Safety, anything else I need to know?
 

My wife and I, plus our 2 year old are thinking of going to Sao Paulo and Rio.

I've done some reading on the safety aspect, if it was just two of us minus little one we would not be too concerned. So I have found the following:

- Avoid wandering around at night
- Avoid beach areas at night
- if in the event of a hold-up, just hand over your stuff without resistance
- pickpockets are quite rife but then most cities in the world are too.
- don't flash the bling
- Daytime stick to mainly tourist areas
- taxis are safe
- Metro's are safe

As far as I can see they seem quite standard rules for most places in the world.
Weighing up the risk and reading other threads, everything should be fine, just be street wise and act where you know where you're going.

Anything else I need to think of?

Just IMO you will be less of a target with a child. Kids in Brazil are seen out with their parents in all sorts of venues (including bars) until all hours of the night. Brazilians love kids and wil go out of their way to engage with them.

Most tourist crime is pickpocketing and "grab and run" of items not well secured. Keep your money divided into more than one location and keep any visible valuables secured. Not only don't flash the bling, leave it at home. Carry just enough for your day's outing.

I would not "avoid wandering around at night" at all. The lively street life after dark in Brazil is very pleasant. The warning about beach areas (this is the sand part of the beach, not neccessarily the sidewalk along the main beaches in Rio) is because they are unpopulated after dark. I advise to stay off ANY unpopulated area or street, even if it looks to you to be middle-class and safe, especially after dark. But the main streets in Copacabana, Ipanema and Leblon are fine and quite busy. Take relatively inexpensive taxis (look for the name and phone number of the cooperative painted on the back fender) between locations after dark; the metro is fine during the day, as are city buses.
"Daytime stick to mainly tourist areas" Where else in Rio would you want to go? Aren't you there to see the tourist sights in Rio? For reasons of political correctness, I discourage "tours" of poor neighborhoods with guides who do not live in that neighborhood and spending money which all does not end up there doing good for the residents. The historic center in Rio is a business area and after business hours does tend to get somewhat deserted.
Once you are "on the ground", though, you will understand that most of the scare stories you have read or heard are not what you are experiencing. You should stay vigilant at all times, though, an art the Brazilians themselves have perfected to the point that you may not even notice them doing it.


I don't understand why anyone would want to spend even a minute in Sao Paulo, which does not have tourist areas, but does have middle class residential and business areas. Maybe you want to see the kids playing in the parking lots behind the bars of the high fences of their buildings in which they are confined, a zoo-like experience?

Enjoy your trip.

Thanks very much VidaNaPraia for your information.

It's a long story but the reason we're going to Sao Paulo is because of redemption flights - it's the only destination in Brazil we can get to.

No flights direct from UK to Forteleza?

Well, there's no reason (IMO the "flavor of Brazil" that you've come all that way to see is much more interesting elsewhere) to stay in S.P. any longer than it takes to recover from your international flight in and get out again to Rio on the next plane to Rio. (or maybe even comfortable overnight sleeper bus, if your kid will indeed sleep on one) You can check out the Japanese neighborhood Liberdade, the MASP museum (mostly Brazilian art), the Pinacoteca modern art museum, Trianon park, and enjoy strolling in the upscale Jardins neighborhood, looking at shops. There is a good bookstore, with items for kids. The ice cream in S.P. is the best in the world (Italian immigrant skill meets tropical fruit.)
Rio is MUCH more interesting (as I described in your other thread).
Salvador is 1.5 hrs from Rio by plane.
Or you could go by bus from Rio back down the coast to Ilha Grande (by bus and boat) and then to Paraty. Onwards from Paraty back to S.P. is 6 hours by bus (maybe a bit long for your little one).
Have a good trip.

Ah, and bring a folding stroller with the largest wheels you can manage; sidewalks are in awful condition. (Few Brazilians use strollers.)

What? If he means night more in the sense of late night, I would most certainly agree. Do not wander around around at night.

Do avoid the boardwalks after dark. In the summer, they become a bit safer in the dark, but you're coming after the beach activity high season. Locals only go to the boardwalk area at night in order to exercise. That's why pickpockets can spot their victims effortless.

Well, he should only be dogmatic about it because he doesn't know the city, but I know plenty of neighbourhoods which are safe even deserted at night.

It does not get necessarily dangerous, but it's quite disturbing to walk in that mighty emptiness. It gives out the impression that the city has been evacuated.

Overrating much?



Seriously? Where did you get that idea? If you need the stroller, do bring it. Every Brazilian baby whose parents can afford one, do own one. Exceptions are though found in cities where people use cars even to go to the bakery. That's not the case in Rio de Janeiro, whose inhabitants can be compared to New Yorkers in terms of how they use public transportation in comparison to the rest of the country.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
I would not "avoid wandering around at night" at all. The lively street life after dark in Brazil is very pleasant. The warning about beach areas (this is the sand part of the beach, not neccessarily the sidewalk along the main beaches in Rio) is because they are unpopulated after dark.
What? If he means night more in the sense of late night, I would most certainly agree. Do not wander around around at night.

C010T3, you’ve either never had a young kid or it’s been so long you’ve forgotten. There is no late night wandering with a toddler. ;-)
But strolling around on the main streets of Av.NS de Copacabana in Copacabana or Visconde de Piraja in Ipanema or Ataulfo de Paiva in Leblon is certainly a pleasure of an evening. No need to stay locked in a hotel room out of fear.

