Which Flagship Lounge is opening 'early next year' (2019)?
Dec 8, 2018, 6:57 pm
#16
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Dec 8, 2018, 6:59 pm
#17
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Dec 8, 2018, 7:50 pm
#18
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Dec 8, 2018, 9:36 pm
#19
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All of this for the most part is from memory so I may be wrong but this is the beat down since the merger. Please correct me if im wrong. Since 2013 there will be a net loss of 6 AC's with over 50% unrenovated. So that bully for them but they have only opened 3 new clubs. Seems to me as much as AA loves to promote its AC's they are cutting hard on their costs. They have only been investing in AC's where they really have to compete with other airlines. Granted at DFW C is not in need of an upgrade as is SFO and a few others, but it looks like where AA has a strong hold they are neglectful. Also it looks like internationally they are throwing in the towel with lounges other than SA which is strange. Im trying to make heads or tails from their planing but it seems like Delta is investing in their premuim product, look at all the investments for sky clubs, united and AA dont seem to be betting as much on them. Surprising. What do you think?
New or to open:
DFW FFD, FL
IAH
JFK (FFD)
LAX (5, FFD, Eagles Nest)
LHR FFD
MIA FFD, Premium
MCO
Updated ( ):
BOS (low gates, in progress)
CDG
CLT B (In Process)
DFW A, D
EZE
GIG
GRU
HNL (moved to new location, colocated with Sakura)
JFK (Low Gates, FL)
LHR (Flagship, Club, Arrivals) (iirc Club)
LAX (4 / FL)
LGA
MIA (Both)
ORD (2 Clubs, 1 FL)
PHX (A7)
YYZ
Unchanged: ( )
ATL
AUS
BNA
CLT C&D
DCA Both
DEN
DFW B, C
EWR
JFK (High Gates)
MEX
NRT
PIT
PHL (All 4)
PHX (A19 and B gates)
RDU
SNA
SCL
STL
TPA
Lost: (9)
BDL
BOS (High Gates will be closing)
BUF
CCS
GSO
LGA (Terminal C)
SEA
SJC
SJU
If anyone has changes, either list can be copied and put in a Wikipost.
Dec 9, 2018, 1:10 am
#20
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Austin, Texas, USA
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Regarding the AUS club, I would expect to hear of a renovation/new club shortly after the master plan is finalized and construction begins. Currently, there just no room to expand or relocate, and (thankfully) AA sees the club as important enough to not close it for 18 months while it's renovated.
Dec 9, 2018, 8:30 am
#21
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: New York, NY
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Because people arnt picking airlines over renovated AC's as these places have United Clubs and Delta Sky Clubs. Normally one would invest in major connection points because that is where most of your traffic is. Think about CLT C&D, that is one of the most used lounge and during connections and IRROPS could get hammered. That is where the public perception comes in. I dont here many people phrasing the YYZ lounge BUT on the daily I hear about CLT C&D. So the perceptions of the lounge is lesser despite the fact they have new an renovated lounges. With Project Oasis coming online in many of these cities AA does not have a defined vision. Do they want to be an LLC or a premium carrier. You can see this in how JFK to LAX/SFO have 321T's because of the premium market, planes with a true FC and FFD. Then you could also fly (not sure is Oasised 737 is on this route but it will happen one refurbs are done) JFK to LAS. NYC still being a premium market will have people getting an inconstant product. When developing a product one would want to create harmony and normally that is done at the biggest pinch points as laid out in the law of constraints. You need to look at the whole picture. AA is trying to go in two directions, with no identity. With falling stock prices DP should be out sooner rather than later. He would be a hypocrite to go back to full premium services due to his HUGE bet on the desnification of the 737's and 321's. BUT he is still investing in FFD with desnification. I feel DP's successor will be able to create an identity. As of right now it is a Premium Carrier with LLC Y. Delta will continue to capitalize on the premium market as they are playing the MRTC game. So to go back to my original question, why make an investment where only a tiny portion will enjoy. Just my take.
Also I would like to point out PHL AA's biggest TATL airport has 4 AC's all of which are unrenovated, with no FFL. That is a place where you will see the most premium travelers in TATL J yet are subject to substandard products. So if AA wants to increase premium price like they said they would, they need to increase the perceived value. Think about Delta at ATL SEA LAX or JFK, even DTW or MSP where they have international flights. They may not have International F/J lounges but the sky clubs there are of a nicer variety. Even in JFK and ATL they have sky decks. Think about United at ORD, EWR (both with Polaris), IAD, SFO, all above tier clubs for the most part. These airlines cater to both Domestic and International low and high yield people. Yet you have AA spending at JFK in which they keep cutting flights. T8 will soon be all of OW. DFW is finally getting a FFL, which for the biggest hub and them getting one forth is interesting planing. ORD has an FFL and is cutting TPAC flights and some TATL flights. Their lack of foresight and planning has made a mess of the system.
With densification most employees have their employees book the cheapest Y fare. Either employees will defect or AA will start to lose corporate contracts. Yes 1-2 Ep's wont make a difference but when you start to see 10-15% loss it will be too late to do anything. They are not playing the corprate game but look to want to be an LLC. Yet investing in questionable luxuries like FFL and FFD in JFK and ORD.
