Sighting of BA's first 787
Mar 22, 2013, 5:33 pm
#31
Join Date: Dec 2007
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The FAA will be pretty keen to get the thing up in the air quickly and safely so I am sure if Boeing meet the requirements the FAA approved then all should be resolved relatively quickly.
The FAA will want it up and running as its not great for them to having to remove certification of a US plane so they will be working closely and supportively with Boeing for a safe return to service as a win:win for all.
The FAA will want it up and running as its not great for them to having to remove certification of a US plane so they will be working closely and supportively with Boeing for a safe return to service as a win:win for all.
They would show no such eagerness to certify an Airbus aircraft so Boeing shouldn't get any special treatment.
Mar 22, 2013, 7:04 pm
#32
Join Date: Dec 2007
Programs: Just a lowly Blue ;(
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Most planes are painted white to decrease heat build up. The skin of a plane already gets hot through friction during flight and dark colours increase this heat. The hotter the plane the more fuel it burns. So yes it is about cost, but for different reasons.
In fact, when Concorde was painted in the pepsi colours they were advised not to take it above mach 2 for more than 20 minutes as they were worried what the additional heat would do to the fuselage.
Mar 22, 2013, 7:24 pm
#33
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Trinidad & Tobago
Posts: 437
I believe that's actually incorrect.
Most planes are painted white to decrease heat build up. The skin of a plane already gets hot through friction during flight and dark colours increase this heat. The hotter the plane the more fuel it burns. So yes it is about cost, but for different reasons.
In fact, when Concorde was painted in the pepsi colours they were advised not to take it above mach 2 for more than 20 minutes as they were worried what the additional heat would do to the fuselage.
Most planes are painted white to decrease heat build up. The skin of a plane already gets hot through friction during flight and dark colours increase this heat. The hotter the plane the more fuel it burns. So yes it is about cost, but for different reasons.
In fact, when Concorde was painted in the pepsi colours they were advised not to take it above mach 2 for more than 20 minutes as they were worried what the additional heat would do to the fuselage.
Mar 22, 2013, 7:49 pm
#35
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From a purely (crew) selfish point of view... As this will be replacing the 767 aircraft, and as known, on many of the same routes... The 787 comes as standard with cabin crew bunks, which will be a vast improvement over the 3 economy seats in the back row. Some of the flights like LUN, EBB and YYC can be quite long, and to have your break in the traveler seats at the back, with people bumping you through the curtain as they go too and from the toilet, mainly because they don't know people are behind them, is not great. being able to completely get out of the cabin for a break will be nice.
We don't yet officially know how the crewing will work in terms of who will work where, but my guess is would be as follows...
We know it will have 1 x CSD, 1 x CSL and 6 x Main Crew.
35 CW seats is only 3 more than the main deck of a Mid-J 744.
CSD and 2 main crew working in Club.
CSL and 4 main crew working in WT+ and WT.
Similar to the 767, but with an extra crew member in WT+/WT due to higher configuration.
But, that is just my guess. No doubt someone will be along to say I am wrong.
Last edited by BingBongBoy; Mar 22, 2013 at 7:51 pm Reason: Sorry, spelling is crap tonight...
Mar 22, 2013, 8:23 pm
#36
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
I toured the Boeing plant near Seattle today.
I looked down on the factory floor and there was the first BA 787 nearly fully assembled, it already looks good although only the tail is painted.
If you have wondered why all the Boeings start with 7?
.....No it is not 7 for luck! In Boeing terminology it means they are jet-powered aircraft, 1-5 are props, if you are lucky enough to fly in a Boeing starting with 8 eg 8X8, it means the aircraft will be rocket-powered.
Sorry no photography was allowed, I am sure we will see the BA 787 first flight soon.^
I looked down on the factory floor and there was the first BA 787 nearly fully assembled, it already looks good although only the tail is painted.
If you have wondered why all the Boeings start with 7?
.....No it is not 7 for luck! In Boeing terminology it means they are jet-powered aircraft, 1-5 are props, if you are lucky enough to fly in a Boeing starting with 8 eg 8X8, it means the aircraft will be rocket-powered.
Sorry no photography was allowed, I am sure we will see the BA 787 first flight soon.^
7x7 are commercial jets. It makes other jets which aren't for commercial use - e.g. military jets and the BBJ (a private version of the 737).
