Newly enrolled in MR. Denied Points Purchase until 1,000 points earned.
Jan 25, 2015, 3:34 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
Newly enrolled in MR. Denied Points Purchase until 1,000 points earned.
Anyone else get hit by this or does it just suck to be me?
I was hoping to take advantage of the Membership rewards 40% bonus to transfer points to BA Avios by the end of the month. I have a Traditional Gold Card that I have had for ages that is eligible for MR but I've never used MR before. I went to the MR website and they charged me $40 to enroll the card in MR - OK done. I call to purchase points to transfer and the first Rep can't process it but isn't quite sure why it failed. I call the next day and got a seemingly helpful Rep who tries, fails, puts me on hold to check with someone else, then tells me that AMEX won't allow me to purchase points for the transfer because they have a policy that MR accounts must either be open for 6 months or have a 1000 point or higher balance (if the MR account has been open for less than 6 months) in order to be able to purchase MR points for a transfer. HELLO... Why did they take $40 from me to enroll my card if they knew they were not going to let me use it?
I have another Hilton AMEX which I have used for spend but evidently that doesn't count for anything to AMEX. My Traditional Gold Card account has been open for years I just have not used that card for spend in a couple of years. It feels like they are scamming me. The old bait and switch. We'll sell you a MR enrollment to use - but we'll switch you to one you can't use for 6 months without telling you.
Needless to say I'm a bit upset with AMEX at this point.
Is this a real policy? Does it only apply to certain cards? I searched a bit but didn't find anyone else who has run into this problem. Two agents couldn't process a point purchase for me so there must be some reason but I'm suspicious about it since I haven't heard of anyone else who has run into this problem.
I guess now my best option is to put some spend on the card (grrr), wait a year and hope for another 40% BA transfer bonus. Thanks for nothing AMEX.
I was hoping to take advantage of the Membership rewards 40% bonus to transfer points to BA Avios by the end of the month. I have a Traditional Gold Card that I have had for ages that is eligible for MR but I've never used MR before. I went to the MR website and they charged me $40 to enroll the card in MR - OK done. I call to purchase points to transfer and the first Rep can't process it but isn't quite sure why it failed. I call the next day and got a seemingly helpful Rep who tries, fails, puts me on hold to check with someone else, then tells me that AMEX won't allow me to purchase points for the transfer because they have a policy that MR accounts must either be open for 6 months or have a 1000 point or higher balance (if the MR account has been open for less than 6 months) in order to be able to purchase MR points for a transfer. HELLO... Why did they take $40 from me to enroll my card if they knew they were not going to let me use it?
I have another Hilton AMEX which I have used for spend but evidently that doesn't count for anything to AMEX. My Traditional Gold Card account has been open for years I just have not used that card for spend in a couple of years. It feels like they are scamming me. The old bait and switch. We'll sell you a MR enrollment to use - but we'll switch you to one you can't use for 6 months without telling you.
Needless to say I'm a bit upset with AMEX at this point.
Is this a real policy? Does it only apply to certain cards? I searched a bit but didn't find anyone else who has run into this problem. Two agents couldn't process a point purchase for me so there must be some reason but I'm suspicious about it since I haven't heard of anyone else who has run into this problem.
I guess now my best option is to put some spend on the card (grrr), wait a year and hope for another 40% BA transfer bonus. Thanks for nothing AMEX.
Jan 25, 2015, 4:07 pm
#2
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AS, US, Hilton, BA, DL, SPG, AA, VS
Posts: 1,628
Jan 25, 2015, 4:30 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
They should expect that at least one person will want to use every feature they advertise, shouldn't they? Maybe not me specifically, but they should have expected someone would try it. If a feature is not available they shouldn't advertise it.
Jan 25, 2015, 5:30 pm
#4
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Bellingham, WA
Programs: AMEX Platinum, Delta Gold, Alaska Air MVP Gold
Posts: 449
It's available. Just after 6 months or once you reach 1,000 points. Now, once you've reached either of those your $40 will be well worth it. In all actuality you should have read all the terms and conditions. Don't need to blame it on Amex for your failure to research what you were signing up for.
Jan 25, 2015, 5:33 pm
#5
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Not here; there!
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 29,584
Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry: BlackBerry8530/5.0.0.1030 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/417)
So, would you prefer to dis-enroll your card and get the $40 back? If so, have you asked Amex if they will do that for you?
Originally Posted by skimthetrees
They should expect that at least one person will want to use every feature they advertise, shouldn't they? Maybe not me specifically, but they should have expected someone would try it. If a feature is not available they shouldn't advertise it.
