which hub(s) do you think AA really values?
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: USA
Programs: AAdvantage, MileagePlus, SkyMiles
Posts: 4,159
which hub(s) do you think AA really values?
Wondering which hub(s) AA today favors?
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
#2
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Empire State
Programs: AAdvantage Executive Platinum; Marriott Platinum
Posts: 461
Wondering which hub(s) AA today favors?
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com...1-9ff439f710d1
#3
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: BOS
Programs: AA PP, DL PM
Posts: 2,086
I think it's CLT > DFW > DCA/PHL >> LAX >>>> MIA/ORD >> PHX >> LGA/JFK.
I think PMUS management prefers DFW, CLT, PHL, and DCA because they are rather profitable, and AA is mostly the only game in town.
The equipment goes where they need it based on number of seats and where they can maintain it. ORD is a 787 base because of the lesser international demand. More new and "nice" equipment goes to London than South America because those routes are more competitive.
JFK and LAX are important for corporate and Hollywood contracts. AA has said that traffic on the A321T routes has grown more on the LAX than the JFK side.
Due to the relative size of metropolitan areas, the PMAA hubs have more O&D traffic than the PMUS hubs; I believe CLT is their most profitable hub because of a significant north-south one-stop connecting market. The business model of US was more based on connecting traffic; supposedly when US management took over they didn't like DFW much because the airport was set up to minimize the distance from a customer's car in the garage to the plane, which made it poor for connections.
I think PMUS management prefers DFW, CLT, PHL, and DCA because they are rather profitable, and AA is mostly the only game in town.
The equipment goes where they need it based on number of seats and where they can maintain it. ORD is a 787 base because of the lesser international demand. More new and "nice" equipment goes to London than South America because those routes are more competitive.
JFK and LAX are important for corporate and Hollywood contracts. AA has said that traffic on the A321T routes has grown more on the LAX than the JFK side.
Due to the relative size of metropolitan areas, the PMAA hubs have more O&D traffic than the PMUS hubs; I believe CLT is their most profitable hub because of a significant north-south one-stop connecting market. The business model of US was more based on connecting traffic; supposedly when US management took over they didn't like DFW much because the airport was set up to minimize the distance from a customer's car in the garage to the plane, which made it poor for connections.
#4
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: PIT
Posts: 759
AA has been pretty transparent in terms of which it values in terms of profitability. Take a look at pages 12-15 of this deck:
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com...1-9ff439f710d1
#5
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: CLT
Programs: AA Executive Platinum, Hilton Diamond, Lifetime Admirals Club member
Posts: 419
I like everything you said but wouldn’t lump DCA with PHL. Their markets seems to be quite different...PHL being a large connecting hub with a ton of TATL traffic, DCA probably having a little more of an O&D base in a higher profile city.
#6
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: YYF/YLW
Programs: AA, DL, AS, VA, WS Silver
Posts: 5,950
#7
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond, Owner of 2,000 TWA shares
Posts: 812
Wondering which hub(s) AA today favors?
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
From my observation, it looks like AA highly favors DFW, CLT, and PHX, and maybe LAX as their “top” hubs, with PHL, MIA/ORD (tied), and JFK trailing behind (in that order).
”Top” and “favoring” in terms of number of aircraft, quality aircraft, schedule, and overall hub treatment. Also wonder if AA prefers pmUS or pmAA hubs overall?
Curious for your perspectives.
#10
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Austin, TX - AUS
Programs: AA Platinum, Hilton, Hyatt, IHG, Marriott
Posts: 1,625
Based on AA's actions, in terms of growth, I'd group the hubs into 3 tiers:
Tier 1: DFW, CLT, DCA - have seen the most growth recently and are listed as most profitable hubs in their presentation slide show
Tier 2: PHL, MIA, PHX, LAX - have seen slower growth, some cuts, but still play an important role in AA's network
Tier 3: JFK, ORD - have mostly seen cuts. When AA decides to close a hub, one (likely JFK) or maybe both are likely candidates
Tier 1: DFW, CLT, DCA - have seen the most growth recently and are listed as most profitable hubs in their presentation slide show
Tier 2: PHL, MIA, PHX, LAX - have seen slower growth, some cuts, but still play an important role in AA's network
Tier 3: JFK, ORD - have mostly seen cuts. When AA decides to close a hub, one (likely JFK) or maybe both are likely candidates
#11
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: SLC
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Plat
Posts: 616
Based on AA's actions, in terms of growth, I'd group the hubs into 3 tiers:
Tier 1: DFW, CLT, DCA - have seen the most growth recently and are listed as most profitable hubs in their presentation slide show
Tier 2: PHL, MIA, PHX, LAX - have seen slower growth, some cuts, but still play an important role in AA's network
Tier 3: JFK, ORD - have mostly seen cuts. When AA decides to close a hub, one (likely JFK) or maybe both are likely candidates
Tier 1: DFW, CLT, DCA - have seen the most growth recently and are listed as most profitable hubs in their presentation slide show
Tier 2: PHL, MIA, PHX, LAX - have seen slower growth, some cuts, but still play an important role in AA's network
Tier 3: JFK, ORD - have mostly seen cuts. When AA decides to close a hub, one (likely JFK) or maybe both are likely candidates
I think ORD goes away as a hub. They seem to be copying what Delta did at DFW. Delta transitioned from Mainline then Regional aircraft at DFW, closed the "Delta Crown Room", and eventually shattered the hub. I see the same for ORD. AA will not compete head to head on a large scale with a peer airline.
