Going different ways - UA to expand premium seating. Will AA respond?
Feb 8, 2019, 7:27 am
#46
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I think a lot of people are misreading this change at UA. They are not using CR2s for this new configuration. They are reconfiguring CR7s (which already have an F cabin and Y+ section) on them. The upside to this change is that there will be more F and Y+ seats on these aircraft, as well as a carry-on storage closet, the downside is that they will be removing one FA.
Feb 8, 2019, 8:54 am
#47
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If you've not flown through DCA since before 1981, you're not in a position to characterize how the DCA operation performs. Nor do I see how the absence or existence of international service affect's an airport's status as a hub,
AA puts 12 million passengers through DCA annually - which makes it about equal to DL's SLC hub.
AA puts 12 million passengers through DCA annually - which makes it about equal to DL's SLC hub.
Here, here. I don't know any business traveler (outside of those who live by Reston) who would prefer IAD over DCA especially given their security lines, trams to the terminals, etc. DCA's growth from 18->23M passengers over the past 10 years vs. IAD's decline from 24->22M partially reflect this. Give me DCA<->LAX over any IAD flight. I do prefer D1 over AA's product on this flight, but that's a different topic...Nonstops to EU are naturally IAD's one big benefit in the O/D market, but wouldn't consider it a particular compelling hub to connect through.On the original topic, I hope AA expands on their ERJ175s with two FA's. A slightly different class of plane, but feel that has a better first/economy product than these newer UA birds.
Feb 8, 2019, 9:29 am
#48
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And my clearance rate as a US Gold on these birds was about 75%. Contrast that with my clearance rate using RPU's as a 1K on United: About 50%.
UA (read: Scott Kirby) is CR2-crazy. While this announcement is good news overall for UA elites, unless they replace the CR2's on the ORD-AVP route (where in November I got trapped on one for 4+ hours), and other routes where they are a dreaded mainstay, I'm reserving my excitement.
UA (read: Scott Kirby) is CR2-crazy. While this announcement is good news overall for UA elites, unless they replace the CR2's on the ORD-AVP route (where in November I got trapped on one for 4+ hours), and other routes where they are a dreaded mainstay, I'm reserving my excitement.
Feb 8, 2019, 4:03 pm
#49
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What Int'l routes are served from DCA? I didn't even think it was an international airport, but I haven't flown out of national since the summer before the Air Florida crash and i will never fly out of it again ever anyway. Even the One World carriers are at IAD, maybe i am missing something.
And do you avoid DCA due to safety concerns? If so, I think you are deeply misguided. If you avoid DCA because your travels don't bring you to the area DCA serves well (Virginia inside the Beltway and DC), that's perfectly fair. But for my money it's just about the most pleasant decent-sized airport to fly out of in the US.
DCA has no Customs available for commercial flights, so the only international service is to airports with preclearance within the perimeter (or, in principle, with an exemption eg YVR or even DUB/SNN/AUH, but there are no current exemptions for cities outside the US), including the two you mention.
Feb 8, 2019, 4:30 pm
#50
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You didn't say anything about your definition of "hub" only referring to international flights. And since the main topic of the thread is UA's addition of premium seats on narrowbody flights, I certainly didn't assume you were talking only international. DCA still has a distance perimeter rule with limited exemptions; there are no exemptions for intercontinental flights.
And do you avoid DCA due to safety concerns? If so, I think you are deeply misguided. If you avoid DCA because your travels don't bring you to the area DCA serves well (Virginia inside the Beltway and DC), that's perfectly fair. But for my money it's just about the most pleasant decent-sized airport to fly out of in the US.
DCA has no Customs available for commercial flights, so the only international service is to airports with preclearance within the perimeter (or, in principle, with an exemption eg YVR or even DUB/SNN/AUH, but there are no current exemptions for cities outside the US), including the two you mention.
And do you avoid DCA due to safety concerns? If so, I think you are deeply misguided. If you avoid DCA because your travels don't bring you to the area DCA serves well (Virginia inside the Beltway and DC), that's perfectly fair. But for my money it's just about the most pleasant decent-sized airport to fly out of in the US.
DCA has no Customs available for commercial flights, so the only international service is to airports with preclearance within the perimeter (or, in principle, with an exemption eg YVR or even DUB/SNN/AUH, but there are no current exemptions for cities outside the US), including the two you mention.
Also, I was basing my remarks about DCA and other Hubs in general on Int'l travel although the OP was talking single aisle planes, they are increasing 767 J seats out of EWR and ORD only. That said i was strictly replying against the guy who was talking about the relative merits of the Hubs.
I still believe that AA doesn't have a viable international Hub in Wash DC, however OW has a decent presence at IAD along with UA. UA also in addition to flying all over EU has flights to NRT from IAD and it will soon be a 787 base and most EU flights will be 787's
Feb 8, 2019, 5:10 pm
#51
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I never said why I avoid DCA other than due to Air Florida. It isn't safety as much as the sights and sounds as I had a field trip to Wash DC 2 days after and yeah, it is just one of those things. I know airline travel is the safest and i know tons and tons and tons of flights have taken off and landed safely there since that day. BUT, I ain't flying in or out, it is really that simple. I don't live near it now, and i fly UA but generally try and maintain EXP on AA for emergencies, I just never fly AA if it requires routing thru DCA.
