AA Refused to sell me 1st Class Seat - terrible experience
Jan 18, 2020, 8:33 am
#61
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 790
All the airlines have decided that their top priority is getting the plane out on times. All systems are designed around meeting this goal and all agents are trained to make this their top goal. I assume they have figured out that the additional revenue at the expense of a flight delay isn’t economically worthwhile. At any given time it is totally possible that selling the ticket makes sense but systemization doesn’t really work like that. Easy to complain but the average passenger benefits from all these rules. American has denoted those passengers that are profitable enough to break rules for and made them CK.
all airlines pretty much run under the same premise though arguably delta gives more autonomy in decision making to agents. If you want to get around rules you have to learn how this is what FF is all about.
Right or wrong this is the world of flying these days. If you want to switch airlines delta is the best but still has plenty of issues
all airlines pretty much run under the same premise though arguably delta gives more autonomy in decision making to agents. If you want to get around rules you have to learn how this is what FF is all about.
Right or wrong this is the world of flying these days. If you want to switch airlines delta is the best but still has plenty of issues
Jan 18, 2020, 12:16 pm
#63
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The agent is evaluated on getting plane off the gate on time. The agent is probably does not measured on selling tickets. Assuming the agent acts rationally, why would anyone expect to prioritize selling a new ticket compared to insuring the plane leaves on time?
I can understand why the OP is upset. However, the airlines have created metrics such as D0 etc so they can measure performance. These metrics either directly or indirectly impact revenue, profitability, customer satisfaction etc. One could make a point that delaying a flight with 150 or so people on board do they can sell one $730 ticket may not be the best result. That delay could negatively impact customer satisfaction on the OP’s flight plus possibly an incoming flight. Also, if the OP’s flight is delayed by the ticket purchase, it may cause inbound passengers a misconnect which may cost AA more than the $730 in revenue.
I can understand why the OP is upset. However, the airlines have created metrics such as D0 etc so they can measure performance. These metrics either directly or indirectly impact revenue, profitability, customer satisfaction etc. One could make a point that delaying a flight with 150 or so people on board do they can sell one $730 ticket may not be the best result. That delay could negatively impact customer satisfaction on the OP’s flight plus possibly an incoming flight. Also, if the OP’s flight is delayed by the ticket purchase, it may cause inbound passengers a misconnect which may cost AA more than the $730 in revenue.
Jan 18, 2020, 12:34 pm
#64
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The agent is evaluated on getting plane off the gate on time. The agent is probably does not measured on selling tickets. Assuming the agent acts rationally, why would anyone expect to prioritize selling a new ticket compared to insuring the plane leaves on time?
I can understand why the OP is upset. However, the airlines have created metrics such as D0 etc so they can measure performance. These metrics either directly or indirectly impact revenue, profitability, customer satisfaction etc. One could make a point that delaying a flight with 150 or so people on board do they can sell one $730 ticket may not be the best result. That delay could negatively impact customer satisfaction on the OP’s flight plus possibly an incoming flight. Also, if the OP’s flight is delayed by the ticket purchase, it may cause inbound passengers a misconnect which may cost AA more than the $730 in revenue.
I can understand why the OP is upset. However, the airlines have created metrics such as D0 etc so they can measure performance. These metrics either directly or indirectly impact revenue, profitability, customer satisfaction etc. One could make a point that delaying a flight with 150 or so people on board do they can sell one $730 ticket may not be the best result. That delay could negatively impact customer satisfaction on the OP’s flight plus possibly an incoming flight. Also, if the OP’s flight is delayed by the ticket purchase, it may cause inbound passengers a misconnect which may cost AA more than the $730 in revenue.
"Ok I call AA customer service. They cannot sell me a ticket as there is a 2 hour "processing time" for phone purchases and tickets have to be bought at ticket counter. Run down to the ticket counter. They verify there are 4 empty 1st class seats, no upgraders. Ok, sell one to me... nope. Standy cannot be changed. That includes a standby pax buying a new ticket. So the airplane flew with 4 empty 1st class seats." (Bolding added.)
Jan 18, 2020, 5:52 pm
#65
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I am not a gate/ticket agent, but if I worked in HQ I'd want to fire the person personally who denied the company a very large sale & a happier customer.
This is not a hard process, simply cancel the standby listing (or instruct the pax to cancel themselves) and then sell them a new ticket.
There is a reason AA ranks almost if not completely last in many categories yet my parent company continues to lead the pack, and yes, front-line employees can make all the difference between the airline getting thousands a year in business or seeing it going to your competitor.
This is not a hard process, simply cancel the standby listing (or instruct the pax to cancel themselves) and then sell them a new ticket.
There is a reason AA ranks almost if not completely last in many categories yet my parent company continues to lead the pack, and yes, front-line employees can make all the difference between the airline getting thousands a year in business or seeing it going to your competitor.
Jan 18, 2020, 6:28 pm
#66
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There's no chance of a flight bring delayed in the OP's case. Here (from the OP) is what happened after the gate agent could not help him:
"Ok I call AA customer service. They cannot sell me a ticket as there is a 2 hour "processing time" for phone purchases and tickets have to be bought at ticket counter. Run down to the ticket counter. They verify there are 4 empty 1st class seats, no upgraders. Ok, sell one to me... nope. Standy cannot be changed. That includes a standby pax buying a new ticket. So the airplane flew with 4 empty 1st class seats." (Bolding added.)
