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Crowd source: let's create the best AA seating plans out there

Crowd source: let's create the best AA seating plans out there

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Old Feb 16, 21, 11:06 pm   -   Wikipost
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Old Jul 1, 20, 3:39 pm
  #1  
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges and Carbon Conscious Travel
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Location: London, UK
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Arrow Crowd source: let's create the best AA seating plans out there

There is a chunk of info available on AA.com covering every crevice of American Airlines, the company, the fleet, the lounges... but the art and beauty of the aircraft seating plan so prevalent in the 1980/90s seems lost today. This is a terrible shame. So... I set to work....

Putting two days of lockdown to good use I have now produced LOPA (layout of passenger accommodation) diagrams for the Dreamliners, complete with the critical details frequently asked about on FT, such as how close will I be to the lavs and does my A seat suffer from a window blank?

The next step is the 777, which now underway, but for this I could use your help. What I wish to do is upload some draft layouts during the week ahead and ask the collective to scrutinise the detail, share your cabin photos, or memories of the now standard 37J two-hundred ERs.


Onto the modern day LuxuryLiners...

Boeing 777-200ER

image: newsavia.com

AA's fleet of Boeing 777-200ERs is divided into two configurations. Both types are configured 37J 24W 212M but have different seat products installed in the Business Class cabins. Nineteen aircraft are fitted with Zodiac "Concept D" seats and twenty-eight with Collins Super Diamond seats

Version 1
Seat types:
Flagship Business: Safran (formerly Zodiac) Concept D configured 1-2-1 with alternating forward/backward facing seats; 15.4" screens
Premium Economy: Collins Aerospace MiQ with 38" pitch; 11.5" screens
Main Cabin Extra: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 2-4-2 with a 34" pitch; 9" screens
Main Cabin: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 3-4-3 with a 31" pitch; 9" screens


Tech:
Wifi: Panasonic high speed satellite wifi
IFE: Panasonic eX2 AVOD in-flight entertainment system with Live TV


Sub fleet of 19
N751AN, N752AN, N754AN, N756AM, N757AN, N759AN, N760AN, N761AJ, N765AN, N768AA, N770AN, N773AN, N774AN, N781AN, N782AN, N785AN, N788AN, N795AN, and N798AN





Version 2
Seat types:
Flagship Business: Collins Aerospace Super Diamond configured 1-2-1; 15.4" screens
Premium Economy: Collins Aerospace MiQ with a 38" pitch; 11.5" screens
Main Cabin Extra: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 2-4-2 with a 34" pitch; 9" screens
Main Cabin: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 3-4-3 with a 31" pitch; 9" screens


Tech:
Wifi: Panasonic high speed satellite wifi
IFE: Panasonic eX2 AVOD in-flight entertainment system with Live TV


Sub fleet of 28
N750AN, N753AN, N755AN, N758AN, N762AN, N766AN, N767AJ, N771AN, N772AN, N775AN, N776AN, N777AN, N778AN, N779AN, N780AN, N783AN, N784AN, N786AN, N787AL, N789AN, N790AN, N791AN, N792AN, N793AN, N794AN, N796AN, N797AN, and N799AN





Boeing 777-300ER

image: American Airlines

Also referred to as the 77W, American Airlines has a fleet of twenty, configured 8F 52J 28W 216M

Seat types:
Flagship First: Safran (formerly Zodiac) Flagship Suite, configured 1-2-1
Flagship Business: Safran (formerly Zodiac) Cirrus II, configured 1-2-1; 15.4" screens
Premium Economy: Collins Aerospace MiQ with a 38" pitch; 11.5" screens
Main Cabin Extra: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 2-4-2 with a 34" pitch; 9" screens
Main Cabin: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 3-4-3 with a 31" pitch; 9" screens


Tech:
Wifi: Panasonic high speed satellite wifi
IFE: Panasonic eX2 AVOD in-flight entertainment system with Live TV


Fleet of 20
N717AN, N718AN, N719AN, N720AN, N721AN, N722AN, N723AN, N724AN, N725AN, N726AN, N727AN, N728AN, N729AN, N730AN, N731AN, N732AN, N733AR, N734AR, N735AT, and N736AT