Jan 25, 2015, 6:48 pm
#6
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
It's available. Just after 6 months or once you reach 1,000 points. Now, once you've reached either of those your $40 will be well worth it. In all actuality you should have read all the terms and conditions. Don't need to blame it on Amex for your failure to research what you were signing up for.
Jan 25, 2015, 6:58 pm
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
I suspect they would do it for me if I asked but you might not have noticed that I mentioned putting some spend on the card as another option. I think what they are doing is deceptive and wrong and there might be a government agency that could look into their practice and find fault with it but I do see some potential value in the benefits if they actually allowed me to use what they were advertising and what I paid for.
Jan 25, 2015, 10:21 pm
#10
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
Who did you see who suggested threatening litigation? I'm not interested in that. I just want to buy some points and AMEX won't let me.
Jan 26, 2015, 3:16 am
#11
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,954
If your telephone discussions with American Express were over the weekend I would try again today or tomorrow during normal EST business hours, emphasizing to the Manager that your card account is not new, it simply was not previously enrolled in Membership Rewards. It sounds as if the system is programmed to treat new Membership Rewards accounts as new card accounts because American Express no longer issues personal cards with optional rewards. (Your Hilton card history is immaterial because it is does not participate in Membership Rewards, but it can be used to explain why your Gold card account has been dormant. The computer won't care, but a Manager who must approve an exception might.)
Jan 26, 2015, 3:48 am
#12
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Tyrone,EU
Programs: Avios Hunter
Posts: 2,811
I suspect they would do it for me if I asked but you might not have noticed that I mentioned putting some spend on the card as another option. I think what they are doing is deceptive and wrong and there might be a government agency that could look into their practice and find fault with it but I do see some potential value in the benefits if they actually allowed me to use what they were advertising and what I paid for.
1) You saw an offer was available that Amex would give people with existing MR balances a 40% uplift on transfers to BA.
2) You thought, I'll open a new MR account buy some MRs, to transfer to BA, and thus effectively buy those BA avios at a relative discount
3) It cost you $40. You found that the T&C don't allow new account holders to buy MRs, i.e. it didn't work out for you as intended.
4) You more than likely have the option of closing that MR account, getting your $40 back, and thus other than a bit of time and disappointment, you could decide to take a path that would result in the experience costing you nothing.
I have no idea about this policy, but it looks to me like something that might have been put in place due to previous card holders being deceptive and signing up for MR accounts just to take advantage of particular offers that were intended for people with existing MR balances, such as transfer bonuses.
Before you go down the path of manufacturing a situation that allows you to buy points, just be absolutely sure that your newly created MR account is eligible for the MR bonus transfer offer. It's possible it only applies to people that got the offer, or to accounts that were open and active at the time the offer was announced. You don't want to end up in a position where you buy significant points, transfer they to BA, and end up NOT getting the 40% uplift.
I'm all for attempting to use loopholes/exploits to advantage where reasonably possible, but I'm also prepare to accept when things don't work as I'd hope, given that I might not be aware of every rule/condition that apply to those circumstances.
Last edited by tangey; Jan 26, 2015 at 4:04 am
Jan 26, 2015, 10:54 am
#13
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Programs: UA, AS
Posts: 2,393
jft3 is suggesting that you spend $1,000 to satisfy the requirement that you earn 1,000 points, pay the $1,000 bill, and then ask American Express to accelerate posting of those 1,000 points. (There is no longer a Points Advance feature, which allowed members to borrow points not yet earned.) This idea will not work unless the your billing date happens to fall in, say, the middle of this week, because in the USA version of Membership Rewards points from the current billing cycle will not even appear in the Pending category until the billing cycle ends.
If your telephone discussions with American Express were over the weekend I would try again today or tomorrow during normal EST business hours, emphasizing to the Manager that your card account is not new, it simply was not previously enrolled in Membership Rewards. It sounds as if the system is programmed to treat new Membership Rewards accounts as new card accounts because American Express no longer issues personal cards with optional rewards. (Your Hilton card history is immaterial because it is does not participate in Membership Rewards, but it can be used to explain why your Gold card account has been dormant. The computer won't care, but a Manager who must approve an exception might.)
If your telephone discussions with American Express were over the weekend I would try again today or tomorrow during normal EST business hours, emphasizing to the Manager that your card account is not new, it simply was not previously enrolled in Membership Rewards. It sounds as if the system is programmed to treat new Membership Rewards accounts as new card accounts because American Express no longer issues personal cards with optional rewards. (Your Hilton card history is immaterial because it is does not participate in Membership Rewards, but it can be used to explain why your Gold card account has been dormant. The computer won't care, but a Manager who must approve an exception might.)