I still believe that AA doesn't have a viable international Hub in Wash DC, however OW has a decent presence at IAD along with UA. UA also in addition to flying all over EU has flights to NRT from IAD and it will soon be a 787 base and most EU flights will be 787's
Feb 8, 2019, 6:28 pm
#52
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DCA has no Customs available for commercial flights, so the only international service is to airports with preclearance within the perimeter (or, in principle, with an exemption eg YVR or even DUB/SNN/AUH, but there are no current exemptions for cities outside the US), including the two you mention.
Feb 8, 2019, 8:24 pm
#53
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If you've not flown through DCA since before 1981, you're not in a position to characterize how the DCA operation performs. Nor do I see how the absence or existence of international service affect's an airport's status as a hub,
AA puts 12 million passengers through DCA annually - which makes it about equal to DL's SLC hub.
AA puts 12 million passengers through DCA annually - which makes it about equal to DL's SLC hub.
To many of us in the area, IAD exists only for international flights. For anything domestic, I'm flying out of DCA. It's a great airport, and only going to get better with the demise of 35X.
Feb 8, 2019, 9:34 pm
#54
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Are you sure about "reconfiguring CR7s"? You make it sound like they're using their existing fleet ("which already have an F cabin"), but that defeats the whole point of the exercise -- to get more planes with F cabins. My understanding is that this is a capacity addition for UA (hence the requirement not to violate pilot contracts), and while Bombardier is using the existing CR7 airframe to build them, it will have a new type certificate.
And just look at the title of this thread. "UA going different ways". With regards to this "new" UA Express aircraft, they will still have a smaller F cabin than the E175s (as well as CR9s)-- an aircraft type AA and DL are acquiring more of.
Last edited by Fanjet; Feb 8, 2019 at 9:41 pm
Feb 8, 2019, 9:48 pm
#55
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When people were first talking about this "wonderful" change at UA, they were giving the impression that UA was installing an F cabin on part of its current 50-seat fleet. They are not. These are basically a differently configured CR7, an aircraft UA currently operates with an F cabin. So, it's just a nicer CR7. However, I'd still rather be on an E175 than this hybrid. The current CR2s and E145s are not going anywhere, nor are their seating configurations changing.
And just look at the title of this thread. "UA going different ways". With regards to this "new" UA Express aircraft, they will still have a smaller F cabin than the E175s (as well as CR9s)-- an aircraft type AA and DL are acquiring more of.
And just look at the title of this thread. "UA going different ways". With regards to this "new" UA Express aircraft, they will still have a smaller F cabin than the E175s (as well as CR9s)-- an aircraft type AA and DL are acquiring more of.
Feb 8, 2019, 10:04 pm
#56
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My understanding (from Cranky Flier) is that United is at their cap of 76-seaters but has no cap on 50 seaters. So this lets them replace 20 CR7s with E175s and reconfigure/rerate the CR7s into CRJ-550s, which are a much nicer 50 seat aircraft. So while I too would almost certainly prefer an E175, this seems like a straight win from a customer point of view. CR7s upgraded to E175s and a much better option for 50 seat routes.
Also, are these CRJ-550s additional aircraft, or reconfiguring exitsting CR7s in the fleet? Because if it's the former, then UA cannot add any more E175s to their fleet (as they are at the scope max). If it's the latter, then 'yes' they can add an additional E175 to their fleet for each CR7 they reconfigure to 50 seats.
Last edited by Fanjet; Feb 8, 2019 at 11:22 pm
Feb 8, 2019, 10:19 pm
#57
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I never said why I avoid DCA other than due to Air Florida. It isn't safety as much as the sights and sounds as I had a field trip to Wash DC 2 days after and yeah, it is just one of those things. I know airline travel is the safest and i know tons and tons and tons of flights have taken off and landed safely there since that day. BUT, I ain't flying in or out, it is really that simple. I don't live near it now, and i fly UA but generally try and maintain EXP on AA for emergencies, I just never fly AA if it requires routing thru DCA.
Feb 8, 2019, 10:59 pm
#58
Join Date: Jan 2014
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My understanding (from Cranky Flier) is that United is at their cap of 76-seaters but has no cap on 50 seaters. So this lets them replace 20 CR7s with E175s and reconfigure/rerate the CR7s into CRJ-550s, which are a much nicer 50 seat aircraft. So while I too would almost certainly prefer an E175, this seems like a straight win from a customer point of view. CR7s upgraded to E175s and a much better option for 50 seat routes.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...300790427.html
Feb 9, 2019, 6:37 am
#59
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Feb 9, 2019, 7:34 am
#60
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This thread gets my nomination for most OT thread of the year. But I agree that the demise of 35X is going to be wonderful.