Points Clawed Back - Upgraded for bonus, downgraded in less than 12 months.
#31
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MSP
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, UA Silver, Hertz 5*
Posts: 911
The saga continues! After I had my 25K points clawed back for downgrading to the EveryDay card, I received an offer to upgrade for 40K. I accepted, met the minimum spend and received 40K. Dont plan to downgrade until I am atleast 14-15 months past the date from receiving the bonus.
However, today I decided to apply for Hilton Card with the 70K + 1 free night offer (where the page said I was pre-approved) and got the dreaded message saying I am not eligible to receive the bonus. I quickly canceled the application. Does this mean I am now in some kind of blacklist? How long am I blocked?
However, today I decided to apply for Hilton Card with the 70K + 1 free night offer (where the page said I was pre-approved) and got the dreaded message saying I am not eligible to receive the bonus. I quickly canceled the application. Does this mean I am now in some kind of blacklist? How long am I blocked?
#32
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend; Moderator: American Express, Capital One, Citi, Chase, Credit Card Programs, Diners Club, Signatures
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,884
#33
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,927
The saga continues! After I had my 25K points clawed back for downgrading to the EveryDay card, I received an offer to upgrade for 40K. I accepted, met the minimum spend and received 40K. Dont plan to downgrade until I am atleast 14-15 months past the date from receiving the bonus.
However, today I decided to apply for Hilton Card with the 70K + 1 free night offer (where the page said I was pre-approved) and got the dreaded message saying I am not eligible to receive the bonus. I quickly canceled the application. Does this mean I am now in some kind of blacklist? How long am I blocked?
However, today I decided to apply for Hilton Card with the 70K + 1 free night offer (where the page said I was pre-approved) and got the dreaded message saying I am not eligible to receive the bonus. I quickly canceled the application. Does this mean I am now in some kind of blacklist? How long am I blocked?
Amex (USA) restricts bonus based on number of accounts opened/closed (June 2018)
The contents of the thread give much more clues.
If the count upgrades as "accounts opened", it could be as simple as because you did two upgrades in the past 24 months, that's your limit.
You should be aware that most banks these days have "anti-churning" measures in place. And some banks have limits on how many cards you can apply for in a given time (and, again, Amex might count upgrades in such limits, who knows).
Btw, "pre-approval" is simply a credit determination, not a signup bonus determination. Amex is often happy to have you open a card,, as long as it can deny you a signup bonus. Ie, "anti-churning" measures. Some other banks, though, deny your for the card outright if you aren't eligible for the bonus, or if you fail their "anti-churning" measures. So it could be considered "less harsh" of Amex to only warn you that it's denying you the bonus, and give you chance to not apply, compared to other banks which simply act without warning.
Last edited by sdsearch; Mar 6, 2022 at 11:17 am
#34
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CLT
Posts: 493
Whenever I downgrade, cancel, or otherwise close a card/account, I always do it via online chat. I say I want to downgrade/cancel a particular card, then confirm that if I close it I won't be losing any bonus points. The rep checks, confirms (in writing) that I won't forfeit any points, then I downgrade/close the card. On more than one occasion, they find that I've gotten a retention bonus or other bonus that would have been forfeited, so I don't close the card.
In any event, I have an easy-to-access record of the conversation.
In any event, I have an easy-to-access record of the conversation.
#35
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MSP
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, UA Silver, Hertz 5*
Posts: 911
I didnt take a screenshot of the popup. However I did google "Amex popup" and believe this is the message I got - "Based on your history with American Express welcome offers, introductory APR offers, or the number of cards you have opened and closed, you are not eligible to receive this welcome offer"
FWIW, this is the only Amex card I have at the moment and it always has some charges on it, typically in the $300-500 per month. Anyways I think I'll start spending a bit more on this card, especially the charges that are typically non bonus earning and then check again in a few months.
FWIW, this is the only Amex card I have at the moment and it always has some charges on it, typically in the $300-500 per month. Anyways I think I'll start spending a bit more on this card, especially the charges that are typically non bonus earning and then check again in a few months.
#36
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,802
I had a Biz Gold, upgraded to Biz Plat in September for 130k bonus. AF hit, I had forgotten about the upgrade (as it's not my only Biz Plat card), cancelled through chat. Bonus clawed back.
Just talked to them again through chat and got the card reinstated. I explained that I never intended to close that card, I was just confused because I have several Biz Plat cards. They're applying for the points to be added back to the account.
Any idea what my chances are?
Just talked to them again through chat and got the card reinstated. I explained that I never intended to close that card, I was just confused because I have several Biz Plat cards. They're applying for the points to be added back to the account.
Any idea what my chances are?
#37
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 230
I had a Biz Gold, upgraded to Biz Plat in September for 130k bonus. AF hit, I had forgotten about the upgrade (as it's not my only Biz Plat card), cancelled through chat. Bonus clawed back.