Boeing 787-8

image: American Airlines

American's 787-8 is configured 20J 28W 186M

Seat types:
Flagship Business: Safran (formerly Zodiac) Concept D configured 1-2-1 with alternating forward/backward facing seats; 15.4" screens
Premium Economy: Collins Aerospace MiQ with 38" pitch; 11.5" screens
Main Cabin Extra: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 2-4-2 with a 34" pitch; 9" screens
Main Cabin: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 3-4-3 with a 31" pitch; 9" screens


Tech:
Wifi: Panasonic high speed satellite wifi
IFE: Panasonic eX2 AVOD in-flight entertainment system with Live TV


Fleet of 20
N800AN, N801AC, N802AN, N803AL, N804AN, N805AN, N806AA, N807AA, N808AN, N809AA, N810AN, N811AB, N812AA, N813AN, N814AA, N815AA, N816AA, N817AL, and N819AN





Boeing 787-9

image: American Airlines

American's 787-9 is configured 30J 21W 234M

Seat types:
Flagship Business: Collins Aerospace Super Diamond configured 1-2-1; 15.4" screens
Premium Economy: Collins Aerospace MiQ with a 38" pitch; 11.5" screens
Main Cabin Extra: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 2-4-2 with a 34" pitch; 9" screens
Main Cabin: Safran (formerly Weber) 5751 slimline seats configured 3-4-3 with a 31" pitch; 9" screens


Tech:
Wifi: Panasonic high speed satellite wifi
IFE: Panasonic eX2 AVOD in-flight entertainment system with Live TV


Fleet of 22
N820AL, N821AN, N822AN, N823AN, N824AN, N825AA, N826AN, N827AN, N828AA, N829AN, N830AN, N831AA, N832AA, N833AA, N834AA, N835AN, N836AA, N837AN, N838AA, N839AA, N840AN, AND N841AN



Last edited by Prospero; Oct 18, 20 at 8:23 am Reason: Add 772/773 maps
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Old Jul 1, 20, 7:04 pm
  #2  
 
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How does your proposal differ in a meaningful way (i.e., useful to passengers deciding which seat to book) from what seatguru.com offers?
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Old Jul 1, 20, 8:58 pm
  #3  
 
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Originally Posted by AndyPatterson View Post
How does your proposal differ in a meaningful way (i.e., useful to passengers deciding which seat to book) from what seatguru.com offers?
If it's accurate that would be a big improvement.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 6:47 am
  #4  
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Originally Posted by FlyingEgghead View Post
If it's accurate that would be a big improvement.
Yes, this is very much the principle aim.

AA's seat maps are highly abstract and basically tell us the number of rows in each cabin and the number of seats per row;
Seat Guru gives a better picture but isn't entirely accurate - it is laced with errors;
AA does have detailed internal LOPA diagrams which are drawn to scale, show not only accurate seat positions but also coat cupboards, galley equipment. Airlines are highly reluctant to share their LOPA diagrams (for obvious reasons) but the aim here is to develop maps that are dimensionally correct (as far a possible) and ultimately maps we can all rely on.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 9:11 am
  #5  
 
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Here is an idea: Flyertalk takes over seatguru. The seat maps on seatguru could be updated with the images Prospero shared.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 9:36 am
  #6  
 
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Interesting. One nit: shouldn't row 24 on the 789 be highlighted as MCE?
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Old Jul 2, 20, 9:50 am
  #7  
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Originally Posted by Prospero View Post
Seat Guru gives a better picture but isn't entirely accurate - it is laced with errors;
.
Very diplomatic!

What I would like to see is info on

seat pitch and width

and with the toilets the actual number of cubicles in each bank and which have baby change facilties

basinette seat locations


And if it can be done without cluttering (so maybe remove the technical info) what seat power / IFE is available
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Old Jul 2, 20, 10:32 am
  #8  
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This seems like a worthy project. You must have some graphic design experience, because you seem to have followed the brand guidelines quite well.

