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-   -   Boeing 737 MAX 8 crashes and effects on AA 737 MAX 8s (NOT reaccommodation) (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1939333-boeing-737-max-8-crashes-effects-aa-737-max-8s-not-reaccommodation.html)

nk15 Nov 3, 19 9:42 am


Originally Posted by ryan182 (Post 31695356)
Actually someone did lose their job recently, President and CEO of commercial aircraft Kevin McAllister was fired in October. Further as it seems you have access to the Internet you might want to leverage that access to educate yourself, starting with the fact that the US is currently, and has always been, a representative democracy and that "true democracy" tends to end poorly. You also could have learned about the aforementioned firing from the same Internet...

If the system was working properly, several people should have been criminally charged, and, minimally, fired or forced to resign, in both Boeing and FAA.

ryan182 Nov 9, 19 1:38 am


Originally Posted by nk15 (Post 31696582)
If the system was working properly, several people should have been criminally charged, and, minimally, fired or forced to resign, in both Boeing and FAA.

Curious, just who are these people you think should be criminally charged and which criminal statutes do you think they've violated? I'm not giving boeing or the FAA a pass here, if in the course of the investigations its determined that there was a violation of law people should be held accountable, but in our system of justice we don't haul people off to the gulag because people on the Internet are mad. As to firings we do actually fire people when twitter gets all riled up, one can debate if that's appropriate or not, but I quite like our system of not denying someone their liberty unless they've been afforded due process and proven guilty of a crime. Real life isn't a TV show, investigations and due process take time and that's a good thing or at least its better than the alternative - let the process play out before being outraged.

footballfanatic Nov 9, 19 6:38 am

If only it were possible to get some real competition in this area again— Lockheed perhaps?

joeyE Nov 20, 19 10:23 am

Does AA still load MAX flights for 6-8 months out, only to cancel them as the dates get closer? Seems like we’ve reached the point where it’d make sense to not load future MAX flights. If it does fly again, only then start loading...purely to avoid the whole ‘book and then get cancelled’, times millions of reservations..

MiamiAirport Formerly NY George Nov 20, 19 10:42 am


Originally Posted by joeyE (Post 31758116)
Does AA still load MAX flights for 6-8 months out, only to cancel them as the dates get closer? Seems like we’ve reached the point where it’d make sense to not load future MAX flights. If it does fly again, only then start loading...purely to avoid the whole ‘book and then get cancelled’, times millions of reservations..

For now I think AA has the Max loaded after sometime in March. The "fix" constantly seems to be weeks away and then there's no fix. Not sure what Boeing is telling the airlines of why the FAA doesn't seem to want to certify the a/c for flight.

ijgordon Nov 20, 19 12:31 pm


Originally Posted by joeyE (Post 31758116)
Does AA still load MAX flights for 6-8 months out, only to cancel them as the dates get closer? Seems like we’ve reached the point where it’d make sense to not load future MAX flights. If it does fly again, only then start loading...purely to avoid the whole ‘book and then get cancelled’, times millions of reservations..

When exactly would you recommend they start loading the flights? You think it makes sense to fly a bunch of half empty planes around for a few weeks because they’re not going to fill them up if they’re not on the schedule in advance.

JDiver Nov 20, 19 1:23 pm


Originally Posted by footballfanatic (Post 31718396)
If only it were possible to get some real competition in this area again— Lockheed perhaps?

No major US aircraft manufacturer has been perfect.

Douglas = DC-10, major design flaws, hull losses from explosive decompression cutting control cables as direct result of those flaws.

Lockheed = L-188 Electra, major design flaw leading to hull losses from aircraft literally shaking its wings off (“whirl mode”)

Boeing = 737 MAX series, MCAS et al.

The former were modified, recertified. The latter will be as well. But not before the world certifying agencies make sure Boeing corrects the known deficiencies. The relevant airlines will keep on pushing the schedule dates out as necessary - currently, 6 March.

N830MH Nov 20, 19 1:53 pm


Originally Posted by ijgordon (Post 31758646)
When exactly would you recommend they start loading the flights? You think it makes sense to fly a bunch of half empty planes around for a few weeks because they’re not going to fill them up if they’re not on the schedule in advance.

Patience! They will show up a schedule soon. Just try to be patiently. Give it a time. They still have to be fixed the MCAS and etc.

nk15 Nov 20, 19 6:41 pm

I suggest they refit the MAX with ejecting seats and parachutes, to boost the public's confidence...

joeyE Nov 21, 19 7:01 am


Originally Posted by ijgordon (Post 31758646)
When exactly would you recommend they start loading the flights? You think it makes sense to fly a bunch of half empty planes around for a few weeks because they’re not going to fill them up if they’re not on the schedule in advance.

I'd say T-6 weeks from 1st known flight. If they announced tomorrow they were back in service, I don't see revenue service for a a few weeks anyway.....too many moving parts.... So I agree that you'd have a bunch of half-full planes for awhile (for many issues including logistics, emotions...) I think that makes more sense then to load flights which clearly are never going to operate, only to cancel and leave hundreds of thousands in a lurch, month after month, quarter after quarter.

JDiver Nov 21, 19 12:11 pm

Certification is an unknown at this time, and must be not only by the US FAA, but by the civil aviation authorities of each country the MAX will fly in - China, Canada, Indonesia and many more. Once the certification is granted, the aircraft must be updated with software and hardware upgrades, “de-mothballed”, flight tested. Pilots and mechanics must receive the new operating manuals and training materials, and be trained - which may require training in scarce simulators. (Though as AA already purchased the “options” that will be retrofitted to all MAX aircraft and will be spared that step, they must still fulfill all the others.)

AA has already changed the estimated operations date five times. Trying to determine when AA will be flying the MAX again is a crAAp shoot at this time, which is why in November of 2019 AA is guessing after 6 March 2020.

N830MH Nov 26, 19 11:12 pm

Great news! FAA says it will handle all approvals for new 737-MAX.

Boeing will resuming deliveries the 737-MAX aircraft to the airlines in December. They will put back to service in January.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...jets/40714421/

rossmacd Nov 27, 19 3:32 am


Originally Posted by N830MH (Post 31781098)
Great news! FAA says it will handle all approvals for new 737-MAX.

Why is that great news? FAA has shown its capabilities, or lack of, with respect to certification, hence it would be much better to get approval from another (more credible) agency.

chrisfwm Nov 27, 19 6:58 am


Originally Posted by rossmacd (Post 31781470)
Why is that great news? FAA has shown its capabilities, or lack of, with respect to certification, hence it would be much better to get approval from another (more credible) agency.

I guess good new is Boeing no longer in control over MAX's approval, instead FAA will be in "charge". However, FAA is exposed in this ordeal as well, not sure how much of a confidence boost at this point.

If Boeing thinks FAA recert will be the end of the saga, it is in a world of shock. Truth is, I bet they know this is just a tiny step towards the recovery, if there will ever be one.

JonNYC Nov 27, 19 7:32 am


Originally Posted by N830MH (Post 31781098)
Great news! FAA says it will handle all approvals for new 737-MAX.

Boeing will resuming deliveries the 737-MAX aircraft to the airlines in December. They will put back to service in January.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...jets/40714421/

Read the article again please.


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