold
4) SAR helicopters with so many customised features that they are still not operating several years after delivery
5) Regularly awarding contracts without a proper tender process (or indeed one at all).

Bohinjska Bistrica

Agreed, but he has asked for a loan and not a bailout. He is offering his island as collateral.

Personally think his island is an entirely inappropriate form of collateral, but it's all he really has. Other than that there is what will be a worthless airline (in money terms) and some equally worthless aircraft, due to current significant oversupply against demand. Seems strange to be describing some very new A350s as worthless, but they are of no use in the event a loan cannot be repaid because the bank/government can't sell them on to recoup their money at the moment and will lose money on parking/maintaining them.
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If he is bailed out then absolutely the government should receive a shareholding. What is VS currently worth, though? The government would probably be paying well over the odds at £500m even if it took all of Branson's stake.
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Edit: I certainly don't want them to disappear. I have over 100k miles that I'm swithering on transferring and have enjoyed flying with them. However they are in a terrible situation that is also very complicated, and precedent does not favour them.

Speedbird Julie

If the business requires state aid then the equity is worthless. The government should take full ownership with the aim of returning the business to the private sector when market conditions permit.

It also makes sense to rename the airline in order to prevent the payment of any licensing fees to its former owner.

FlyerTalker39574

Air London Manchester, ALM.

Yellowbelly

New name COVID Airlines?

rapidex

Old slapper?

krispy84

It really doesn’t (Apart from allowing us on FT to have a good chuckle).

Virgin has a brand, a good brand IMHO, and that will generate sales once airlines are flying again. You don’t honestly think AN Other Airways would sell as well as Virgin?

VS might be dead anyway, but renaming the airline just nails it in the coffin while it’s still breathing.

hillwalker2004

How about: Community Of Virgin International and Delta?

KARFA

I think Speedbird Julie's point is that the Virgin trade mark may not be owned by VA - on checking she is right and the proprietor of the TMs is Virgin Enterprises Limited which is a subsidiary of VEL Holdings Limited.

You would want to avoid being beholden to a licence agreement with whatever Virgin company owns it and having to pay a fee/royalty.

krispy84

You would want to avoid paying a fee absolutely. I am perhaps a little sceptical as to how that could be avoided whilst still using the Virgin name.

How tightly has Branson tied up the businesses use of ‘Virgin’? I am working from the assumption that he benefits from some very robust legal agreements.

BlueThroughCrimp

ISTR it’s one of the reasons Absolute Radio changed their name when they were sold by SMG to Times of India , to avoid paying a fee for using the Virgin Brand.

Hannibal Lecter

If you think you have heard this one before:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKCN2252XQ
APRIL 23, 2020
"Thanks to the state intervention, Alitalia will be able to compete effectively once the sector recovers,Industry Minister Stefano Patuanelli said""


It's because you have:

https://www.reuters.com/article/alit...14001420080927
SEPTEMBER 27, 2008
“With the agreement by the pilots, I’m confident (the new Alitalia) will be able to lift-off,” Infrastructure Minister Altero Matteoli told Italian television.

layz

LNER (nationalised Virgin Trains East Coast) seemed to be doing well without the need for the Virgin brand. If the government had thought the Virgin brand would make a difference they could have continued to pay the licensing fees and kept the branding the same.
On the other hand Avanti West Coast (the franchise that replaced Virgin Trains on the west coast) looks such a terrible brand with a cheap logo, but due to them only starting in December I have no idea if it's made a difference.
Already mentioned is Absolute Radio which used to be Virgin Radio.

Flying Club is owned by a separate entity Virgin Group Loyalty Company, I can't see the government nationalising that so if the government did take control of VS passengers might lose all their miles (or at least find out their miles can't be used on VS flights)..

milkyway88

OT - That also had a lot to do with moving the station(s) to the top of any digital radio programming.