Unaware of separate ticketing baggage policy, I paid the price. Don’t like it!
Jan 20, 2019, 10:12 pm
#76
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 489
tomj888,
From your prose and the choice of words used, I'm going to guess you're not too familiar with this game.
I'd hazard to suggest that there is a significant number of people with EXP/Emerald status, and those who travel on revenue first class tickets like you, who are not in the loop with changes to FF programes and/or alliance rules - I've got relatives who are in the same boat.
To cut it short, you have not been hard done by AA. The rules allowing interline check-in for separate bookings/tickets changed a couple of years ago and AA is no longer obligated to "bundle" your ticket. Consequently they are not obligated to through check your luggage to GVA.
As such there is no reason for them to provide compensation. And so it appears far fetched that AA would extend your SWU given that there is no basis for compensation.
I would personally have decoupled both issues 1) grievance for missed GVA connection, and 2) extension of SWU, and try your luck with the SWU extension on the basis of your "continued loyalty to Aadvantage".
But going forward, can I suggest you read the threads on this forum to assess if any proposed travel meets current FF programme/Alliance rules. A bit of research would save you a whole lot of grief. Google search is quite good in returning results to the relevant Flyer Talk threads.
The rules around interline check-in for separate bookings/tickets are not consistently adopted by all members of the oneworld alliance. So had you flown Cathay or JAL transpacific to LHR for a connection with BA, the CX/JL agents at LAX would have through checked your luggage to GVA (you'll probably still need to collect the BP at the LHR T3 transfer desk). More information here:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cath...e-pnrs-12.html
From your prose and the choice of words used, I'm going to guess you're not too familiar with this game.
I'd hazard to suggest that there is a significant number of people with EXP/Emerald status, and those who travel on revenue first class tickets like you, who are not in the loop with changes to FF programes and/or alliance rules - I've got relatives who are in the same boat.
To cut it short, you have not been hard done by AA. The rules allowing interline check-in for separate bookings/tickets changed a couple of years ago and AA is no longer obligated to "bundle" your ticket. Consequently they are not obligated to through check your luggage to GVA.
As such there is no reason for them to provide compensation. And so it appears far fetched that AA would extend your SWU given that there is no basis for compensation.
I would personally have decoupled both issues 1) grievance for missed GVA connection, and 2) extension of SWU, and try your luck with the SWU extension on the basis of your "continued loyalty to Aadvantage".
But going forward, can I suggest you read the threads on this forum to assess if any proposed travel meets current FF programme/Alliance rules. A bit of research would save you a whole lot of grief. Google search is quite good in returning results to the relevant Flyer Talk threads.
The rules around interline check-in for separate bookings/tickets are not consistently adopted by all members of the oneworld alliance. So had you flown Cathay or JAL transpacific to LHR for a connection with BA, the CX/JL agents at LAX would have through checked your luggage to GVA (you'll probably still need to collect the BP at the LHR T3 transfer desk). More information here:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/cath...e-pnrs-12.html
Jan 22, 2019, 9:10 am
#80
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Denver CO
Posts: 3,682
I am not sure sure about the AA versus BA F opinion. On top of that, OP has not had a single word on what his original ticket fare was. He just added the BA LHR-GVA segment to avoid the bad weather at London but he made the very poor decision of picking a short connection by his own admission. His LAX-LHR AA F ticket might very well be a deep discount paid ticket that it would cost him quite a bundle should he change it. Given he is an exp by his playing the DYKWIA card, if it is an award ticket he can easily change the destination without fee. Hence my assumption here is, his original ticket was a paid ticket with deep discount that would be significant cheaper than a BA F not on sale,
On top of that BA F is not any better comparing to AA F, as BA F is still flying the products that are more than a decade old in high density, plus the foods and services are very mixed, often to the worse side.
It is perfectly fine to have 2 separate tickets. We do that all the time. However anyone has any tiny bit of experience at LHR would know the MCT is minimum 90 min and the reality is often MUCH LONGER, especially when you need to go between terminals. I would venture to say, a 4 hours minimum buffer is needed for any transfer at LHR with separate tickets.
Picking a short connection is a fools game when you are on separate tickets - you dont have a connection by all means, except in your mind.
AA's policy of protecting the misconnect if the onward ticket is on OW carrier is actually a rather generous one already.
On top of that BA F is not any better comparing to AA F, as BA F is still flying the products that are more than a decade old in high density, plus the foods and services are very mixed, often to the worse side.
It is perfectly fine to have 2 separate tickets. We do that all the time. However anyone has any tiny bit of experience at LHR would know the MCT is minimum 90 min and the reality is often MUCH LONGER, especially when you need to go between terminals. I would venture to say, a 4 hours minimum buffer is needed for any transfer at LHR with separate tickets.
Picking a short connection is a fools game when you are on separate tickets - you dont have a connection by all means, except in your mind.
AA's policy of protecting the misconnect if the onward ticket is on OW carrier is actually a rather generous one already.