Despite what is generally accepted as positive growth, I speculate LAX's growth plans may reverse for AA, as Chairman Parker is fearful to compete, which makes sense with a much larger and monstrous debt burden to service every month, than AA's peer competitors. LAX has three strong peer competitors. If I was a PHX flight attendant, I might not sell my house just yet.
The big question is- where can AA move aircraft, be profitable, and not have competition...... Chairman Parker has a huge challenge with huge debt payments every month, exposure to fuel prices because of not hedging, and labor costs at the same level as its peers. I sense Chairman Parker's fighting position will be the continuation of adding more seats to every aircraft.
Last edited by GunsOfNavarone; Apr 13, 2019 at 3:48 pm
#12
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: USA
Programs: AAdvantage, MileagePlus, SkyMiles
Posts: 4,159
Based on responses here, it seems like today's AA favors more of the pmUS hubs, with the exception of DFW (which was pmAA's main home hub).
I wonder what's wrong with ORD, though? It's nice because it's a competitive hub with UA, it's centrally located, and it also commands more premium fares, IMHO, due to it being an attractive midwestern major city and metropolitan area. So, why do you think AA has been cutting ORD?
IMHO, I think CLT is probably the worst hub in the system. Tight, smelly, crowded, surly employees with fake Southern friendliness that goes out of the window fast... I'd choose even PHL over CLT, IMHO. Why would AA want to choose CLT as one of its top hubs? If CLT was in a sparkling new building with huge facilities and plenty of room (like JFK), then I'd understand, perhaps.
I wonder what's wrong with ORD, though? It's nice because it's a competitive hub with UA, it's centrally located, and it also commands more premium fares, IMHO, due to it being an attractive midwestern major city and metropolitan area. So, why do you think AA has been cutting ORD?
IMHO, I think CLT is probably the worst hub in the system. Tight, smelly, crowded, surly employees with fake Southern friendliness that goes out of the window fast... I'd choose even PHL over CLT, IMHO. Why would AA want to choose CLT as one of its top hubs? If CLT was in a sparkling new building with huge facilities and plenty of room (like JFK), then I'd understand, perhaps.
#13
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: CLT
Programs: AA EP, AA AC
Posts: 4,268
Based on responses here, it seems like today's AA favors more of the pmUS hubs, with the exception of DFW (which was pmAA's main home hub).
I wonder what's wrong with ORD, though? It's nice because it's a competitive hub with UA, it's centrally located, and it also commands more premium fares, IMHO, due to it being an attractive midwestern major city and metropolitan area. So, why do you think AA has been cutting ORD?
IMHO, I think CLT is probably the worst hub in the system. Tight, smelly, crowded, surly employees with fake Southern friendliness that goes out of the window fast... I'd choose even PHL over CLT, IMHO. Why would AA want to choose CLT as one of its top hubs? If CLT was in a sparkling new building with huge facilities and plenty of room (like JFK), then I'd understand, perhaps.
I wonder what's wrong with ORD, though? It's nice because it's a competitive hub with UA, it's centrally located, and it also commands more premium fares, IMHO, due to it being an attractive midwestern major city and metropolitan area. So, why do you think AA has been cutting ORD?
IMHO, I think CLT is probably the worst hub in the system. Tight, smelly, crowded, surly employees with fake Southern friendliness that goes out of the window fast... I'd choose even PHL over CLT, IMHO. Why would AA want to choose CLT as one of its top hubs? If CLT was in a sparkling new building with huge facilities and plenty of room (like JFK), then I'd understand, perhaps.
Safe Traveks
#14
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: NYC/PHX
Programs: IATA, Sabre, AvgeekAgent
Posts: 1,958
Even if ORD is de-hubbed, I would expect AA to maintain an AC there (IIRC, DL has always had at least one lounge at DFW...could be wrong though). These will always be major stations, hub or no hub.