Q3 2023 10Q revised deliveries

Old Oct 23, 2023, 9:35 pm
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Q3 2023 10Q revised deliveries

Buried in the 3rd quarter 10Q statement is an updated delivery schedule for the next 5 years. Particularly of note is that the 789's will be spread out more and only 11 will be delivered in 2024 and 2025, versus previously planned 21. The total number is still 30, but back weighted. It's unclear how many 321XLRs are included in the A320Neo count of 3 in 2024 and 21 in 2025 since there are 50 on order, but the 10Q shows 64 general 320neo, so some of those will be 321neos. And either way, this also probably means the A321Ts won't get their refurbs until well into 2025 when there are enough XLRs to replace them.


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Old Oct 23, 2023, 9:47 pm
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Originally Posted by PHL
Buried in the 3rd quarter 10Q statement is an updated delivery schedule for the next 5 years. Particularly of note is that the 789's will be spread out more and only 11 will be delivered in 2024 and 2025, versus previously planned 21. The total number is still 30, but back weighted. It's unclear how many 321XLRs are included in the A320Neo count of 3 in 2024 and 21 in 2025 since there are 50 on order, but the 10Q shows 64 general 320neo, so some of those will be 321neos. And either way, this also probably means the A321Ts won't get their refurbs until well into 2025 when there are enough XLRs to replace them.


Wasnt AA trying to convince us they were short widebodies?
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 2:54 am
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Originally Posted by Cledaybuck
Wasnt AA trying to convince us they were short widebodies?
Sure, but I think all airlines are seeing travel demand start to drop. Makes sense to think long term.
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 6:29 am
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Originally Posted by Cledaybuck
Wasnt AA trying to convince us they were short widebodies?
Yep, they loudly proclaimed this to anybody who would listen -- just a matter of months after storing their relatively modern, comfortable, and capable fleet of A330-200s.

Gosh, I miss those planes every time I look at a coach seat map for the 777s or 787s.
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 7:22 am
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Originally Posted by Cledaybuck
Wasnt AA trying to convince us they were short widebodies?
I assume with interest rates shooting up debt repayment is now a higher priority.
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 8:00 am
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Originally Posted by murphy
I assume with interest rates shooting up debt repayment is now a higher priority.
I don't know much about corporate debt, but couldn't some (or all?) of it be fixed rate and therefore not affected by rising rates? Kind of like my mortgage that I'm happy to not have done a variable rate on my 2018 purchase.....
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 8:24 pm
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Corporate debt typically has a floating rate
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Old Oct 24, 2023, 9:28 pm
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Originally Posted by aj_potc
Yep, they loudly proclaimed this to anybody who would listen -- just a matter of months after storing their relatively modern, comfortable, and capable fleet of A330-200s.
Heck, airlines are bringing back aircraft like the a380 and 744 that were being dumped for being inefficient due to a lack of airframes. It's absolutely bonkers that these a332s were still being paid for while sitting around collecting dust. Typical of short sighted management from AA.

On a avgeek side, I miss seeing the a330s as well. They are good looking aircraft.
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Old Oct 25, 2023, 8:13 am
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I have to imagine there was a lot of internal debate on bringing back the A330's when post-pandemic travel came back with a fury that nobody seemed to anticipate, even when the 787 deliveries were delayed for ~18 months by Boeing. Did the braintrust at AA HQ really determine that the total costs to get them airworthy along with pilot/crew re-training + ongoing operational costs would not make it worth it for a relatively small sub-fleet? Even a month ago they doubled down following rumors about the 330 returning and reiterated they are not coming back from the dead. They're all in on the 787/777 fleet for widebody flying.
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Old Oct 25, 2023, 10:09 am
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Originally Posted by PHL
I don't know much about corporate debt, but couldn't some (or all?) of it be fixed rate and therefore not affected by rising rates? Kind of like my mortgage that I'm happy to not have done a variable rate on my 2018 purchase.....
They have a mix of fixed and variable, theres some details in the 10Q linked in the top post. The variable has obviously gotten much more expensive, but its been somewhat offset by increased interest income on their short term cash, so increasing fuel costs are probably more important.
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Old Oct 25, 2023, 7:19 pm
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IIRC, before Airbus pushed back delivery of the 321XLR, AA vwas suppose to receive 6 this year. Which leads me to believe they won't be coming online until late next year if AA will only be receiving 3 now in 2024. Also I believe there are only 15 or 16 321Ts in the fleet (wasn't one written off?). So, those all could be converted to regular 321s before the end of 2025. Maybe after the summer season.

