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-   -   Taiwan -- where does one get started? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/asia/613675-taiwan-where-does-one-get-started.html)

iahphx Oct 16, 2006 11:06 pm

Taiwan -- where does one get started?
 
Someone has offered me a business opportunity that would involve spending considerable time in Taiwan over the next year, and possibly a relocation. I've been to mainland China, Hong Kong, Macau, Singapore but never Taiwan (not counting the airport!). I have a reasonable understanding of Taiwanese history, politics, economy, etc., but little knowledge about what life is like in Taiwan -- much less as it would impact an "ex-pat." In short, I want to figure out whether Taiwan would be a good place to spend a year, and whether I should be expecting something remotely familiar to Hong Kong or the mainland -- or something more different than familiar.

If anyone could steer me in the right direction for an overview (heck, I don't think most guidebook series even cover Taiwan) so I could at least know whether I should even consider this opportunity, I'd greatly appreciate it. Thanks.

ivoryboi Oct 16, 2006 11:17 pm

Japan + Shanghai - Communism = Taiwan

party_boy Oct 16, 2006 11:39 pm

I've spent a year in Taipei and just moved back.

Taiwan is great. Taipei is great. Minor outlying areas aren't so great. Great infastructure, great food, great people. Did I mention it's a great country to live for a year. I seriously want to move back. PM me if you'd like to discuss particulars. There simply is too much to say about it.

travelinmanS Oct 16, 2006 11:53 pm

Taiwan, in my opinion, is the best place, in the Chinese speaking world, to spend a year as an expat.

It is clean, modern, and cosmopolitan while still possessing the charm of a more relaxed pace of life than H.K. or Singapore. Compared to mainland China it is 180 degrees different. The only thing similar about the two places is the language they speak and often times that is different as well.

Levels of English in Taipei are usually pretty good, especially amongst younger people. The food is extremely good and fresh and clean (unlike the mainland on all 3 counts) and the people are usually very friendly and more outgoing when compared to their H.K. or mainland counterparts.

Air connections will get you everywhere in the world conveniently (except the mainland).

I'd go for it, you will not regret a year in Taiwan!

iahphx Oct 17, 2006 1:29 pm

Thanks for the great responses. I've been reading the online "wikis" too. Taiwan certainly seems like a more than decent place to live for a year. I've spent some time in Japan, too, so I guess that would probably also lessen the "culture shock" a bit.

Before I spend more time on "life in Taiwan," I'll now investigate whether the business opportunity is worth pursuing. Thanks again.

taipeipeter Oct 18, 2006 5:52 am

The city of Taipei, at least, or in particular, is simply a very easy place to live. Ugly, but convenient. Transportation and food (counting supermarkets and hypermarkets, food of nearly all types) are particularly convenient, cheap, and good. Housing a bit less so. But if you don't insist on American standards of size and luxury for housing, it's fine (or if you're on a large budget).

It does help to know some--not necessarily a lot of--Chinese, e.g. with taxis. But as someone remarked above, most people know some English, including store clerks. Taiwanese are also very hospitable and friendly.

dtsm Oct 18, 2006 9:57 am

Taipei vs. HK
 

Originally Posted by travelinmanS
Taiwan, in my opinion, is the best place, in the Chinese speaking world, to spend a year as an expat.

It is clean, modern, and cosmopolitan while still possessing the charm of a more relaxed pace of life than H.K. or Singapore. Compared to mainland China it is 180 degrees different. The only thing similar about the two places is the language they speak and often times that is different as well.

Levels of English in Taipei are usually pretty good, especially amongst younger people. The food is extremely good and fresh and clean (unlike the mainland on all 3 counts) and the people are usually very friendly and more outgoing when compared to their H.K. or mainland counterparts.

Air connections will get you everywhere in the world conveniently (except the mainland).

I'd go for it, you will not regret a year in Taiwan!

I respectfully disagree. Depending on what your objectives/goals are, I think HK is comparable if not better in many ways.

FYI, my wife is Taipei homegrown, I've done three tours there in '70s, '80's, and late '90s. We both have family and many friends there, and luv the place. But my oldest son (just graduated from college) recently had a choice btw spending 1-2 yrs learning Chinese and working - Taipei vs. HK, and both my wife/I strongly recommended HK. And after 4 months, our son (who obviously lived in Taiwan as youngster) agreed it was the right choice.

Taipei is great as noted above. But HK is by far more international (as well as maintaining it's 'chinese' identity), much more networking and growth opportunities for any enterprising individual. Taiwan economically is 'dead' compared to it's heydays, and all the money has long been channeled to the mainland. Taiwan's current political situation is at best a disaster with no solution in sight.

I'd be happy to continue this via pm. No flames, please, just my POV :)

socalterp Oct 18, 2006 4:14 pm

Most expats in Taipei tend to live in the Tian Mu area, on the northern edge of the city, close to Yangminshan. It's a nice area, a little less hectic than other parts of Taipei, and home to the American School, British school and others like that. Zhongshan N Rd is the main N/S artery there...and has good bus connections. The biggest drawback to Tian Mu is the less than great access to the MRT (subway) - there is a station to the west, but it requires a bus ride to get there.

There's also a fair amount of development in the government center area around Taipei 101 and the convention center. A lot of new highrises, and actually some green space, which is unusual. Only in recent years has Taipei become more of a "permanent city", and the infrastructure is still catching up.

Still, love the street life in Taipei. Food, shopping and people watching are enough to keep me occupied for a long time.

iahphx Oct 18, 2006 7:00 pm

Thanks for the additional tips -- very useful!

Taiwaned Oct 18, 2006 7:27 pm

We love Taiwan.

Outside of Taipei it is less developed but it is a great blend of Chinese life and westernization.