"Ok I call AA customer service. They cannot sell me a ticket as there is a 2 hour "processing time" for phone purchases and tickets have to be bought at ticket counter. Run down to the ticket counter. They verify there are 4 empty 1st class seats, no upgraders. Ok, sell one to me... nope. Standy cannot be changed. That includes a standby pax buying a new ticket. So the airplane flew with 4 empty 1st class seats." (Bolding added.)
Even better - sell the seat and then deny check in due to being too late
Jan 18, 2020, 7:08 pm
#67
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So standby on a connecting flight can sometimes clear more than 45 minutes before departure time.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:36 pm
#68
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 255
I recently had an Economy Web Special domestic award ticket for XXX-PHL-ZZZ. I wanted to stand by (as an AAdvantage Gold) for an earlier departure from XXX connecting to an earlier departure from PHL to ZZZ. My standby for both flights cleared while I was at XXX; the gate agent at XXX gave me boarding passes for both earlier flights. And because my new PHL-ZZZ seat was not an MCE seat, I went to the AA app immediately (before departing XXX) and successfully changed my PHL-ZZZ seat to MCE.
So standby on a connecting flight can sometimes clear more than 45 minutes before departure time.
So standby on a connecting flight can sometimes clear more than 45 minutes before departure time.
Maybe the OP will come back and add timestamps to the events.
Jan 18, 2020, 10:45 pm
#69
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Would require the OP to update with timings as to what happened
Jan 19, 2020, 2:36 am
#70
Join Date: Mar 2008
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All the airlines have decided that their top priority is getting the plane out on times. All systems are designed around meeting this goal and all agents are trained to make this their top goal. I assume they have figured out that the additional revenue at the expense of a flight delay isn’t economically worthwhile. At any given time it is totally possible that selling the ticket makes sense but systemization doesn’t really work like that. Easy to complain but the average passenger benefits from all these rules. American has denoted those passengers that are profitable enough to break rules for and made them CK.
I can understand why the OP is upset. However, the airlines have created metrics such as D0 etc so they can measure performance. These metrics either directly or indirectly impact revenue, profitability, customer satisfaction etc. One could make a point that delaying a flight with 150 or so people on board do they can sell one $730 ticket may not be the best result. That delay could negatively impact customer satisfaction on the OP’s flight plus possibly an incoming flight. Also, if the OP’s flight is delayed by the ticket purchase, it may cause inbound passengers a misconnect which may cost AA more than the $730 in revenue.
But the point of systemization is to create company-wide procedures that result in the best outcomes over time. While this particular ticket sale probably wouldn't have had any negative outcome, a different ticketing transaction might result in a delayed flight that costs the company money and results in misconnects for multiple passengers. Systemization is all about minimizing the risk of loss by creating policies.
That said, it's entirely possible that the policies in play here are too extreme. But without access to proprietary data, no one where can state that with authority.
Jan 19, 2020, 11:58 am
#72
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I sense that some people don't really understand the point that both of you have made. It's quite easy to take a single transaction and decide that a given policy is dumb. This thread is a perfect example. And I'm guessing that no one in American's management team would disagree.
But the point of systemization is to create company-wide procedures that result in the best outcomes over time. While this particular ticket sale probably wouldn't have had any negative outcome, a different ticketing transaction might result in a delayed flight that costs the company money and results in misconnects for multiple passengers. Systemization is all about minimizing the risk of loss by creating policies.
That said, it's entirely possible that the policies in play here are too extreme. But without access to proprietary data, no one where can state that with authority.
But the point of systemization is to create company-wide procedures that result in the best outcomes over time. While this particular ticket sale probably wouldn't have had any negative outcome, a different ticketing transaction might result in a delayed flight that costs the company money and results in misconnects for multiple passengers. Systemization is all about minimizing the risk of loss by creating policies.
That said, it's entirely possible that the policies in play here are too extreme. But without access to proprietary data, no one where can state that with authority.
Jan 19, 2020, 1:27 pm
#73
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It does not matter. OP wanted to throw away the original ticket and buy an entirely new one for $730. He was willing to let AA keep the revenue from both the original ticket and the new $730 paid F one.
Jan 19, 2020, 8:25 pm
#75
Join Date: Jan 2003
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You arriving late at the airport is purely your responsibility
With the late arrival, the airline was quite in its right to refuse travel on that flight. It sounds like the airline permitted the opportunity for a late arrival standby rather than refer you back to ticketing
Telephone ticketing requiring sales to be 2hr+ before deparure and referring to local ticket desk is not abnormal
You are not permitted duplicate reservations - it is part of AA's COC
If you had cancelled the original reservation, then you could have purchased a new ticket
From what you have said , the only oddity is about seat selection - had your standby cleared at the time when asking for the exit row seat?
With the late arrival, the airline was quite in its right to refuse travel on that flight. It sounds like the airline permitted the opportunity for a late arrival standby rather than refer you back to ticketing
Telephone ticketing requiring sales to be 2hr+ before deparure and referring to local ticket desk is not abnormal
You are not permitted duplicate reservations - it is part of AA's COC
If you had cancelled the original reservation, then you could have purchased a new ticket
From what you have said , the only oddity is about seat selection - had your standby cleared at the time when asking for the exit row seat?