Jan 31, 2020, 11:47 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
LATAM has announced it will depart oneworld Alliance on 1 May 2020. From that date onward, AA and LA end reciprocity of any benefits; code sharing ended 1 Feb 2020.
LATAM will relocate from JFK Terminal 8, shared with American Airlines, to Terminal 4 and used by Delta Airlines.
(Delta is investing $1.9 billion for a 20% stake in Latam, and it will invest $350 million to establish the partnership. Delta will fund the investment with a public tender offer of $16 per share. Following the closing of the transaction, Delta will have a seat on Latam’s board of directors. - Frequent Business Traveler: http://www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com/2020/01/latam-to-leave-oneworld-alliance-in-may/
American Airlines April 30, 2020 is the last day to earn and redeem miles on LATAM. All award travel must be booked and ticketed by April 30, 2020. Travel is valid for 1 year after ticketing date and must be flown no later than April 30, 2021. Ticket changes will not be allowed after April 30, 2020.
Special notice: LATAM Airlines will no longer operate using the airline code JJ for flights on or after October 27, 2019.
https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/partner-airlines/lan-airlines.jsp
Special notice: LATAM Airlines will no longer operate using the airline code JJ for flights on or after October 27, 2019.
https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/partner-airlines/lan-airlines.jsp
LATAM will retain relationships with many of its former Oneworld partners after leaving the alliance. Travelers will still receive reciprocal lounge access, elite loyalty benefits, and be able to earn and redeem frequent-flier points on British Airways, Cathay Pacific, Finnair, Iberia, Japan Airlines, Malaysia Airlines, Qantas, Qatar, Royal Jordanian, S7 Airlines and SriLankan Airlines for the time being, LATAM said. — The Points Guy https://thepointsguy.com/news/latam-...than-expected/
31 Jan 2020
LATAM to leave oneworld effective 1 May 2020
LATAM Airlines Group will end its membership in the oneworld® alliance effective 1 May 2020, following the group’s decision to leave the alliance.
oneworld benefits for LATAM customers will be offered on oneworld flights up to and including 30 April 2020. LATAM Pass members will not receive oneworld frequent flyer benefits offered by Royal Air Maroc, which joins oneworld effective 1 April. LATAM will not offer oneworld frequent flyer member benefits to Royal Air Maroc Safar Flyer members.
<snip>
All redemption tickets that have been ticketed up to 30 April 2020 remain valid for travel, however, customers will not be eligible for oneworld tier status benefits if travel occurs after 30 April 2020.
A number of oneworld member airlines plan to maintain frequent flyer agreements with LATAM after 30 April. Customers are advised to contact their airlines or visit the airlines’ frequent flyer programme websites for more information.
]https://www.oneworld.com/news/2020-0...ive-1-May-2020
LATAM to leave oneworld effective 1 May 2020
LATAM Airlines Group will end its membership in the oneworld® alliance effective 1 May 2020, following the group’s decision to leave the alliance.
oneworld benefits for LATAM customers will be offered on oneworld flights up to and including 30 April 2020. LATAM Pass members will not receive oneworld frequent flyer benefits offered by Royal Air Maroc, which joins oneworld effective 1 April. LATAM will not offer oneworld frequent flyer member benefits to Royal Air Maroc Safar Flyer members.
<snip>
All redemption tickets that have been ticketed up to 30 April 2020 remain valid for travel, however, customers will not be eligible for oneworld tier status benefits if travel occurs after 30 April 2020.
A number of oneworld member airlines plan to maintain frequent flyer agreements with LATAM after 30 April. Customers are advised to contact their airlines or visit the airlines’ frequent flyer programme websites for more information.
]https://www.oneworld.com/news/2020-0...ive-1-May-2020
LATAM to exit oneworld 1 May 2020: AA impact
Sep 29, 2019, 6:48 am
#136
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: AUS
Programs: BAEC Gold, AA PPro, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Plat
Posts: 7,040
Sep 29, 2019, 7:57 am
#137
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,372
Definitely no blanket F requirement, but I imagine it’s a multi-layered, complicated thing that notes class of service minimum on a flight based on size/budget of production, type of production, length of flight, etc.