AA has 787-8s being delivered with a different business class seat that is not forward/backwards, but they maintained the same general layout so that they can swap airframes easily. SeatGuru no longer lists both airframe types (because it is impossible to tell which one you will get without the tail number). I know the 772s have the same deal; some have Zodiac and some have B/E seats, though the overall layout is the same.

I especially appreciate that you included the layout of the curtains to divide the cabins -- it is odd to me that when seated in W you have to walk back to Y (through a curtain) to get to a lavatory.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 12:11 pm
  #9  
 
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Originally Posted by UKtravelbear View Post
Very diplomatic!

What I would like to see is info on

seat pitch and width

and with the toilets the actual number of cubicles in each bank and which have baby change facilties

basinette seat locations


And if it can be done without cluttering (so maybe remove the technical info) what seat power / IFE is available
Add in which of the lavs are above average size, especially the larger one that's usually in the J cabin.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 12:14 pm
  #10  
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Originally Posted by VFR View Post
You must have some graphic design experience, because you seem to have followed the brand guidelines quite well.
Agreed. I like how he kept the font consistent with AA branding font.
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Old Jul 2, 20, 2:07 pm
  #11  
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Prospero has way more than “some graphic design experience”, and I’ll leave it at that. He’s the designer of the dashboard icons / widgets used in several fora (we have a Covid-related dashboard sticky thread here), and IMO we’re very fortunate he’s so generous with his considerable skills. (We began with an ambitious dashboard goal here, but I was the one working with those here - cataracts slowed that effort down, and when those were removed, I found out I had irreparable macular pucker / surface wrinkling retinopathy that can’t be aided by surgery or glasses and interfere with my near vision, so my effort had to be scaled back.)

SeatGuru was purchased by Trip Advisor some time ago, and personally I think they never developed clear goals relating to maximizing and monetizing SeatGuru, which is riven with errors and in particular outdated information. SeatExpert seemed as if it would be the go-to place for this kind of information, but after it was sold, it became apparent that wouldn’t happen.

I’m happy to use my moderation efforts to aid this effort any way I can. I’m excited by the opportunity to have the best graphic LOPA representations to inform our members right here on FlyerTalk! Thank you, merci, terima kasih, vinaka, danke and more, Prospero.
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Old Jul 3, 20, 3:52 pm
  #12  
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges and Carbon Conscious Travel
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Originally Posted by Mr. BoH View Post
Interesting. One nit: shouldn't row 24 on the 789 be highlighted as MCE?
Thank you, this is great feedback. I have updated the 787-9 seat plan

Originally Posted by UKtravelbear View Post
Very diplomatic!

What I would like to see is info on

seat pitch and width

and with the toilets the actual number of cubicles in each bank and which have baby change facilties

basinette seat locations


And if it can be done without cluttering (so maybe remove the technical info) what seat power / IFE is available
Bassinet locations have been added to the 787-9 seat plan and will incorporate locations into the other plans. Take it as read that all lavatories have a fold down baby change bench - this is now industry standard.
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Old Jul 3, 20, 4:00 pm
  #13  
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Impressive skills Prospero!
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Old Sep 6, 20, 4:31 am
  #14  
Moderator: British Airways Executive Club, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges and Carbon Conscious Travel
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I have now added Boeing 777-200ER seat maps. The job took quite a bit longer than I had originally anticipated ultimately involving collecting almost 100 cabin images, filtering out the obsolete views, counting windows (inside and out), studying YouTube videos, eyeball distances between seats and bulkhead surfaces, recounting windows etc etc.

Tom Beam's fabulous Cabin Tour video was a pure gift from God.

The maps have been developed on a best efforts basis and are not absolutely perfect so if you see anything that does not seem right, please let me know and I will make the necessary corrections.

Oh, I should also mention the background template is not as crisp as I would like. I simply could not find a suitable template available for purchase and ended up splicing two background images - one sourced from Austrian Airlines, the other from Emirates
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Old Sep 6, 20, 9:11 pm
  #15  
 
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Awesome! Do the seats really rotate starting at row 35, i.e., more legroom in 35AL than 35CJ? Or do they stay parallel to the other rows and just shift left-right to follow the tapering fuselage?

Also, since you're labeling at least every 2 rows, it would be good to label the last (partial) row as 40 for clarity.
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