I hope the pushback of 789 deliveries doesn't mean the 773 refurbs won't begin in 2025 as planned. Worst MCE sections in AA's widebody fleet.
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Old Oct 25, 2023, 10:05 pm
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Originally Posted by Fanjet
I hope the pushback of 789 deliveries doesn't mean the 773 refurbs won't begin in 2025 as planned. Worst MCE sections in AA's widebody fleet.
How would the refurb improve MCE other than shift it back a few rows?
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Old Oct 27, 2023, 7:13 pm
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Originally Posted by PHL
How would the refurb improve MCE other than shift it back a few rows?
How can you move it back? It's already in the last section of the coach cabin after Doors 4L/R. United puts their 773 Y+ section after Doors 3 L/R and offers more rows with window seats. AA just offers the bulkhead row for MCE after Doors 3 L/R.

On another note, I just read on the interwebs that AA will be acquirng AS's 10 (now pulled from service) A321neos. These were VX birds originally; and I believe the first 321neo deliveries from Airbus a few years ago. I believe VX flew these to Hawaii, so they should be ETOPS certified. However, they have the original 321 door configurations. So, I wonder how AA will label these on their website. 32Q like the other neos? But that will cause confusion with the different 321neo seat layout. 321H, maybe, if they are still ETOPS certified and they will have the same seat layout. I'm assuming they will be delivered to AA before years end. But this may be very recent news since they do not show up on their future deliveries schedule published last week for 2023 or 2024.
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Old Oct 27, 2023, 9:56 pm
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Originally Posted by Fanjet
On another note, I just read on the interwebs that AA will be acquirng AS's 10 (now pulled from service) A321neos. These were VX birds originally; and I believe the first 321neo deliveries from Airbus a few years ago. I believe VX flew these to Hawaii, so they should be ETOPS certified. However, they have the original 321 door configurations. So, I wonder how AA will label these on their website. 32Q like the other neos? But that will cause confusion with the different 321neo seat layout. 321H, maybe, if they are still ETOPS certified and they will have the same seat layout. I'm assuming they will be delivered to AA before years end. But this may be very recent news since they do not show up on their future deliveries schedule published last week for 2023 or 2024.
The AS/VX 321s are mentioned as a footnote in the Q, just two footnotes below what was posted in the OP. They're not listed with the new aircraft purchases because, well, they're used. If I'm reading the note correctly, all should be in the AA fleet in the next ~90 days.

On the interior config, it is rumored (and likely true) that they will receive the CEO Kodiak (or its successor's) layout and be mixed in with the A321ceo fleet because of the door layout. However, they are not getting reconfigured until late 2024, so they may end up with a different layout altogether if something is announced. They will initially fly with AA paint and the same cabin layout they had with AS. (I'm sure they'll recover the seats and change the placards, etc. etc.)
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Old Oct 30, 2023, 11:27 am
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Originally Posted by JBKettle
The AS/VX 321s are mentioned as a footnote in the Q, just two footnotes below what was posted in the OP. They're not listed with the new aircraft purchases because, well, they're used. If I'm reading the note correctly, all should be in the AA fleet in the next ~90 days.

On the interior config, it is rumored (and likely true) that they will receive the CEO Kodiak (or its successor's) layout and be mixed in with the A321ceo fleet because of the door layout. However, they are not getting reconfigured until late 2024,
16F and 174Y seats vs 20F 170Y. Net is still 190 total seats (CEO config), so either 4 people in F will be bumped back to Y in an AA->AS equipment swap, or 4 people will be bumped forward (i.e. 4 more elites would potentially get upgraded) in the reverse scenario.
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