DP and AA are out of touch with the airline world clearly. Delta and United growing over the last year, AA shrinking. Continuing to push these changes you will see this trend continue. But hey clearly its a greAAt corporate strategy and has been paying off over the last year because DP promised $60 dollars by 11/28/18 when it was at 48 dollars a share, 12 dollars away from its goal, its trading around $39.25 or 20.25 away. In a time where they were to gain 12 per share and lost 8.75 a share they must be doing something wrong. Gas has remained constant, prices have raised so does that mean weakening yields.
https://skift.com/2018/10/25/america...-better-seats/
https://skift.com/2018/12/06/america...s-stock-price/
https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea...oser-together/
Also I would like to point out PHL AA's biggest TATL airport has 4 AC's all of which are unrenovated, with no FFL. That is a place where you will see the most premium travelers in TATL J yet are subject to substandard products. So if AA wants to increase premium price like they said they would, they need to increase the perceived value. Think about Delta at ATL SEA LAX or JFK, even DTW or MSP where they have international flights. They may not have International F/J lounges but the sky clubs there are of a nicer variety. Even in JFK and ATL they have sky decks. Think about United at ORD, EWR (both with Polaris), IAD, SFO, all above tier clubs for the most part. These airlines cater to both Domestic and International low and high yield people. Yet you have AA spending at JFK in which they keep cutting flights. T8 will soon be all of OW. DFW is finally getting a FFL, which for the biggest hub and them getting one forth is interesting planing. ORD has an FFL and is cutting TPAC flights and some TATL flights. Their lack of foresight and planning has made a mess of the system.
With densification most employees have their employees book the cheapest Y fare. Either employees will defect or AA will start to lose corporate contracts. Yes 1-2 Ep's wont make a difference but when you start to see 10-15% loss it will be too late to do anything. They are not playing the corprate game but look to want to be an LLC. Yet investing in questionable luxuries like FFL and FFD in JFK and ORD.
DP and AA are out of touch with the airline world clearly. Delta and United growing over the last year, AA shrinking. Continuing to push these changes you will see this trend continue. But hey clearly its a greAAt corporate strategy and has been paying off over the last year because DP promised $60 dollars by 11/28/18 when it was at 48 dollars a share, 12 dollars away from its goal, its trading around $39.25 or 20.25 away. In a time where they were to gain 12 per share and lost 8.75 a share they must be doing something wrong. Gas has remained constant, prices have raised so does that mean weakening yields.
https://skift.com/2018/10/25/america...-better-seats/
https://skift.com/2018/12/06/america...s-stock-price/
https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea...oser-together/
Last edited by Pasqualle7; Dec 9, 2018 at 10:11 am
Dec 9, 2018, 9:54 am
#22
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If I had to guess, the nexus of eliminating Flagship First Class and the expansion of Flagship First Dining may result in some future losses. The widebody fleet expansion is with two class 788 and 789 aircraft, not 773 - and the 77X is too far off in any plans to consider.
Dec 9, 2018, 10:16 am
#23
Join Date: Nov 2017
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If I had to guess, the nexus of eliminating Flagship First Class and the expansion of Flagship First Dining may result in some future losses. The widebody fleet expansion is with two class 788 and 789 aircraft, not 773 - and the 77X is too far off in any plans to consider.
Dec 9, 2018, 10:27 am
#24
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin
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If I had to guess, the nexus of eliminating Flagship First Class and the expansion of Flagship First Dining may result in some future losses. The widebody fleet expansion is with two class 788 and 789 aircraft, not 773 - and the 77X is too far off in any plans to consider.
Dec 9, 2018, 11:19 am
#25
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: New York, NY
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Posts: 165
What I think he is referring to is that the 788 and 789 do not have INT F just J, and with the 77W having 8 INT F seats. There are only 20 77W's in the fleet. Furthemore with the 772's getting PE and losing J while increasing Y, the 788's with decreasing J and increasing PE and Y the 77W and 789 are the last two to be reconfigured. Granted the 789's are still being shipped but increasing someting like FFD which is only for Flagship First and decreasing First, it makes no sense.
Dec 9, 2018, 11:33 am
#26
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: RDU
Posts: 2,263
Is it conceivable that AA will try to act more like a top-tier global carrier, and offer FFD to Intl/Transcon First Class, as well as CK/EXP/ONE international travelers (perhaps J-class only, given that you can't buy F on most intl flights even if you wanted to)? Obviously capacity would be a big issue as you'd likely add 100+ passengers daily at major airports, but it would certainly add to the premium experience AA says they're going for w/ Flagship service.
Dec 9, 2018, 11:54 am
#27
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Location: Austin
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What I think he is referring to is that the 788 and 789 do not have INT F just J, and with the 77W having 8 INT F seats. There are only 20 77W's in the fleet. Furthemore with the 772's getting PE and losing J while increasing Y, the 788's with decreasing J and increasing PE and Y the 77W and 789 are the last two to be reconfigured. Granted the 789's are still being shipped but increasing someting like FFD which is only for Flagship First and decreasing First, it makes no sense.