Colin

I am starting this thread to exclusively focus on how people are dealing with involuntary schedule changes for bmi award redemptions for travel after May 2012 on Star Alliance threads.

UA has released a major schedule change that disrupts my Hawaii trip in Jan 2013. Cancelling is not an option for me as the Hawaii segments are part of broader tickets that I for sure will want. To make life even more difficult, my flight to Hawaii is on one bmi award ticket and the flight from Hawaii is a few days later on a second bmi award ticket.

I will document in this thread my dealings with bmi and UA directly. Wish me luck.

Guy Betsy

When schedule changes occur, if its on the same day, but only the flight number has changed, you can still use existing ticket as UA at check in will just validate the current e-ticket. When the flight disappears altogether , then you would need to liase with UA as BD in theory no longer exists to handle UA's changes.

JeffBHD

SA have today announced that they are halting the direct CPT-LHR service from mid-August. I am fully expecting to be rebooked CPT-JNB-LHR. Let's see !

stewardo

Where was this announced? It appears to run contrary to all announcements made by bmi/BA. BD (the bmi service centre) certainly continue to exist.

NickB

It seems to me that we are again in 2+2=83 territory here. There is, AFAIK, no factual basis for this assertion.

GoldCircle

I have a factual basis for answering this question, as I asked a member of the Diamond Club team this very question a few weeks ago - it will likely lead to a cancellation, as there will be no access to *A inventory to rebook.

So, I asked whether the BA call centre would not simply re-book like for like on a BA/OW service. It was not apparent at the time of asking whether this would be permitted.

NickB

But why can BD, as ticketing carrier, not liaise with the airline which causes the irrop to rebook as is the case with any normal irrop on ordinary revenue interline tickets? The relevant airline (say UA) will have to do the rebooking but BD could and should re-issue the ticket (or BA if these functions are taken over by BA).

Think about it: there must be mechanisms available to change tickets issued on BD stock with segments on *A carriers. Imagine, for instance, a BD-issued fully-flex tickets with segments on UA. Since the ticket is fully flex, you must be able to change your UA flight to another UA flight if you wish or perhaps an LH flight instead. BD saying "we no longer have access to *A inventory" would NOT be an acceptable answer. BD would have to make the changes to the ticket requested by the passenger. If that is possible for revenue tickets, then there is no reason why this should not be possible for redemption tickets in irrops situations.

GoldCircle

/Irrops are handles by the airport. I'm talking about sked changes./

I did make your very point.

I'm guessing that X/I/O class availability won't be visible on the GDS and it won't surprise anyone that any airline would be resistant to re-booking in to a revenue class. Not that that should matter, but being pragmatic... When I probed a little further, I was left with the impression that we'd be dealing with a BA call centre, rather than ICC/SPTS... I have no times-scale on any of this... but at the rate BA is moving things along, I don't think this is too far off...

So, this is logical, if distasteful.

ranskis

From what I know about IROPS, it is the airline causing the irregular operation that should bear the costs of rerouting the passenger. They can reissue a ticket from another airline (it happened to me once). Of course, the airline that owns the document can make involuntary reissues, it does not matter the booking class that is used. However, they can bill the "irregular" carrier for the fare difference.

NickB

You are right: sked changes are the issue rather than irrops. The nagging point in all of this is the assumption that a sked change results in the pax needing to be rebooked in X/I/O and only if there is availability therein. That has always been a sore point with DC: in situations of sked changes, pax should be rebooked on the nearest reasonable available flight regardless of award inventory availability (as long as there is physical availability in the relevant cabin) and the airline making the sked change should pick up the tab for this. If the airline responsible for the sked change and the airline on which the pax is rebooked is the same, then it should not be an issue: they can open up inventory in the right class if needed or, if they like it better, authorise the reissue in the higher booking class. I can see that airlines do not like to pay if the pax has to be rebooked on an alternative carrier but it is rather rich for the airline to change their schedule and let the pax carry the can for the changes made by the airline. My guess is that, if challenged before a court in the UK or elsewhere in the EU, it would not take much to make a judge treat that as a breach of UCTRs so it would be sensible for BD/BA to make sure that they have a solution to this other than telling the pax 'Here's your miles back. Now s.. off'.

As to who physically will handle it, I think that you must be right. We are fast approaching the point where there will be virtually no BD flight left other than a possible handful where bilateral ASAs might prevent a transfer to a BA number. With very limited servicing of existing reservations, a man and his dog in a little office behind (in a virtual sense) a BA call centre dealing specifically with these looks more likely than the full blown ICC/PTS.

HIDDY

Given that BA availability is pretty crappy for its own members I think redeemers will have to rely on the airline involved accommodating them.

YorkieFlyer

I guess we'll have to see what if any options we would be offered re involuntary sched changes. I was previously moved by a day by SQ when booked on a BD redemption tkt MAN-SIN. BD then offered me a flight ex LHR, not I believe from a revenue class.

To be cancelled without being offered any alternative seems unacceptable, but it may come down to the behaviour of the operating carrier and as we know some are better than others! i think BA/BD should push the carrier to provide an acceptable alternative, but I don't expect a BA option or another * airline option.

JeffBHD

OK chaps, we have an actual datapoint:

CMT is now showing the following:

Cape Town to London

Flight 1 Tuesday, February 26, 2013
unable, does not operate Departure: 20:20 Cape Town, South Africa - Cape Town International
Arrival: 06:55 +1 day(s) London, United Kingdom - Heathrow , terminal 1

Airline: South African Airways SA220 Duration: 12:35
Aircraft: Airbus Industrie A330-200
Last check in: information not available

Fare type: Business
information not available current flight status



Cape Town to London

Flight 1 Tuesday, February 26, 2013
confirmed, timechange Departure: 15:10 Cape Town, South Africa - Cape Town International
Arrival: 17:10 Johannesburg, South Africa - O.R. Tambo International , terminal B

Airline: South African Airways SA346 Duration: 2:00
Aircraft: Airbus Industrie A340-600
Last check in: information not available

Fare type: Business
information not available current flight status

Change of plane required. Time between flights : 3:30.

Flight 2 Tuesday, February 26, 2013
confirmed, timechange Departure: 20:40 Johannesburg, South Africa - O.R. Tambo International , terminal B
Arrival: 06:25 +1 day(s) London, United Kingdom - Heathrow , terminal 1

Airline: South African Airways SA234 Duration: 11:45
Aircraft: Airbus Industrie A330-200
Last check in: information not available

Fare type: Business
information not available current flight status

Change of plane required. Time between flights : 4:25.

So, automatic rebooking confirmed (on this one anyway !) ^

Jetstreamer

I have been rebooked and re ticketed by SQ for a non existent schedule change.

My new ticket issued on 236 stock was issued by SINSQ0ERS so it appears other carriers can do these re-issues. Ticket endorsed *M*INVOL REROUTE AS PER IATA 735D / DUE ASC ORIGINAL FARE RULES APPLY.

Why this has been done is a mystery though as there was no schedule change or routing change!

raikje

Ah, but is that not what always would have happened? SAA cancel a flight, protect you onto another flight, and it shows as UN (unable, does not operate) for the original (cancelled) sectors and TK (confirmed, timechange) for the replacements. However, does this not require the ticket to be reissued? At which point it won't show the timechange, and will just show "confirmed".

What does eitr.amadeusasia.com show for your e-ticket?