All that said, I agree that the One World policy is bad
Jan 22, 2019, 9:17 am
#81
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Join Date: Aug 2010
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Posts: 50,262
With the possible exception of a full F cash-paid ticket where there are no cancellation or change fees, it does not matter whether OP was booked into the cheapest seat near the rear lav or the most regal F seat. The rule is the same.
Against the limited chance that the ticket was fully flexible, he could have simply made the change and had the ticket reissued ti GVA with a LHR connection. And saved on the APD for his separate GVA ticket as well.
Against the limited chance that the ticket was fully flexible, he could have simply made the change and had the ticket reissued ti GVA with a LHR connection. And saved on the APD for his separate GVA ticket as well.
Jan 22, 2019, 9:34 am
#82
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,738
With the possible exception of a full F cash-paid ticket where there are no cancellation or change fees, it does not matter whether OP was booked into the cheapest seat near the rear lav or the most regal F seat. The rule is the same.
Against the limited chance that the ticket was fully flexible, he could have simply made the change and had the ticket reissued ti GVA with a LHR connection. And saved on the APD for his separate GVA ticket as well.
Against the limited chance that the ticket was fully flexible, he could have simply made the change and had the ticket reissued ti GVA with a LHR connection. And saved on the APD for his separate GVA ticket as well.
Had he given 3 to 4 hrs connection time he would not have such "grief". Everyone agrees the AA policy not to thru check bags is not customer friendly but as a customer, you have 2 options - not to fly AA or learn the rules and act accordingly. Playing a "F paying customer" or Status only make the staff stand firm on the rules.
Jan 22, 2019, 12:52 pm
#83
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,543
Originally Posted by Mountain Trader
All that said, I agree that the One World policy is bad
All that happened was that this policy was finally terminatd
Thre is now no policy, just that the airlines can now do what they want to do in relation to customers with separate bookings
AA's is rather generous in providing protection for misconnections on separate bookimgs
Jan 22, 2019, 7:58 pm
#84
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: NYC
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Jan 22, 2019, 8:04 pm
#85
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Join Date: Oct 2014
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Jan 22, 2019, 8:34 pm
#86
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: DEN
Programs: AA EXP, AA Million Miles, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,579
How much effort does the average customer put into understanding the airline's published policies governing a ticket purchase (or two?). Have you ever read AA's Conditions of Carriage? Do you know everything that's contained in it? I'll admit it: I don't.
I do know that if I conduct the simple google search "aa checked baggage separate tickets" the first result I get is a AA document explaining AA's policy. OP is adept enough to post a rant here on FT (and supposedly other social media outlets). OP is adept enough to do a simple search to find this very much discussed policy.
And nevermind all that: AA did make the customer aware of the policy - when the customer checked in. At that point OP can be unhappy with the policy, and could have seen if the agent is willing or able to waive the policy, in this one case. OP can learn the policy. But you don't get to claim compensation for the airline following it's policy.
You just don't.
Last edited by bse118; Jan 22, 2019 at 8:46 pm
Jan 22, 2019, 10:41 pm
#87
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Posts: 44,543
Jan 22, 2019, 11:42 pm
#88
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 10,904
No, absolutely not. It's not that one-sided.
There is this strange idea that companies get to set policies and we have to follow them. It's simply not true.
Then it's not a contract and you're not bound by it.
There is this strange idea that companies get to set policies and we have to follow them. It's simply not true.
Have you ever read AA's Conditions of Carriage? Do you know everything that's contained in it? I'll admit it: I don't.
Jan 23, 2019, 2:38 am
#89
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,543
It doesn't even need to have a policy
Person buys a ticket from A-B
Person buys a ticket from B-C
These are 2 separate unrelated purchases
There is no need for any published policy to cover that 2 separate purchases are separate
Person buys a ticket from A-B
Person buys a ticket from B-C
These are 2 separate unrelated purchases
There is no need for any published policy to cover that 2 separate purchases are separate
Jan 23, 2019, 2:51 am
#90
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Location: Brighton. UK
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Posts: 14,166
The APD LHR to GVA probably is not too bad given the short distance. The reason he opted for a separate BA ticket could very well be the cost for him to reticket the existing itinerary, i.e. the fare difference, could be significantly more.
Had he given 3 to 4 hrs connection time he would not have such "grief". Everyone agrees the AA policy not to thru check bags is not customer friendly but as a customer, you have 2 options - not to fly AA or learn the rules and act accordingly. Playing a "F paying customer" or Status only make the staff stand firm on the rules.
Had he given 3 to 4 hrs connection time he would not have such "grief". Everyone agrees the AA policy not to thru check bags is not customer friendly but as a customer, you have 2 options - not to fly AA or learn the rules and act accordingly. Playing a "F paying customer" or Status only make the staff stand firm on the rules.
the APD would have been £26 pounds on a J flight and £13 in Y, and from what the OP wrote the decision to go to GVA was fairly last minute due to snow (the OP wanting to see it / go skiiing) there so yes the cost of the ticket change could have been high.
Unfortunately the OP hasn’t come back to say how long he had between the two separate flights in terms of both the schedule and the reality (he said the AA flight into LHR was late).
Last edited by UKtravelbear; Jan 23, 2019 at 7:26 am
