kered

Well in recent months I’ve been reading with increasing regularity on this very board terms such as:

“Dire”
“Inedible”
“Rubbish”
“Crap”
“Awful”

“Patchy”
“Inconsistent”
“Snooty”
“Rude”

“Just not good enough.”

Being used to describe Club World & not just for the “reduced strike service” !

Certainly on my last couple of CW flights, the crews could have fitted into the snooty & somewhat rude, condescending even, category. As for the food, well my main course looked like dog food. Albeit being reasonably tasty dog food, once I got over the appearance & sampled it.

Actually, on a recent WTP flight I found the food & indeed the service to be better than what I had previously got in CW.

So all is not rosy in the Club World garden either.

clubman

And your reason for duplicating the second post in this thread was...?

Jenbel

Reading both VS and BA, I sometimes feel like they are on a sea-saw. As complaints about food on BA have increased recently, so there are signs that VS food could be improving again as we've had a few, cautiously positive remarks. Well, except about champagne levels loaded.

continentalclub

As Air New Zealand have already announced an 'upgrade' to their Business Premier seat (slightly overshadowed by the Skycouch announcement), surely it's not beyond the realms of possibility that the 'upgrade' to the Upper Class seat will simply mirror NZ's development?

moneypooraviosrich

There really is no point comparing food in CW and VS upper. If you are flying Upper VS you get the clubhouse and a choice of delicious restaurant quality food served at a table with proper service so you only really need a snack on board. Not so with CW where you only get the Galleries lounge and you are lucky if you can snag the last bacon roll.
Also you can have free limo service with VS (if you live within distance) then the revivals lounge of VS is superior to the offing of BA. Sometimes it is about the little things extra that make the whole experience, and I am afraid that even with the seat configuration in VS it still wins with me. And if I hear one more person say "but in the CW seat you don't have to get up to have the thing turn into a bed" I will scream. As if that is important.

continentalclub

Prepare to scream, Stoneman .

Whilst you may not appreciate it, there's a huge proportion of passengers for whom the necessity to flip the Virgin/Air New Zealand seat over marks a fundamental compromise to their travelling comfort.

In general, those who are taller, and those whose MO is to have one, single, defined period of sleep during the journey often prefer the flipper seat, as the two 'flips' are hardly onerous and, up until recently, the bed has been longer than the competition.

However, those who prefer to 'slump', perhaps in stages, and who have shorter naps rather than full 'lights-out, flat-out for 8 hours' almost always report that they prefer the Club World or Cathay Business style of seat - which inherently also offers greater seated recline than VS/NZ.

Neither preference is, of course, wrong; that's why there's a choice in the marketplace. No matter how much you might scream though, I'm afraid that you're wasting your time: too many fare-paying passengers simply don't find 'flipping' acceptable. Many do, but many don't.

Secondly, in response to your post, and as has been debated in these parts many times, limos are only available to those passengers holding full fare tickets (just book Tristar separately if you're desperate for your Volvo, though you won't get drive-thru check-in, admittedly). If you're a connecting passenger (as a huge proportion of BA's are, and almost none of VS's are), then the London limo and drive-thru check-in are completely irrelevant too.

And finally, the Virgin Clubhouse at T3 is rightly lauded as one of the best airline lounges in the World; you'll struggle to find anyone who isn't seriously impressed. However, your assessment of the BA Galleries Club at T5 is far-removed from the vast majority of passengers' experiences, and I've never seen the F&B offering in there when it's been anything but laden. Indeed, some others have accused it of profligacy.

Whether you like it or not though, people are different and that's why both BMW and Mercedes-Benz are successful. The fact that some wouldn't countenance the idea of buying one or the other is a reflection of their preferences, priorities and loyalties. The purchase of one brand shouldn't catalyse weeping and wailing by fans of the other, and neither should you exercise your chords because others prefer a different airline product.

firstclasslad

So well put ^

kered

I would be very pro VS, I’ve always loved travelling with them, right from way back in the early 90’s when all I could afford was econ, to today when I’ve been lucky enough to be able to sit up front. During that time I’ve had a very hot ‘n’ cold relationship with BA, which included an almost 10 year boycott of the airline. But at the same time, more so in recent years, I would be quite pro BA in many ways too. I think that both airlines products in J are very comparable, each with their own unique pros & cons.

So just to pick up on a few points raised in this thread.........

