AA and APA / pilot union impasse

Old Jan 29, 20, 4:26 pm
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AA and APA / pilot union impasse

Well, it looks like pilots and the union is starting to get frustrated with the management. They have started picketing at DFW. Also good to see United and Delta pilots joining in... Here is a thread from Dallas Morning news

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/...ort-heres-why/

“Leaders of the Allied Pilots Association, which represents about 14,000 pilots at the Fort Worth-based airline, say company negotiators have moved too slowly, even though both sides had a soft deadline to reach a deal by the beginning of 2020, when the old contract was amendable, said APA spokesman Dennis Tajer.“

Other complaints include what the APA are saying are unfair scheduling and poor operational performance, as well as poor financial performance and profit sharing when compared with Delta and Southwest.
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Last edited by JDiver; Jan 29, 20 at 5:01 pm Reason: Activate URL, add descriptive content per FT Rules
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Old Jan 29, 20, 6:09 pm
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Oh boy!
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Old Jan 29, 20, 7:06 pm
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I wonder to what extent AA's reliability issues are a result of the issues with the mechanic's union. Perhaps AA can dangle a pot of cash in front of the two groups and let them duke it out
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Old Jan 29, 20, 7:29 pm
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I think it's time for Doug Parker to go. It looks light AA bird N955NN is currently getting entertainment system ripped out at tulsa.
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Old Jan 29, 20, 7:36 pm
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Originally Posted by dallaspopo View Post
I think it's time for Doug Parker to go.
I keep seeing this. What will it actually take for the board to act?
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Old Jan 29, 20, 7:50 pm
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Originally Posted by joeyE View Post
I keep seeing this. What will it actually take for the board to act?
I don't believe they will unless AA starting missing revenue forecasts. As much as we [email protected] and moan on here Parker is demonstrating the one thing that matters to the Board...revenue performance.
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Old Jan 29, 20, 8:15 pm
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Deleted on revenue. I know the max situation is hurting them, but when you got pilots/fa/mech pissed off at some point it's going to hurt company a lot
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Old Jan 29, 20, 8:47 pm
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Originally Posted by dallaspopo View Post
I think it's time for Doug Parker to go. It looks light AA bird N955NN is currently getting entertainment system ripped out at tulsa.
Agreed. That said, the next CEO needs to pull an Alan Joyce,a ground the fleet and break the unions.

Both need to go. Let's not forget that the AA unions were all in favor of the merger undercutting Horton and team - they got what they wished for.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 12:03 am
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ahh, unions. things that used to make sense but now do more harm than good.

like pensions, perhaps, although those are proving themselves to be untenable pyramid schemes that half a generation got to exploit.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 1:43 am
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Originally Posted by rill2503456 View Post
I wonder to what extent AA's reliability issues are a result of the issues with the mechanic's union. Perhaps AA can dangle a pot of cash in front of the two groups and let them duke it out
Why should they let the two groups duke it out? How about AA settles with BOTH their unions, and finds the money to do so from somewhere else... Like Doug Parker's compensation. He makes $13,000,000 a year (source), which would pay for 250 mechanics (based on $52,000/yr source). I don't see him contributing 250 heads towards the company's success!

Originally Posted by mctaste View Post
ahh, unions. things that used to make sense but now do more harm than good.
Harm to a Wall Street day trader maybe, but not to the people who need to do the job.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 1:51 am
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Originally Posted by Gig103 View Post
Why should they let the two groups duke it out? How about AA settles with BOTH their unions, and finds the money to do so from somewhere else... Like Doug Parker's compensation. He makes $13,000,000 a year (source), which would pay for 250 mechanics (based on $52,000/yr source). I don't see him contributing 250 heads towards the company's success!



Harm to a Wall Street day trader maybe, but not to the people who need to do the job.
He gets paid in equity (stock-based compensation). Equity is not cash. He is actually saving the company cash.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 6:47 am
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I didn't see any "to be clear, ours was the primary vote securing the merger that put Doug Parker into power" signs among them, but it's much ado about nothing, just typical union negotiations. I'm not sure why they'd imagine Isom would be any different than Doug either.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 9:25 am
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Originally Posted by rumboj View Post
He gets paid in equity (stock-based compensation). Equity is not cash. He is actually saving the company cash.
Stock buybacks under Parker.

~$600,000,000 per year to support the equity price.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 9:51 am
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I have always wonder why you need unions.when the FAA sets the guidelines anyway...'(yeah I am sure unions were needed in the early 1900.
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Old Jan 30, 20, 11:03 am
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Originally Posted by fotographer View Post
I have always wonder why you need unions.when the FAA sets the guidelines anyway...'(yeah I am sure unions were needed in the early 1900.
There is so many things in the contract that exist outside FAA standards that make the job bearable. Min day, trip duty rigs, so many reserve rules, scheduling rules, ASAP guys , foqua gatekeeper, representation when doing a carpet dance, rules about bidding, displacements, base closures and openings. Rules for training, hotel committee, theres just so many things in this industry that the union has a hand in. Company will abuse any hole they can find in the contract or even straight up ignore it so I'm glad i have a team backing me up who can contest something and either get compensation or RDO etc.

FAA rules are basically far 117s 7 28 and 365 lookback.
FAA would let them do 12-16 hour reserve periods 6 days on then 30hours off to Infinity if the company wanted to.
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