Beyond that, certain talent can, of course, negotiate their own requirements, including First Class. Many do.
Beyond that, certain talent can, of course, negotiate their own requirements, including First Class. Many do.
Sep 29, 2019, 8:03 am
#138
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,372
My point is that AA is not strong in places like Brazil or Argentina BECAUSE of LATAM. Having them definitely helps, though. But they’ll be fine.
Sep 29, 2019, 1:30 pm
#139
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
What I mean is...No, its strength doesn’t matter in secondary markets if they can’t connect to AA on one ticket. But if AA can establish codeshares, then yes the brand is strong enough. If people can get to and from where they need to go, they’re not going to discontinue flying with AA to the US because their POA-GRU flight is GOL instead of TAM.
My point is that AA is not strong in places like Brazil or Argentina BECAUSE of LATAM. Having them definitely helps, though. But they’ll be fine.
My point is that AA is not strong in places like Brazil or Argentina BECAUSE of LATAM. Having them definitely helps, though. But they’ll be fine.
Sep 29, 2019, 1:45 pm
#140
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 73
I fly to SA a few times a year and always fly AA to a hub and take a LCC (Azul or Gol). I do this because of cost and schedule. Especially in Brazil, LATAM is always more expensive. I'll miss the lounges, but not sure how much it impacts me. I hope the competition may reduce prices to the hubs. I always thought I would get more use out of LATAM awards, but they never materialized.
Sep 29, 2019, 4:08 pm
#142
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,031
I, for one, would dislike this. I don't fly AS so often any more, but I appreciate the fact that they keep the US3 on their toes. Furthermore, AA's historic posture towards West Coast partners has never failed to result in destroying good things.
Sep 29, 2019, 6:06 pm
#144
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: AA LT Gold
Posts: 3,645
Not everyone traveling to South America is going to EZE, GRU, SCL, etc. After LA leaves Oneworld, AA will have no partner to connect passengers to secondary cities it doesn't serve itself. Sure, for those vacationing in SA, they might be ok with switching to a regional or LCC after flying AA on the intercontinental flight. But for businesses thinking about corporate contracts, why would they choose AA over DL/LA, even out of MIA?
I don't see much business traffic going to Arequipa or Mendoza (not that there is nobody going there).
Are you aware of AA's footprint in SA? It is significant:
Argentina: EZE, COR
Colombia: BAQ, BOG, CLO, CTG, MDE, PEI
Brasil: BSB, MAO, GIG, GRU
Chile: SCL
Ecuador: GYE, UIO
Peru: LIM
Uruguay: MVD
Do you know what are the business heavy destinations in South America. It is not the secondary cities. That's not how South America is, it is not the US. Most business is conducted in the big cities.
Some tourist destinations are not served by AA, CUZ comes to my mind. I don't think AA will have a problem offering tickets through one of the many airlines going to CUZ, even LATAM itself.
I don't think it is the end of the world to lose LATAM.
Sep 29, 2019, 6:33 pm
#145
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 1,372
I don't think either of us has any real facts. But I don't see why it's necessarily true that someone would choose AA/Gol over DL/LA (assuming AA can forge some sort of partnership with Gol). Not only is DL more operationally reliable (and, at least in the US, arguably a better "brand" at the moment), but also those in SA with status on LATAM would have an incentive to stick with LATAM.
I obviously have no idea how many LATAM elite fliers fly AA to the US, but also keep in mind that AAdvantage is a popular program, and AA co-brands credit cards with Banco Santander and other banks in Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador, Uraguay, Paraguay, Peru.
Sep 29, 2019, 6:50 pm
#146
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
I'm not arguing that someone is going to just choose AA/GOL over DL/LA (Brazil specifically, since GOL is not really a SA-wide carrier). I'm arguing that for the vast majority of people (who are not miles and status-obsessed junkies like we are), AA's deep roots still give it an advantage as the most widely known American carrier to the US. For businesses with which American has established contracts, etc., most of which will have traffic strictly between major metropolitan areas and the US, there isn't going to be some exodus because of some sense of loyalty to LATAM.
