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CX 888 (YVR-JFK) with connecting AA flight- delay protection?

CX 888 (YVR-JFK) with connecting AA flight- delay protection?

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Old Aug 22, 18, 8:24 am
  #1  
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CX 888 (YVR-JFK) with connecting AA flight- delay protection?

So I need to take a redeye from YVR (Vancouver)-RDU. AA doesn't have any redeyes outside of summer season, so my only option is to take the CX YVR-JFK flight (the continuation of the HKG-YVR flight). Surprisingly, this seems to be one of the only CX US-based flights which AA doesn't codeshare. So I need to book this as 2 separate tickets.

In any case, the JFK-RDU connection has an 85-minute layover from YVR. Unfortunately, 1) the redeye leaves too late to clear US immigration in YVR, so I'd do that at JFK, and 2) the CX flight is routinely 30-45 mins late (as one small sample size, it's been delayed 30+ mins on more than 50% of the last 2 weeks flight, and .flightstats shows 45% as very late or excessive late).

I emailed the CK desk to ask if I would be protected on the AA segment for a later flight. This was the response: If you book a separate reservation on Cathay and then a separate reservation on American and then Cathay has a delay or late arrival, it is usually the disrupting carrier that needs to make the change to you AA reservation.

This seems wrong. How would CX even know I have a separate connecting flight, and why is it their problem if I'm late on a separate ticket?

My alternative is to take the next JFK-RDU flight with a 5-hour layover, and then standby if we happen to get in on time.

Thoughts?

Last edited by dave_261; Aug 22, 18 at 8:32 am
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Old Aug 22, 18, 8:32 am
  #2  
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You are working under the wrong assumption, e.g. that because CX and AA do not codeshare on the YVR-JFK hop that you cannot book as a single ticket. CX and AA, of course, have an interline ticketing agreement (as do all OW carriers) and you may therefore book a single ticket. The pricing will be for the separate segments, but you are already willing to pay for separate tickets. You may not be able to do this online, but you may certainly do it and thus avoid the problem of separate tickets.

The answer you received from CX is the right answer to the wrong question. CX would be responsible if you were connecting at JFK, but since you would not be connecting at JFK, you would not have been protected by CX. As a general proposition, you should always refer to the COC and fare rules and not to emailed Q&A.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 8:50 am
  #3  
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Originally Posted by dave_261 View Post
So I need to take a redeye from YVR (Vancouver)-RDU. AA doesn't have any redeyes outside of summer season, so my only option is to take the CX YVR-JFK flight (the continuation of the HKG-YVR flight). Surprisingly, this seems to be one of the only CX US-based flights which AA doesn't codeshare. So I need to book this as 2 separate tickets.

In any case, the JFK-RDU connection has an 85-minute layover from YVR. Unfortunately, 1) the redeye leaves too late to clear US immigration in YVR, so I'd do that at JFK, and 2) the CX flight is routinely 30-45 mins late (as one small sample size, it's been delayed 30+ mins on more than 50% of the last 2 weeks flight, and .flightstats shows 45% as very late or excessive late).

I emailed the CK desk to ask if I would be protected on the AA segment for a later flight. This was the response: If you book a separate reservation on Cathay and then a separate reservation on American and then Cathay has a delay or late arrival, it is usually the disrupting carrier that needs to make the change to you AA reservation.

This seems wrong. How would CX even know I have a separate connecting flight, and why is it their problem if I'm late on a separate ticket?

My alternative is to take the next JFK-RDU flight with a 5-hour layover, and then standby if we happen to get in on time.

Thoughts?
They are separate tickets, so this would be similar to showing up late for an AA flight, if you were originating at JFK.
That is, the "flat tire rule". AA will try to get you on a flight that day, but you are not "protected". However, as a CK animal, you would be more equal than other animals....... (pardon the Orwell reference)
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Old Aug 22, 18, 8:55 am
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Just have CX (or AA) or a good travel agent book it all in one PNR (even if two separate tickets in one PNR) and you will be totally safe. Super easy
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Old Aug 22, 18, 9:11 am
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AA will protect across separate tickets as long as the other carrier is oneworld. If the CX flight is delayed, you shouldn't have any problem getting rebooked onto a later JFK-RDU flight. Just go to the AA check-in desks at JFK downstairs just after you exit immigration and customs.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 9:13 am
  #6  
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Got this from the oneworld site. Shows the flights you want on a random day.

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Old Aug 22, 18, 9:17 am
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On top of what above mentioned, I would like to advise OP that the underlying reason why you can't clear US customs at YVR is not just because it's leaving too late, it is because the flight is part of HKG - JFK flight. It would be treated as international flight, and thus leaving at YVR international terminal, instead of domestic (where AA and other CA-US flights) terminal.