I did emphasize to the rep that my account was not new and he did check with a manager however the manager said since there had not been any spend on the card in a long time (I guess they don't count annual fees?) there was nothing they would offer to do. Unfortunately for me my billing cycle won't end for about 3 more weeks so I doubt even with spend today they would be able to help. I've resigned at this point just to wait it out.
The timeline of this events appear to be
1) You saw an offer was available that Amex would give people with existing MR balances a 40% uplift on transfers to BA.
2) You thought, I'll open a new MR account buy some MRs, to transfer to BA, and thus effectively buy those BA avios at a relative discount
3) It cost you $40. You found that the T&C don't allow new account holders to buy MRs, i.e. it didn't work out for you as intended.
4) You more than likely have the option of closing that MR account, getting your $40 back, and thus other than a bit of time and disappointment, you could decide to take a path that would result in the experience costing you nothing.
I have no idea about this policy, but it looks to me like something that might have been put in place due to previous card holders being deceptive and signing up for MR accounts just to take advantage of particular offers that were intended for people with existing MR balances, such as transfer bonuses.
Before you go down the path of manufacturing a situation that allows you to buy points, just be absolutely sure that your newly created MR account is eligible for the MR bonus transfer offer. It's possible it only applies to people that got the offer, or to accounts that were open and active at the time the offer was announced. You don't want to end up in a position where you buy significant points, transfer they to BA, and end up NOT getting the 40% uplift.
I'm all for attempting to use loopholes/exploits to advantage where reasonably possible, but I'm also prepare to accept when things don't work as I'd hope, given that I might not be aware of every rule/condition that apply to those circumstances.
1) You saw an offer was available that Amex would give people with existing MR balances a 40% uplift on transfers to BA.
2) You thought, I'll open a new MR account buy some MRs, to transfer to BA, and thus effectively buy those BA avios at a relative discount
3) It cost you $40. You found that the T&C don't allow new account holders to buy MRs, i.e. it didn't work out for you as intended.
4) You more than likely have the option of closing that MR account, getting your $40 back, and thus other than a bit of time and disappointment, you could decide to take a path that would result in the experience costing you nothing.
I have no idea about this policy, but it looks to me like something that might have been put in place due to previous card holders being deceptive and signing up for MR accounts just to take advantage of particular offers that were intended for people with existing MR balances, such as transfer bonuses.
Before you go down the path of manufacturing a situation that allows you to buy points, just be absolutely sure that your newly created MR account is eligible for the MR bonus transfer offer. It's possible it only applies to people that got the offer, or to accounts that were open and active at the time the offer was announced. You don't want to end up in a position where you buy significant points, transfer they to BA, and end up NOT getting the 40% uplift.
I'm all for attempting to use loopholes/exploits to advantage where reasonably possible, but I'm also prepare to accept when things don't work as I'd hope, given that I might not be aware of every rule/condition that apply to those circumstances.
2) I'd never used MR so I thought naively that either a card had it or it didn't and that I'd just be able to purchase points right away. It wasn't until I went exploring to find out how to use MR that I found out on the amex web site that I needed to enroll my card which I decided to do based on the benefits that amex advertises.
3) It cost me $40 which I was happy to pay for the benefits they showed. It didn't work out because they wouldn't allow me the benefits advertised. I didn't see anything in the T&C about the limitation the rep mentioned.
Here is a link to the T&C: https://rewards.americanexpress.com/...v=footer-tandc
I looked through and don't see any such condition. There are some that are similar such as a 1000 point minimum for using points to pay for charges, but nothing like what the rep claimed to me for purchasing points for a transfer. Maybe I am just missing it. If you can find it in there I would appreciate you pointing me to it because I just couldn't find it even after looking quite a bit.
4) I've pointed out earlier in the thread that I believe AMEX would refund my $40 but that's not my goal. I want to use the MR program. Getting a refund will just set me back farther. I want to move forward.
I didn't think I was attempting to take advantage of a loophole. I just wanted to use the program as described and it didn't work. It looks like there are some unwritten or new AMEX Terms & Conditions preventing me from doing that until I jump through some of their hoops. This got me a little upset for a while. Since I want to use the program I will work to satisfy their conditions. I wish they had been more open about it (I still can't find anything in writing that describes it). It doesn't seem right to me but it is what it is.
I know I'm going to be too late to qualify for the existing bonus offer. At this point I'm aiming to qualify the account for future offers. Thanks for your advice. I think I know what I need to do now. Being able to draw on the experience here is very helpful.