More news on Asiana restructure

Old May 11, 16, 12:18 am
  #46  
 
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Originally Posted by jon503 View Post
I guess that depends on how you define "major". I'm also not aware of Kumho being on the brink of collapse or anything that major, but they have a lot of bad debt and have been constantly restructuring one part of the group or another since at least 2009. That said, Hanjin, the group behind KE, isn't doing much better, particularly given the state the shipping industry is in.

So yeah, I agree that there isn't any immediate short-term threat, but neither do they have a great margin of error, so Asiana is constantly at some level of danger.
Actually, Kumho Group (now Kumho Asiana & Kumho Petrochemicals) did collapse in '08 and never really recovered. Kumho Petrochemical owns like 25% of OZ and always seems to get in everyone's way at every shareholder's meeting, and the family(the guy) that used to own it is now barely putting the pieces back together (just bought Kumho Industrial, OZ's majority shareholder, and Kumho Buslines). Unless the government forcibly freezes OZ's credit lines or something, OZ itself will be fine - whether they'll still be part of the Kumho Asiana group, is a different story.

I wish ANA or someone else would just buy them out and we can all put this to bed knowing OZ is not going to go under. I'm sure Etihad is still looking for a failing airline to buy.
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Old May 11, 16, 1:02 am
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Originally Posted by stupidhead View Post

I wish ANA or someone else would just buy them out and we can all put this to bed knowing OZ is not going to go under. I'm sure Etihad is still looking for a failing airline to buy.
NH for sure won't buy them out knowing they didn't really do anything with Skymark in it's own country.

Etihad looking for OZ or MH could be possible, sure.
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Old May 11, 16, 10:14 pm
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Originally Posted by TennisNoob View Post
NH for sure won't buy them out knowing they didn't really do anything with Skymark in it's own country.

Etihad looking for OZ or MH could be possible, sure.
Although, maybe not Etihad if them taking over means OZ will be leaving *A. I only mentioned ANA because OZ and NH already did some kind of share swap thing I think (OZ and NH both own a stake in each other or something).
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Old May 17, 16, 11:18 pm
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The politics of a Japanese airline buying a Korean one would make such a thing a non-starter imo.
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Old May 17, 16, 11:52 pm
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Originally Posted by Daxiuyi View Post
The politics of a Japanese airline buying a Korean one would make such a thing a non-starter imo.
I used to think that but if you look at the electronics (Computer components) world, they are all JV Japanese and Korean companies.

I.e. TSST, HLST, S-LCD, etc.
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Old May 19, 16, 5:37 pm
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Originally Posted by TennisNoob View Post
I used to think that but if you look at the electronics (Computer components) world, they are all JV Japanese and Korean companies.

I.e. TSST, HLST, S-LCD, etc.
That is true, although that relationship has been ongoing since Korea started getting into the memory and electronics game (i.e. 30-40+ years).

Airlines is a totally different ballgame though, and I don't know if the OZ-NH relationship is that close/strong/deep.

Especially going into election season here in Korea, it's too easy to play politics and make an issue out of it imo.
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Old May 20, 16, 11:44 pm
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Originally Posted by Daxiuyi View Post
That is true, although that relationship has been ongoing since Korea started getting into the memory and electronics game (i.e. 30-40+ years).

Airlines is a totally different ballgame though, and I don't know if the OZ-NH relationship is that close/strong/deep.

Especially going into election season here in Korea, it's too easy to play politics and make an issue out of it imo.
I agree with that assessment, particularly as the airline industry is much more consumer-facing than semiconductors and electronics assembly.

By the same token, I don't see Asiana closing up shop even if things should get worse. As one of only two Korean airlines, I'm sure they will get a cash infusion if Kumho can no longer muster the funds to keep Asiana afloat, probably through one of the state-owned banks like KDB or through a financial consortium.
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Old May 21, 16, 12:09 am
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Originally Posted by jon503 View Post
As one of only two Korean airlines, I'm sure they will get a cash infusion if Kumho can no longer muster the funds to keep Asiana afloat, probably through one of the state-owned banks like KDB or through a financial consortium.
Yup someone will bail them out like JAL when they went bankrupt.

Hanjin group isn't doing so well either so I wouldn't be surprised if both get bailed out.
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Old May 23, 16, 12:44 am
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Hanjin isn't doing that great either, but at least they capitalised KE when they had the money to do so (I'm no airline industry expert, but I feel that KE managed the timing of their route expansions, A388 and B747 purchases pretty well) so that even if the parent is short on funds, KE has the resources to stand on their own feet.