Also, I've taken this flights handful times in the last 12 months and did not encounter serious delay myself. Usually we arrived before JFK immigration opened and had to stay in the aircraft until about 7am. This by no way means that you should book them as two separate tickets though.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 11:33 am
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Originally Posted by JTK View Post
Got this from the oneworld site. Shows the flights you want on a random day.

I had found this already, but when you go to book it, it directs you to the CX website. Problem is that you can't actually book this on their site. It won't let you book anything into RDU... not showing as a valid destination.

I'm going to check w/ our corporate TA and see if they can get these under 1 PNR.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:17 pm
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What is the CX-AA MCT at JFK for an I-D connection? If it's more than 85 minutes, then I don't think the OP will be able to get the two flights on a single ticket. And AA might not even be required to protect a passenger on separate tickets if MCT is not satisfied. (Not sure about the latter point, but it would make sense.)
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:23 pm
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Have you considered just booking the AC redeye YVR-YYZ-RDU? I realize they're not OW, but if this is a one time thing, it might be worth it for the convenience/peace of mind.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:25 pm
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Originally Posted by guv1976 View Post
What is the CX-AA MCT at JFK for an I-D connection? If it's more than 85 minutes, then I don't think the OP will be able to get the two flights on a single ticket. And AA might not even be required to protect a passenger on separate tickets if MCT is not satisfied. (Not sure about the latter point, but it would make sense.)
Looks like MCT is 1:15:

Results from https://www.ExpertFlyer.com
Code:
Minimum Connect Times:
Connecting at JFK
Incoming airline CX
Outgoing airline AA
Flight type International to Domestic

STANDARD.D/D...D/I...I/D...I/I.
ONLINE   1.00  1.15  1.45  2.00
OFFLINE  1.00  1.15  1.45  2.00
** OR * ARE ALL
CX-AA ID  1.15 ALL  - FLT    1 - 6099
**-AA ID SUP   ALL  - FLT    1 - 9099 CUBA - ALL   
**-AA ID  2.00 TRM 7  - 8  
CX-** ID  2.00
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:48 pm
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Originally Posted by JJeffrey View Post
AA will protect across separate tickets as long as the other carrier is oneworld. If the CX flight is delayed, you shouldn't have any problem getting rebooked onto a later JFK-RDU flight. Just go to the AA check-in desks at JFK downstairs just after you exit immigration and customs.
Not exactly. While AA certainly will protect AA-AA and AA-OW, they are not responsible to protect CX-AA. That's because the delaying carrier (CX) is responsible in these situations, not the onward carrier (AA). In this instance, CX would be responsible for protecting the JFK-RDU flight. Whether or not they'd provide any protection is a separate question to which I don't have an answer. According to the below policy, it looks like CX *should* protect in this case, but I don't know if that would work in practice.

Here's what the AA protection policy says:

AA to/from AA or a oneworld® Carrier
If a customer is holding separate tickets on AA or another oneworld carrier, customers holding separate tickets where travel is on oneworld airlines should be treated as through ticketed customers. In the event of a disruption on the originating ticket, the carrier responsible for the disruption will be required to reroute the customer to their final destination. The ticket stock of the second ticket must be of a oneworld carrier, eligible under the Endorsement Waiver Agreement. You may contact AA Reservations 1-800-433-7300 (U.S. and Canada) or outside the U.S. and Canada, reference Worldwide Reservations Numbers for additional information if the separate ticket is for travel on a oneworld carrier.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:51 pm
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Originally Posted by JJeffrey View Post
AA will protect across separate tickets as long as the other carrier is oneworld. If the CX flight is delayed, you shouldn't have any problem getting rebooked onto a later JFK-RDU flight. Just go to the AA check-in desks at JFK downstairs just after you exit immigration and customs.
Though swingaling is correct, you are too: AA will generally work with the passenger to move him / her on.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 12:53 pm
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Originally Posted by swingaling View Post
Not exactly. While AA certainly will protect AA-AA and AA-OW, they are not responsible to protect CX-AA. That's because the delaying carrier (CX) is responsible in these situations, not the onward carrier (AA). In this instance, CX would be responsible for protecting the JFK-RDU flight. Whether or not they'd provide any protection is a separate question to which I don't have an answer.
Since AA tells its customers that the late-delivering carrier is required to protect the passenger, AA is responsible for making sure that the passenger is, in fact, protected. And they do, either by liaising with the late-delivering carrier, or just by re-accommodating the passenger themselves.
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Old Aug 22, 18, 1:13 pm
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Originally Posted by mizzou miles View Post
Just have CX (or AA) or a good travel agent book it all in one PNR (even if two separate tickets in one PNR) and you will be totally safe. Super easy
Apologies if I missed this elsewhere, but I am confused why it matters whether these separate tickets are one single PNR or not. Doesn't the same interline agreement apply regardless if they are one PNR or multiple PNR's?
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