Just talked to them again through chat and got the card reinstated. I explained that I never intended to close that card, I was just confused because I have several Biz Plat cards. They're applying for the points to be added back to the account.
Any idea what my chances are?
Just talked to them again through chat and got the card reinstated. I explained that I never intended to close that card, I was just confused because I have several Biz Plat cards. They're applying for the points to be added back to the account.
Any idea what my chances are?
#38
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,802
They reinstated the card, but they didn’t charge the AF again, which had been refunded.
They opened a case, but refused to reinstate the points.
I have since asked them to open another case and to charge the AF again, so that everything will be as before, so that I have a better argument for having the points redeposited as well.
That case is still being worked on, but I’m not holding my breath… Didn’t see any other DPs for this either. Guess I should be lucky that they didn’t shut me down completely.
They opened a case, but refused to reinstate the points.
I have since asked them to open another case and to charge the AF again, so that everything will be as before, so that I have a better argument for having the points redeposited as well.
That case is still being worked on, but I’m not holding my breath… Didn’t see any other DPs for this either. Guess I should be lucky that they didn’t shut me down completely.
#39
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,802
I've tried twice now - they would not budge:
You guys better learn from my mistake...
Per the terms, if the card is closed the welcome bonus will be reversed automatically.
These are the card agreement terms.
And we do understand you have reinstated the card after that, but unfortunately the team do not consider it, because the card was closed.
These are the card agreement terms.
And we do understand you have reinstated the card after that, but unfortunately the team do not consider it, because the card was closed.
#40
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 25
Big mistake
I had a personal gold card last June and accepted a retention offer of 30k points. I forgot I upgraded the card to platinum with an offer of 100k points in October. Annual fee for my card posts in June and I ask amex if there are retention offers. Nothing offered so I cancel card in July. Just found out today my 100k points are gone just 4 months short of the 12 month contract.
not sure if there are any data points on getting this reinstated. Long time member of Amex. Supervisor on chat said nothing he could do for me but will have a manger call me in 2-3 days.
I know its my mistake but I chatted with the reps for like 3 weeks prior to cancelling my card and no one once mentioned that I had an upgrade in October and would lose my points. They only pointed to the retention offer I received in June, so I thought I was safe. This was a total misunderstanding.
not sure if there are any data points on getting this reinstated. Long time member of Amex. Supervisor on chat said nothing he could do for me but will have a manger call me in 2-3 days.
I know its my mistake but I chatted with the reps for like 3 weeks prior to cancelling my card and no one once mentioned that I had an upgrade in October and would lose my points. They only pointed to the retention offer I received in June, so I thought I was safe. This was a total misunderstanding.
#41
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend; Moderator: American Express, Capital One, Citi, Chase, Credit Card Programs, Diners Club, Signatures
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,884
#42
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MSP
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, UA Silver, Hertz 5*
Posts: 911
OP here.
I currently have the EDP still open and its been more than a year since the upgrade bonus of 40K posted to my account. I religiously charged $600-$1000 to it every month since I got the popup.
Recently in my offers section I see the 90K offer to apply for a new Amex Gold card. Says I am preapproved. Does this mean I am out of jail? Any thoughts if I should apply? The offer language does not include the 1 per lifetime offer (important since I have had the Gold card before)
I currently have the EDP still open and its been more than a year since the upgrade bonus of 40K posted to my account. I religiously charged $600-$1000 to it every month since I got the popup.
Recently in my offers section I see the 90K offer to apply for a new Amex Gold card. Says I am preapproved. Does this mean I am out of jail? Any thoughts if I should apply? The offer language does not include the 1 per lifetime offer (important since I have had the Gold card before)
#43
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: DXB
Programs: Marriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, BA Silver, A3 Gold, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 2,802
I now have five Biz Plat and two Biz Gold cards, if that answers your question. All with a signup bonus. Got one Biz Plat and one Biz Gold after the points were clawed back.
No idea if that means anything for your case or how risky it is though…
No idea if that means anything for your case or how risky it is though…
#44
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MSP
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, UA Silver, Hertz 5*
Posts: 911
OP here.
I currently have the EDP still open and its been more than a year since the upgrade bonus of 40K posted to my account. I religiously charged $600-$1000 to it every month since I got the popup.
Recently in my offers section I see the 90K offer to apply for a new Amex Gold card. Says I am preapproved. Does this mean I am out of jail? Any thoughts if I should apply? The offer language does not include the 1 per lifetime offer (important since I have had the Gold card before)
I currently have the EDP still open and its been more than a year since the upgrade bonus of 40K posted to my account. I religiously charged $600-$1000 to it every month since I got the popup.
Recently in my offers section I see the 90K offer to apply for a new Amex Gold card. Says I am preapproved. Does this mean I am out of jail? Any thoughts if I should apply? The offer language does not include the 1 per lifetime offer (important since I have had the Gold card before)
#45
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 539
I believe you mentioned in your first post that you had the Amex Gold before and closed it. Did the application for this 90K offer not have the usual lifetime language limitation?