Do avoid the boardwalks after dark. In the summer, they become a bit safer in the dark, but you're coming after the beach activity high season. Locals only go to the boardwalk area at night in order to exercise. That's why pickpockets can spot their victims effortless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
I advise to stay off ANY unpopulated area or street, even if it looks to you to be middle-class and safe, especially after dark.
Well, he should only be dogmatic about it because he doesn't know the city, but I know plenty of neighbourhoods which are safe even deserted at night.
IMO there is no such thing as a safe neighborhood anywhere in Brazil.
A quiet, deserted street is a place where someone with bad intensions can hide and no one is around to help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
The historic center in Rio is a business area and after business hours does tend to get somewhat deserted.
It does not get necessarily dangerous, but it's quite disturbing to walk in that mighty emptiness. It gives out the impression that the city has been evacuated.
Again, deserted=risky

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
The ice cream in S.P. is the best in the world (Italian immigrant skill meets tropical fruit.)
Overrating much?
Nope. THE BEST!

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
(Few Brazilians use strollers.)
Seriously? Where did you get that idea? If you need the stroller, do bring it. Every Brazilian baby whose parents can afford one, do own one. Exceptions are though found in cities where people use cars even to go to the bakery. That's not the case in Rio de Janeiro, whose inhabitants can be compared to New Yorkers in terms of how they use public transportation in comparison to the rest of the country.

I got that idea from living in a Brazil where the minimum monthly salary (which many people are very lucky if they even make, to support an entire family) is about R$600 and a flimsy stroller at Lojas Americanas department store costs well over R$100. And from getting out of some chic Rio neighborhood to see how the majority live in Brazil. From knowing that it is sufficiently difficult to manage a stroller on a crowded bus, folded or unfolded or transitioning from one to the other, that female friends who are not muscular have chosen to leave donated ones at home, preferring to shlep around even a heavy toddler in their arms. And from ruining several on the sidewalks where I live. Few Brazilians use strollers. Seriously.

And of course, a tourist used to using a stroller for their toddler should bring or buy one.

Again, to the OP, have a great trip.

We're using airmiles and there's no availability to Rio. SP is the nearest we can get.

Who's saying that he would wander around with a toddler? I meant in general. We're not discussing the limitations that a toddler imposes on a trip.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia (Post 21010803)

IMO there is no such thing as a safe neighborhood anywhere in Brazil.
A quiet, deserted street is a place where someone with bad intensions can hide and no one is around to help.

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Well, it's good that it's only your opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
C010T3, you’ve either never had a young kid or it’s been so long you’ve forgotten. There is no late night wandering with a toddler. ;-)

Who's saying that he would wander around with a toddler? I meant in general. We're not discussing the limitations that a toddler imposes on a trip.

Well, I was directing my comments toward the OP. It would be too bad if he, like some other posters on Brazil travel forums, thought he was stuck in a hotel after dark.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VidaNaPraia
IMO there is no such thing as a safe neighborhood anywhere in Brazil.
A quiet, deserted street is a place where someone with bad intensions can hide and no one is around to help.

Well, it's good that it's only your opinion.

Yeah, mine and that of almost 200 milllion Class E-B Brazilians.The other super-rich/class-A+ live behind guarded bars in their high-end apartments.

You got it covered real well, although praying for divine protection is the first item on my list.

Rio is a lot safer now than it was some years ago, try to stay in the neighborhood of Leblon beach where it's quite safe and very pleasant.

I have read the posts of my colleagues who live in Brazil. This is one of the few subject about which I consider myself well prepared and knowledgable, in reference to Rio de Janeiro, not elsewhere. By way of qualification, I walk on average 15km per day in Rio, exclusively in Zona Sul. I have never been accosted, nor have I seen anyone else being accosted.

1) Bring a stroller with large wheels. Almost all small children in Zona Sul are transported by stroller. Around Lagoa mothers, fathers and baba's are walking/running with strollers from 06:00 to around 21:00, even later in summer. Along the beaches of Leme, Copacabana, Arpoador, Ipanema and Leblon the same is happening, but with less serious excercise involved. Jardim Botânico is even more heavily populated by strollers during public open hours.
2) As for stay in Leblon? Sorry but that is nuts! There are places not to go, and we can provide you with more details if you wish. The main areas of Zona Sul are safe during the day, and most are at night too. At least twice a week I walk from Copacabana, near the Copacabana Palace, to my home in Jardim Botânico, often at night. Nary a problem.
3) Kids are protective cover anyway. It is hard to find someone who does not like kids in Brazil.
4) As always your large city rules are wise to follow. For sure do not carry passports, large amounts of money, jewellery or obvious items of value. Dress casually. remember you're in Rio, where dressing up is a rarity and suits are only for politicians, lawyers and otehr high-class criminals.

Beyond all, have fun!

Where was the police last night? I would never have expected the unopposed mayhem that occurred in the streets of my beloved Leblon. Real sad...

Reference is to this?
http://riotimesonline.com/brazil-new...panema-leblon/

So maybe Governor Cabral should get off his complacent @ss and be a leader in iradicating corruption among his cronies, and getting the 'common people' decent schools for their kids that train them to become something other than manual laborers, and quality healthcare without excessive waits even in emergencies, etc.

As was said in "the movement" in the US:
If you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

Methinks Sr Cabral could not eradicate corruption among his cronies without eradicating himself, not such a bad idea, hmmm.

On the facts he seems to care for nothing other than himself, above all his helicopter fleet, necessary because of the baba's need for transportation and his digs who need to visit the coiffeur in Leblon. These are rights!

VidaNaPraia..... thanks for the Ice Cream Tip. I will have to try the stuff next time Im in SP. Buenos Aires has its fair share of proper ice-cream, so you comments on the quality of SP Ice Cream has me thinking....