I would have to concur with this ^

While I love the UC seat, I do prefer being able to gradually slouch down in the CW seat watching a movie, or listening to music. Then continuing to the “Z” position or all the way to lie flat for a snooze. Whereas in UC, you have to make a conscientious decision to lie down. I find myself on a night flights back to LHR subconsciously counting down to when I suspect they are going to serve breakfast, so that I’m up in time with my seat flipped over, which somewhat impacts on my rest. In CW, I can stay lying down until they come around with Breakfast & then just set my seat upright.

That said, I much prefer the privacy of the UCS, as you’re not looking into the eyes of a stranger sitting beside you. Not a problem when travelling with Mrs Kered, but I don’t always get to travel with her. I also much prefer the direct aisle access from all window seats in UC, so there’s no need for midnight gymnastics to climb over someone to get in or out of your seat.

I think perfection for me, would be the CW seat in the herringbone layout of UC

I have to say that I don’t think much of the food offerings in the Galleries Club at all I rarely if ever can find something to eat there, other than shortbread biscuits or a few weirdly filled sandwiches. The bacon rolls I would eat, but have yet in all my visits to the GC to see any there. The heated rolls they do have I just don’t like. Same goes for the salad & pasta offerings & the aforementioned (what I deem) weird sandwiches. I’ve often wandered over to the sandwich trays, read the descriptions of the filings & walked away

Compared to the food offerings & table service in the Clubhouse, the Galleries lounges are just not at the races at all. Nor I have to say, is the CCR at the races, I would take the Clubhouse over it any day. So when travelling in CW now, we plan to eat in Plane Food & use the Galleries as a nice place to sit for a while, go to the loo & have a drink or a coffee. Thereby in essence looking at it as just a waiting room, albeit a nice relaxing waiting room.

I must add though, that Mrs Kered doesn’t have the same issues as me regarding the GC food offerings, but can see why some would struggle to find something to eat there. As we often say, there’s “Mrs Kered Food” & there’s “Mr Kered Food”

This I can’t agree with.

I have been consistently disappointed with the Revivals lounge

I think it is too small, hot & stuffy. There aren’t enough places to comfortably sit down & relax for a while before continuing on your journey & there just aren’t enough loos to serve the number of passengers going through there. Correct me if I’m wrong, but aside from the shower rooms, I think there is only one male & one female loo, or two of each at best. That’s just not good enough IMHO

I much prefer the Galleries Arrivals lounge at T5. There’s lots of room, it’s bright & airy, with loads of different places in which to sit & relax. The buffet breakfast area is absolutely fab, with a great selection of food to choose from. From healthy options, right through to a “big dirty fry up” Then unlike VS’s revivals lounge, there’s loads of loos ^

My only disappointment with the T5 arrivals lounge is they no longer have the Sanctuaries that they had over in the T4 Terraces. I used to love sitting in there for a while listening to the wave music. I found it to be fantastically relaxing after a long homeward TATL flight & it really was a Sanctuary away from the melee that is Heathrow

So, much like my idea of perfection in the air is a combination of both UC & CW. Perfection for me on the ground would be, the Virgin Clubhouse on departure, coupled with the BA Galleries Arrivals for the return

Not a truer word has been written ^

Me, I fly both.

Certainly my overall preference is for VS, but that said I’ve travelled BA quite a bit in recent years too. In truth, I suspect that if I were to look at it properly, I’ve probably flown CW more than I’ve flown UC. BA bug the hell out of me & have done so for years. What with some of their policies, the current debacle & uncertainty over the strike & past strikes one of which which almost cost us our honeymoon, all give me absolutely loads of reasons to re-instate my boycott of the airline. But for some reason I haven’t done so.

I certainly don’t “love” flying with BA, I do however “love” flying with VS. If I were pinned to declare where my deep rooted & long standing loyalties lie, I would have to say with VS.

But for some reason I still fly with BA

Sixth Freedom

I would only fly UC if absolutely necessary and I have an irrational reason for this.

After I graduated I applied for a job at VS and they had me to interview. I travelled all the way from NCL to QQK, got a train over to LGW and then a taxi to VS HQ. And back.

I spent more than GBP 100 on the journey and I was an unemployed graduate at the time with very little money.

They had told me that I would get my transport costs back but when they decided that I would not be returning for the second round (a decision I agree with, VS is not the company for me), I was told that they would not be getting my expenses back.

A big for VS and due to this I will avoid and have avoided flying them if at all possible.

PresRDC

I have two gripes with the VS J seat:

1. The tray table is too low, making it uncomfortable to use as a desk;

2. The mini tray on which you can place a drink is located in a very awkward location, requiring you turn half way around to get to it (also easy to knock it over).

