DFW-TLV / Tel Aviv, Israel 3x weekly starting 9/9/2020
Aug 11, 2019, 11:08 am
#121
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Obviously, as a member of the tribe, I would’ve hoped that AA would give JFK-TLV a try and give LY a run for its money. Sadly, AA isn’t interested in remaining at JFK, so they’ll continue to kill it until it’s presence mirrors United at LGA. It’s unfortunate, because I hate LY and fly TK just so I wouldn’t have such a miserable experience to Israel. I have no desire to change with the addition of this route.
It is about revenue--bringing more TLV traffic to the JV overall. More AA operated flights please employees, passengers (gotta burn those SWUs), etc., but from a pure profit/loss perspective, my understanding is that the JV extends from point of origin to destination, not just the overseas segment.
Aug 11, 2019, 11:58 am
#122
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There are up to 4 daily nonstops in the market on carriers other than LY. Aside from AA's lack of ambition in NYC, the reality is that it is the interior US-TLV market that is growing fastest, not NYC-TLV. DFW-TLV makes perfect sense for AA. If AA establishes itself, there may be oppurtunities to add ORD, MIA, and/or JFK down the road, but I think UA/DL will more likely add ORD/ATL in an attempt to crowd AA out before that can happen. It would not surprise me to see ORD and/or ATL announced before the DFW route starts. UA and DL seem to have a strong following in Israel-originating premium traffic.
Aug 11, 2019, 1:35 pm
#123
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..It is about revenue--bringing more TLV traffic to the JV overall. More AA operated flights please employees, passengers (gotta burn those SWUs), etc., but from a pure profit/loss perspective, my understanding is that the JV extends from point of origin to destination, not just the overseas segment.
Aug 11, 2019, 4:05 pm
#124
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@JonNYC do you know why they arent starting it up say in early June? I cant understand why they arent going after the very heavy traffic months of June,July and Aug. Now Sept 19th is Rosh HaShana but the heavy traffic time is 2 weeks later for Succoth but when that ends (9 day Holiday) then its down hill till early Dec But Sept wont be haevay in Demand as early Oct will be or J,J or A
Aug 11, 2019, 9:37 pm
#125
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@JonNYC do you know why they arent starting it up say in early June? I cant understand why they arent going after the very heavy traffic months of June,July and Aug. Now Sept 19th is Rosh HaShana but the heavy traffic time is 2 weeks later for Succoth but when that ends (9 day Holiday) then its down hill till early Dec But Sept wont be haevay in Demand as early Oct will be or J,J or A
Aug 11, 2019, 11:23 pm
#126
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I remember seeing a report lately that SFO-TLV is UA's 3rd highest J-Class revenue! A great deal of the "profitable" revenue will be from High Tech.
My guess is now that Douggie has reopened the TLV door with DFW, PHL and ORD flights will soon be added. That way it keeps the local staff busy for 2 full shifts.
My guess is now that Douggie has reopened the TLV door with DFW, PHL and ORD flights will soon be added. That way it keeps the local staff busy for 2 full shifts.
You'd be fired if you didn't show some risk management when starting a new route with no history.
I don't think AA route planning execs lose sleep at night being scared.
United announced EWR-JNB. JNB has double the metro population of TLV. US started w 3 flights/week as well. Similar flight times.
It's only 1 data point but from that perspective American is taking a way larger risk then United. I don't think they're scared..
I don't think AA route planning execs lose sleep at night being scared.
United announced EWR-JNB. JNB has double the metro population of TLV. US started w 3 flights/week as well. Similar flight times.
It's only 1 data point but from that perspective American is taking a way larger risk then United. I don't think they're scared..
I mean to say that AA is not interested in remaining at JFK is just patently untrue. They are at JFK. They remain at JFK. They have remained at JFK since they announced their strategy of focusing on business markets (LAX, LHR, SFO, MXP, GRU, etc.)...Those routes are reportedly profitable and doing quite well. Just because JFK is not interesting in using JFK as its new route guinea pig doesn't mean it's not interested in staying.
They may have just determined (based on profits and costs out of DFW, etc.) that testing the waters from DFW had considerable more upside and considerably less downside than going head-to-head-to-head-head with LY, DL, and UA in the NYC market.
You can question the strategic wisdom of all of the above, for sure, but to say that AA is uninterested in remaining at JFK is not really a valid assertion, IMO.