The adjustment from Vancouver to Tainan, (where we are) was quite easy.
Great food, friendly people and enough infrastructure to be comfortable. Language is tough to learn but if you are in Taipei, it probably won't be too much of a problem. Just come with an open mind to new experiences and you will love it.

dtsm Oct 19, 2006 9:22 am

Real estate prices
 

Originally Posted by socalterp
Most expats in Taipei tend to live in the Tian Mu area, on the northern edge of the city, close to Yangminshan. It's a nice area, a little less hectic than other parts of Taipei, and home to the American School, British school and others like that. Zhongshan N Rd is the main N/S artery there...and has good bus connections. The biggest drawback to Tian Mu is the less than great access to the MRT (subway) - there is a station to the west, but it requires a bus ride to get there.

There's also a fair amount of development in the government center area around Taipei 101 and the convention center. A lot of new highrises, and actually some green space, which is unusual.

Tien Mu is for western expats, not necessarily asian expats.

High rises by 101 is one of the the most expensive real estate (traffic is congested)

A third area is Neihu and MRT under construction for better connections from here. And there are other 'suburbs' other than the traditional tien mu area to consider.

Taipei Oct 19, 2006 9:47 am


Originally Posted by dtsm
Tien Mu is for western expats, not necessarily asian expats.

High rises by 101 is one of the the most expensive real estate (traffic is congested)

A third area is Neihu and MRT under construction for better connections from here. And there are other 'suburbs' other than the traditional tien mu area to consider.


Well as a Japanese American ex pat from California, the big growth area and new area in HsiNi area (101 or Taipei city Hall area) with high end stores and restaurants. TienMu has many nice residences for ex-pats but I but is bit north from main new business areas. Me I live in Banchaio city, across the river, 10-15 min subway from central areas. About English, well in HK , S'pore and Chinese big cities (Shanghai, ect), you will find more English info, signs ect. In Taipei, most people speak Chinese/Taiwanese with some speaking English. I think in Taiwan, there is more of a culture shock for Westerners, as the tourisum infrastructure for tourists is not very well written in English, and city is designed more for local people needs and customs. If you can it would very helpful to learn Chinese. One thing that I do like about Taiwan, is in general most people are very, very kind and polite compared to other big Asian cities. Taiwan has its own style, I hope you do come and see it.

socalterp Oct 19, 2006 1:17 pm

The Taipei subway is about as easy as it gets for non-Chinese speakers. It's basically a clone of the DC Metro, and a great way to get around. Bus service, while plentiful, is a bit more challenging.

My wife, who is caucasian and speaks no Chinese at all, loves Taipei. She's not as crazy about HK. We're going to Beijing and Shanghai for the first time next summer, so we'll see what she thinks there.

taipeipeter Oct 21, 2006 8:17 pm

[/QUOTE: But my oldest son (just graduated from college) recently had a choice btw spending 1-2 yrs learning Chinese and working - Taipei vs. HK, and both my wife/I strongly recommended HK. And after 4 months, our son (who obviously lived in Taiwan as youngster) agreed it was the right choice.

Taipei is great as noted above. But HK is by far more international (as well as maintaining it's 'chinese' identity), much more networking and growth opportunities for any enterprising individual. Taiwan economically is 'dead' compared to it's heydays, and all the money has long been channeled to the mainland. Taiwan's current political situation is at best a disaster with no solution in sight.]

At the risk of turning this into one of those interminable and un-resolvable NYC vs SF vs LA debates that just come down to individual taste and options, I have to say that if your goal is to learn Mandarin/putonghua, Taipei is vastly superior to Hong Kong, where of course the street language is Cantonese.

And while the Taiwanese economy is not flourishing like in the old days (neither is HK's), "dead" is an exaggeration. Finally, while many Taiwanese are deeply worred, upset, frustrated, disillusioned, cynical, and occasionally hopeful about the political situation, it seems to me (an outsider) far from a "disaster". You have a split government, highly partisan and personalized politics, and street demonstrations. So what? The civil service continues to function, and local elections are coming up at the end of the year.

And just as a matter of personal taste, while HK is magnificent and much, much, much more beautiful as a city, Taipei is more fun.

dtsm Oct 23, 2006 9:42 am


Originally Posted by taipeipeter

Taipei is great as noted above. But HK is by far more international (as well as maintaining it's 'chinese' identity), much more networking and growth opportunities for any enterprising individual. Taiwan economically is 'dead' compared to it's heydays, and all the money has long been channeled to the mainland. Taiwan's current political situation is at best a disaster with no solution in sight.]

At the risk of turning this into one of those interminable and un-resolvable NYC vs SF vs LA debates that just come down to individual taste and options, I have to say that if your goal is to learn Mandarin/putonghua, Taipei is vastly superior to Hong Kong, where of course the street language is Cantonese.

And while the Taiwanese economy is not flourishing like in the old days (neither is HK's), "dead" is an exaggeration. Finally, while many Taiwanese are deeply worred, upset, frustrated, disillusioned, cynical, and occasionally hopeful about the political situation, it seems to me (an outsider) far from a "disaster". You have a split government, highly partisan and personalized politics, and street demonstrations. So what? The civil service continues to function, and local elections are coming up at the end of the year.

And just as a matter of personal taste, while HK is magnificent and much, much, much more beautiful as a city, Taipei is more fun.

You're right re learning mandarin - Taiwan and NTUH (Tai-da U) remains the best, except for maybe Tsinghua on mainland. But the OP was asking about job oppty and working for one year.

Most expats, if polled for job assignments would put China n HK well ahead of Taiwan.

FYI, i am ABC and personally would prefer to live in Taiwan due to friends, family. But if I was objective and giving advice to third party, my recommendation for HK remains.


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