The food on VS was fine, but the menu is too limited, especially on longer segments such as LHR-Asia. When I first flew Upper Class in 2000, the menu was fantastic with lots of good choices. On my last flight (2008), there was hsrdly anything to eat. Not everyone wants (or has the time) to have their meal in the Clubhouse and VS doesn't account for this. It is so obviously cost cutting that it just about ruins the experience.

Jimmie76

Well it matters to me so scream away, however the seat is only part of the picture.

You also have a choice of one flight a day on VS (versus 3 on BA) to BOS and the timings of that don't work for me. If ACK becomes fogged in and this does happen as the evening draws in there are no flights to the island. So getting to BOS later is not a good idea hence I like to get the early BA flight (213) from LHR. VS11 arrives at 17:35 which is too late to risk arriving at BOS for the fog reason, and if the VS plane goes tech at BOS there isn't another flight for 24hrs. Whereas with BA if 212 isn't happening, I can just get the later BA 214, or 238 next morning. At worse I can get put on an AA flight through the OW alliance, so my options are greatly increased by flying BA. It isn't just about the ground/seat facilities for me but the other factors.

Morland

I have to say when I've visited the Clubhouse I have been very impressed with it. The problem is that when I was doing LHR-JFK a couple of times a month I timed my arrival as close as possible to take-off to make sure that I didn't spend hours in the lounge (I only missed a flight once!). The Clubhouse is wonderful, but making time for a sit-down meal before take-off does add to the overall journey time...

moneypooraviosrich

What was that all about I was contributing to the discussion like everyone else. Seems like it's not MY chords that have been struck.
Here lies the difference between myself and many, probably most on here, I travel only for pleasure, albeit probably taking 4-6 longhaul flights a year for the past 15, so have no need for some of the things like number of flights a day, or timings, or slumping into a bed. I and my dear wife actually like the whole experience, we get to the CH early to savour all of the atmosphere and take in the treatments. When we were in Galleries the only hot things were cheese and mushroom rolls. I love the novelty of being able to sit at a bar while flying, and until a couple of years ago having a massage by the IFBT, and in the 5 returns I have flown Upper have never once noticed anyone being rowdy at the hostelry on the night flight back. I like it when the CC ask if I would like my bed made up and suggests I go and get a drink at the bar. We once on a reward flight got the limo for 12,000 FC miles from Nottingham to LHR, from SFO to our hotel and back home. Something I would never be able to do otherwise. After trying the BA product recently I am of the opinion that SRB does that end of the market better than BA, so maybe BA are not for us. I have 200,000 BAEC miles stashed and will be using them either for a couple of CW to Miami or LAS. After that, who knows, I will probably try BA to LAS in Y sometime as the VS product in those rust buckets based at LGW does not bare thinking about. (Yes we do have to spend a lot of our time down the back, it's those that allow us to move up front on occasion.)
So yes I do agree with you that there are different types of traveler on this forum, can you point me to where intimated otherwise?

Tim_T

And there is probably an equal amount that find stepping over the feet & legs of someone to get to the loo in the middle of the night, having someone playing with the seat divider, or having the crew spill a drink on you as they reach over to the other seat just as compromising.

You pay your money and take your choice. There is enough room for both and hence we can all be happy......

Jimmie76

Hey I also travel mostly for pleasure but if I have to spend a night in BOS because ACK is fogged in, I've lost another day of my two week holiday to traveling. I don't want to spend another day at an airport waiting for space on a flight, even though 9K are a good airline who can deal with getting fogged pax to ACK as soon as possible quite easily.

Again on the return if something goes wrong and I (and a plane load of others) are stuck at BOS the fact that there are three flights a day is vey handy. There is a greater chance that you will be able to quickly get on another flight with BA or a OW alliance partner. I'm self employed at the moment and so I don't like the idea that I could be stuck somewhere and unable to get back. Clients don't seem to like that strangely.
So timings of flights and the number of flights is important to me.

I also like the idea of being able to recline to sleep the minute we have taken off which was confirmed on here (by one of the ever helpful crew) as when the wheels have left the ground. This means that if I have eaten in the lounge I can go to sleep then and there I don't have to wait for the seat belt sign to be switched off and have to get up. In this respect the sleeper service is excellent, although from BOS it has normally been a 777 which I'm less keen on. Flights East, back to the UK are usually short and therefore this allows the maximum amount of time asleep, vital if you have to work the next day.

Not getting at you specifically, but those points are some of the reasons that I choose to fly BA.