They may have just determined (based on profits and costs out of DFW, etc.) that testing the waters from DFW had considerable more upside and considerably less downside than going head-to-head-to-head-head with LY, DL, and UA in the NYC market.
You can question the strategic wisdom of all of the above, for sure, but to say that AA is uninterested in remaining at JFK is not really a valid assertion, IMO.
Aug 12, 2019, 8:15 am
#127
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From OMAT-
"British Airways Club Suite
British Airways’ new business class product will be called Club Suite. With this new seat, British Airways will not only offer fully flat beds with direct aisle access, but they’ll also offer doors at every seat, similar to what Qatar and Delta have."
https://onemileatatime.com/british-airways-club-suite/
Aug 12, 2019, 8:17 am
#128
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Ynet reports (in Hebrew) that the Israeli Ministry of Tourism is subsidizing the route - to the tune of 750,000 Euros for operating it for a minimum of a year - in hopes of increasing Evangelical tourism to Israel.
Last edited by TWA884; Aug 12, 2019 at 8:27 am Reason: Add information
Aug 12, 2019, 9:57 am
#129
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Ynet reports (in Hebrew) that the Israeli Ministry of Tourism is subsidizing the route - to the tune of 750,000 Euros for operating it for a minimum of a year - in hopes of increasing Evangelical tourism to Israel.
EDIT: Actually, that article made me think - Dallas and Dulles would both be spelled דאלאס in Hebrew, wouldn't they? How would they differentiate?
Aug 12, 2019, 11:10 am
#130
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Aug 12, 2019, 11:10 am
#131
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Aug 12, 2019, 11:29 am
#132
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If you didn't want to take the LY flight in J (which is a decent hard product now), you could take a BA flight in F. AA won't sell it as a codeshare, but will sell it as a BA flight.
Aug 12, 2019, 11:52 am
#133
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For the Oneworld or AA Business traveler from the west or midwest/south that wants a relatively easy connection and a long flight for work y sleep, this makes a lot of sense. I'd not be surprised if there are a couple of AUS/DFW flights full of connections to this. It will probably be yet another TLV route with relatively high front cabin fares, little award availability, and good deals to be had in middle seats of Row 75.
Aug 12, 2019, 12:42 pm
#134
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Aug 12, 2019, 12:56 pm
#135
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And here are excerpts from an article in English language edition of Globes, Israel's business daily newspaper.
Will American Airlines impact Israel - US fares?
The article goes on to discuss the possible impact of this new route on flights between Israel and Latin America.
***
As of now, three weekly flights are involved, and more may be added later. There are good elements for fully occupied flights in both directions: fundamentalist Christian tourism from the US and business tourism from Israel, based on the fact that Dallas-Forth Worth is a giant hub with many flights in the US. Here it appears that American Airlines will gain at the expense of its competitors flying to Latin America; the question is how much.
***
American Airlines is represented in Israel by TAL Aviation. For operating a route from a new destination (Dallas), American Airlines will receive a €750,000 grant from the Ministry of Tourism for three weekly flights. The grant, which will be paid at the end of the first year, is designed to encourage incoming tourism to Israel. The grant is usually paid to airlines launching a new route (including El Al) that the Ministry of Tourism regards as "having potential for bringing tourism." Dallas is a Bible-belt center with potential for fundamentalist Christian tourism. Christian pilgrimage tourism in Israel constitutes the main segment among recreational tourists visiting Israel. 105,000 passengers visit Israel monthly, more than any other country.
***
As of now, three weekly flights are involved, and more may be added later. There are good elements for fully occupied flights in both directions: fundamentalist Christian tourism from the US and business tourism from Israel, based on the fact that Dallas-Forth Worth is a giant hub with many flights in the US. Here it appears that American Airlines will gain at the expense of its competitors flying to Latin America; the question is how much.
***
American Airlines is represented in Israel by TAL Aviation. For operating a route from a new destination (Dallas), American Airlines will receive a €750,000 grant from the Ministry of Tourism for three weekly flights. The grant, which will be paid at the end of the first year, is designed to encourage incoming tourism to Israel. The grant is usually paid to airlines launching a new route (including El Al) that the Ministry of Tourism regards as "having potential for bringing tourism." Dallas is a Bible-belt center with potential for fundamentalist Christian tourism. Christian pilgrimage tourism in Israel constitutes the main segment among recreational tourists visiting Israel. 105,000 passengers visit Israel monthly, more than any other country.
***