I obviously have no idea how many LATAM elite fliers fly AA to the US, but also keep in mind that AAdvantage is a popular program, and AA co-brands credit cards with Banco Santander and other banks in Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador, Uraguay, Paraguay, Peru.
I obviously have no idea how many LATAM elite fliers fly AA to the US, but also keep in mind that AAdvantage is a popular program, and AA co-brands credit cards with Banco Santander and other banks in Brazil, Argentina, Chile, Colombia, Ecuador, Uraguay, Paraguay, Peru.
I guess my view is this: From the US side, I think DL actually has a better "brand," especially in the eyes those not miles and status-obsessed like we are. With LATAM's network in SA, I can see why a lot of US flyers would choose DL/LA, particularly if they have no allegiance to AA. From the SA side, even if AA is the US carrier with the deepest roots and most name recognition, I would think LATAM has similar roots (and name recognition)--if not more.
Although AA of course has tried to downplay the significance of LATAM's partnership with DL and departure from Oneworld, the speed and tone of its communications tell me AA is more worried than it's letting on, I think.
Sep 29, 2019, 6:56 pm
#147
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,031
What do you mean by the speed and tone of its communications? Should they wait longer to share information that they have? What about their tone suggests that they are worrying?
Sep 29, 2019, 7:04 pm
#148
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
Most business travelers (if not all) DO go to EZE GRU SCL LIM
I don't see much business traffic going to Arequipa or Mendoza (not that there is nobody going there).
Are you aware of AA's footprint in SA? It is significant:
Argentina: EZE, COR
Colombia: BAQ, BOG, CLO, CTG, MDE, PEI
Brasil: BSB, MAO, GIG, GRU
Chile: SCL
Ecuador: GYE, UIO
Peru: LIM
Uruguay: MVD
Do you know what are the business heavy destinations in South America. It is not the secondary cities. That's not how South America is, it is not the US. Most business is conducted in the big cities.
Some tourist destinations are not served by AA, CUZ comes to my mind. I don't think AA will have a problem offering tickets through one of the many airlines going to CUZ, even LATAM itself.
I don't think it is the end of the world to lose LATAM.
I don't see much business traffic going to Arequipa or Mendoza (not that there is nobody going there).
Are you aware of AA's footprint in SA? It is significant:
Argentina: EZE, COR
Colombia: BAQ, BOG, CLO, CTG, MDE, PEI
Brasil: BSB, MAO, GIG, GRU
Chile: SCL
Ecuador: GYE, UIO
Peru: LIM
Uruguay: MVD
Do you know what are the business heavy destinations in South America. It is not the secondary cities. That's not how South America is, it is not the US. Most business is conducted in the big cities.
Some tourist destinations are not served by AA, CUZ comes to my mind. I don't think AA will have a problem offering tickets through one of the many airlines going to CUZ, even LATAM itself.
I don't think it is the end of the world to lose LATAM.
Overall, although I agree that losing LATAM is not "the end of the world," I do think it's more serious than AA is letting on. I guess only time will tell us what the true impact will be.
Sep 29, 2019, 7:06 pm
#149
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,031
Sep 29, 2019, 7:19 pm
#150
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: AY+ Plat, Marriott Plat, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 2,846
Also, I call BS on the statement, "During the transition period, American will work with LATAM to ensure a seamless experience for customers. American Airlines remains the largest U.S. carrier to both Latin and South America and we look forward to competing and growing in this region of the world." The fact that AA was just trying to form a JV with LATAM, the fact that AA/LA apparently has already ceased codesharing for future bookings, the fact that AA seems to have basically given up on NYC while building up CLT and PHL all belie AA's statement. And of course, the loss of $20 million in "incremental revenue" doesn't account for the probably much larger losses from competition on what used to be the closest thing to a OW monopoly (and from a DL that, at least at the moment, is operationally superior to AA).