OZ by contrast is in the middle of overhauling its fleet, and for Kumho to be struggling on top of that isn't exactly great timing...
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Old May 24, 16, 7:24 am
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Perhaps SQ? Regional NE Asia and long haul to NA and EU.
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Old Jul 17, 16, 1:35 am
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Originally Posted by 1353513636 View Post
Will FRA/JFK be flown with other planes on the non-A380 days or will it just have no service?

EDIT: It is possible to serve all 4 flights daily with 6 A380s with the following cycles although if one goes mechanical or needs to be taken out of service for an extended period there will be a problem.

Example Cycle 1 - requires 3 A380s
Seoul (ICN) to New York (JFK) Mon, Mar 7
Overnight flight
Asiana 222
Dep: 11:00 am
Arr: 11:00 am
14h 0m

New York (JFK) to Seoul (ICN) Mon, Mar 7
Asiana 221
Dep: 1:00 pm
Arr: 5:30 pm
14h 30m
Tue, Mar 8

Seoul (ICN) to Los Angeles (LAX) Tue, Mar 8
Overnight flight
Asiana 204
Dep: 8:20 pm
Arr: 2:15 pm
10h 55m

Los Angeles (LAX) to Seoul (ICN) Wed, Mar 9
Overnight flight
Asiana 203
Dep: 12:30 am
Arr: 6:50 am
13h 20m
Thu, Mar 10

Example Cycle 2 - requires 3 A380s
Fri, Mar 4
12:50 pm 4:30 pm
Seoul (ICN) Frankfurt (FRA)
Asiana 541
11h 40m

Flight 2: Frankfurt Seoul
Fri, Mar 4
6:30 pm 12:30 pm+1
Frankfurt (FRA) Seoul (ICN)
Asiana 542
10h 00m

Flight 3: Seoul Los Angeles
Sat, Mar 5
2:40 pm 8:40 am
Seoul (ICN) Los Angeles (LAX)
Asiana 202
11h 00m

Flight 4: Los Angeles Seoul
Sat, Mar 5
11:00 am 5:30 pm+1
Los Angeles (LAX) Seoul (ICN)
Asiana 201
13h 30m
That looks to be the most likely scenario plus either ICN-BKK or ICN-HKG v.v. after OZ201 in cycle 2.
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Old Aug 31, 16, 6:31 pm
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Originally Posted by 1353513636 View Post
Will FRA/JFK be flown with other planes on the non-A380 days or will it just have no service?

EDIT: It is possible to serve all 4 flights daily with 6 A380s with the following cycles although if one goes mechanical or needs to be taken out of service for an extended period there will be a problem.

Example Cycle 1 - requires 3 A380s
Seoul (ICN) to New York (JFK) Mon, Mar 7
Overnight flight
Asiana 222
Dep: 11:00 am
Arr: 11:00 am
14h 0m

New York (JFK) to Seoul (ICN) Mon, Mar 7
Asiana 221
Dep: 1:00 pm
Arr: 5:30 pm
14h 30m
Tue, Mar 8

Seoul (ICN) to Los Angeles (LAX) Tue, Mar 8
Overnight flight
Asiana 204
Dep: 8:20 pm
Arr: 2:15 pm
10h 55m

Los Angeles (LAX) to Seoul (ICN) Wed, Mar 9
Overnight flight
Asiana 203
Dep: 12:30 am
Arr: 6:50 am
13h 20m
Thu, Mar 10

Example Cycle 2 - requires 3 A380s
Fri, Mar 4
12:50 pm 4:30 pm
Seoul (ICN) Frankfurt (FRA)
Asiana 541
11h 40m

Flight 2: Frankfurt Seoul
Fri, Mar 4
6:30 pm 12:30 pm+1
Frankfurt (FRA) Seoul (ICN)
Asiana 542
10h 00m

Flight 3: Seoul Los Angeles
Sat, Mar 5
2:40 pm 8:40 am
Seoul (ICN) Los Angeles (LAX)
Asiana 202
11h 00m

Flight 4: Los Angeles Seoul
Sat, Mar 5
11:00 am 5:30 pm+1
Los Angeles (LAX) Seoul (ICN)
Asiana 201
13h 30m
Oh my gosh.. this is indeed going to be the rotation from next year, March 2017, when FRA will begin 380. (Jan/Feb is 772 but that's a different story.) Four long-hauls using six frames! Good thing is that Asiana won't use 380 for intra-Asian routes anymore.
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