The bit about 8x8 is just hype from the PR person. They aren't on the drawing board and until they are don't count on the 8x8. Since 27x7s are supersonic commerical passenger jets, no reason to think that if and when they make rocket commerical jets they might be something like 37x7s... no way to know.
Touring a Boeing factory is fun, but just like any industrial tour (or non industrial tour for that matter) don't believe everything you are told.
Good grief no. First flight Feb 9 1963 and over 200 still in commerical service -- that's 50 years of flight!
A 7x7 where the x is a letter indicates an aircraft in design before it is marketed.
Last edited by Indelaware; Mar 22, 2013 at 8:44 pm
Mar 22, 2013, 8:41 pm
#37
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Which, if I am not mistaken... Can be a private version of any Boeing jet... A 747-8 which is made as a private/corporate jet, would also be classed as a BBJ, just based on a different frame...
Wiki
Boing BBJ Website - Click on "Models"
Wiki
Boing BBJ Website - Click on "Models"
Mar 22, 2013, 8:47 pm
#38
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,187
Which, if I am not mistaken... Can be a private version of any Boeing jet... A 747-8 which is made as a private/corporate jet, would also be classed as a BBJ, just based on a different frame...
Wiki
Boing BBJ Website - Click on "Models"
Wiki
Boing BBJ Website - Click on "Models"
BBJ1 is based on the 737-700.
BBJ2 is based on the 737–800.
BBJ3 is based on the 737-900ER.
BBJ C is a variant of the BBJ featuring the "quick change" capabilities of the 737-700C.
BBJ MAX 8 and BBJ MAX 9 are proposed variants of the Boeing 737 MAX 8 and 9
747 VIP: version of the 747-8 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division. 777 VIP: version of the 777-200LR ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
787 VIP: version of the 787-8/-9 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
Mar 22, 2013, 8:54 pm
#39
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BBJ is actually a short form of the BBJ1.
BBJ1 is based on the 737-700.
BBJ2 is based on the 737–800.
BBJ3 is based on the 737-900ER.
BBJ C is a variant of the BBJ featuring the "quick change" capabilities of the 737-700C.
BBJ MAX 8 and BBJ MAX 9 are proposed variants of the Boeing 737 MAX 8 and 9
747 VIP: version of the 747-8 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division. 777 VIP: version of the 777-200LR ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
787 VIP: version of the 787-8/-9 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
BBJ1 is based on the 737-700.
BBJ2 is based on the 737–800.
BBJ3 is based on the 737-900ER.
BBJ C is a variant of the BBJ featuring the "quick change" capabilities of the 737-700C.
BBJ MAX 8 and BBJ MAX 9 are proposed variants of the Boeing 737 MAX 8 and 9
747 VIP: version of the 747-8 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division. 777 VIP: version of the 777-200LR ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
787 VIP: version of the 787-8/-9 ordered by the Boeing Business Jet division.
Mar 23, 2013, 12:25 am
#41
Join Date: Apr 2008
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OK - apologies... 'short-lived' as far as my sightings are concerned.
I haven't seen one nor heard about one for donkey's years! I thought they all must have disappeared. (wrongly, now, I admit)
You can't deny that it lacked the 'popularity' of the 737 and 747 though, adding to my thought that it 'died out' many years ago...
I haven't seen one nor heard about one for donkey's years! I thought they all must have disappeared. (wrongly, now, I admit)
You can't deny that it lacked the 'popularity' of the 737 and 747 though, adding to my thought that it 'died out' many years ago...
Mar 23, 2013, 1:15 am
#42
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There's a YouTube video of the 777 wing flex being tested to destruction. Pretty impressive:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ai2HmvAXcU0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ai2HmvAXcU0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sA9Kato1CxA
One interesting difference, is with the 787 it is only one of the wings and the wing box being tested.
BTW, the 367 was a jet.
Mar 23, 2013, 1:48 am
#43
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Mar 23, 2013, 2:12 am
#44
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I remember a Boeing materials scientist telling me you can move the 747's wingtip a bit by hand.
Last edited by greg5; Mar 23, 2013 at 2:18 am Reason: Typo... ...and model clarification.
Mar 23, 2013, 5:27 am
#45
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Its along way short of the 7500 737s though