Last edit by: JDiver
The new 737 MAX 8 is equipped with new Rockwell Collins Interior Design advanced ultra slimline lavatories (29 in F, 24 in Y) (link). Under Project Oasis, 737-823 and two class Airbus A321 aircraft will be refitted with these lavatories and the Rockwell Collins Meridian ultra slimline seats.
Airlines must comply with the Air Carrier Access Act (not the Americans with Disabilities Act), which states single aisle aircraft are not required to have ACAA compliant accessible lavatories.
CFR Title 14 Chapter II Subchapter D Part 382 Subpart E Section 382.63 (link)
382.63 What are the requirements for accessible lavatories?
(a) As a carrier, you must ensure that aircraft with more than one aisle in which lavatories are provided shall include at least one accessible lavatory.
(1) The accessible lavatory must permit a qualified individual with a disability to enter, maneuver within as necessary to use all lavatory facilities, and leave, by means of the aircraft's on-board wheelchair.
(2) The accessible lavatory must afford privacy to persons using the on-board wheelchair equivalent to that afforded ambulatory users.
(3) The lavatory shall provide door locks, accessible call buttons, grab bars, faucets and other controls, and dispensers usable by qualified individuals with a disability, including wheelchair users and persons with manual impairments.
(b) With respect to aircraft with only one aisle in which lavatories are provided, you may, but are not required to, provide an accessible lavatory.
Airlines must comply with the Air Carrier Access Act (not the Americans with Disabilities Act), which states single aisle aircraft are not required to have ACAA compliant accessible lavatories.
CFR Title 14 Chapter II Subchapter D Part 382 Subpart E Section 382.63 (link)
382.63 What are the requirements for accessible lavatories?
(a) As a carrier, you must ensure that aircraft with more than one aisle in which lavatories are provided shall include at least one accessible lavatory.
(1) The accessible lavatory must permit a qualified individual with a disability to enter, maneuver within as necessary to use all lavatory facilities, and leave, by means of the aircraft's on-board wheelchair.
(2) The accessible lavatory must afford privacy to persons using the on-board wheelchair equivalent to that afforded ambulatory users.
(3) The lavatory shall provide door locks, accessible call buttons, grab bars, faucets and other controls, and dispensers usable by qualified individuals with a disability, including wheelchair users and persons with manual impairments.
(b) With respect to aircraft with only one aisle in which lavatories are provided, you may, but are not required to, provide an accessible lavatory.
Is the Oasis / MAX lavatory Air Carrier Access Act / ACA compliant?
#1
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Is the Oasis / MAX lavatory Air Carrier Access Act / ACA compliant?
Hi-
Hearing that they are only 24 inches wide got me thinking this must be a violation of the (American's With Disabilities Act?) I'm pretty sure the standard width for a door is 30 inches in a public or commercial building. I don't see how airplanes can be exempted since disabled people fly all the time and are allowed to board sometimes before anyone else.
I'm hoping a law-suit gets the bathroom size back to more usable standards for all of us. I'm not Disabled but I'm 6' 5" and 290lbs. When sitting down my hips are about 23 inches wide! I'm going to have to make sure to never fly on one of these awful planes.
-Paul
Hearing that they are only 24 inches wide got me thinking this must be a violation of the (American's With Disabilities Act?) I'm pretty sure the standard width for a door is 30 inches in a public or commercial building. I don't see how airplanes can be exempted since disabled people fly all the time and are allowed to board sometimes before anyone else.
I'm hoping a law-suit gets the bathroom size back to more usable standards for all of us. I'm not Disabled but I'm 6' 5" and 290lbs. When sitting down my hips are about 23 inches wide! I'm going to have to make sure to never fly on one of these awful planes.
-Paul
Last edited by JDiver; Jul 10, 2018 at 6:43 pm Reason: Restore original post title
#2
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Last edited by JDiver; Jul 10, 2018 at 6:44 pm Reason: Activate link
#3
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The Air Carrier Access Sct applies, not ADA.
I assume they are compliant. They likely would not have gotten designed, certified and installed otherwise.
I assume they are compliant. They likely would not have gotten designed, certified and installed otherwise.
#5
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In general, it's a pretty good guess that any commercial aircraft that has been through the extremely rigorous certification process actually meets the certification requirements.
#6
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<redacted> it seems the DOT and the ACCESS Advisory Committee has to an agreement on bathroom standards for single aisle aircraft with more than 125 seats. <redacted>the ground based standard for a doorway is 32 inches, so I would expect some new rule where at least one bathroom door has to be at least 32 inches wide.
-Paul
Last edited by JDiver; Jul 11, 2018 at 12:06 am Reason: Redacted ad hominem
#7
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https://www.transportation.gov/acces...sory-committee
<redacted> it seems the DOT and the ACCESS Advisory Committee has to an agreement on bathroom standards for single aisle aircraft with more than 125 seats. <redacted> the ground based standard for a doorway is 32 inches, so I would expect some new rule where at least one bathroom door has to be at least 32 inches wide.
-Paul
<redacted> it seems the DOT and the ACCESS Advisory Committee has to an agreement on bathroom standards for single aisle aircraft with more than 125 seats. <redacted> the ground based standard for a doorway is 32 inches, so I would expect some new rule where at least one bathroom door has to be at least 32 inches wide.
-Paul
In the meantime it's a pretty safe bet that, given the extensive regulatory and certification process that commercial airlines are subject to in the US, AA isn't flying around with illegal lavs.
Last edited by JDiver; Jul 11, 2018 at 12:07 am Reason: Edited out previously deleted post content
#8
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https://www.transportation.gov/acces...sory-committee
<redacted> it seems the DOT and the ACCESS Advisory Committee has to an agreement on bathroom standards for single aisle aircraft with more than 125 seats. <redacted> the ground based standard for a doorway is 32 inches, so I would expect some new rule where at least one bathroom door has to be at least 32 inches wide.
-Paul
<redacted> it seems the DOT and the ACCESS Advisory Committee has to an agreement on bathroom standards for single aisle aircraft with more than 125 seats. <redacted> the ground based standard for a doorway is 32 inches, so I would expect some new rule where at least one bathroom door has to be at least 32 inches wide.
-Paul
Last edited by JDiver; Jul 11, 2018 at 12:08 am Reason: Edited out previously deleted post content
#11
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There's still a (slightly) larger lav in front of F. Since AA does not have a policy strictly against Y pax using the F lav, any special needs pax (disability or oversized person) could use the forward lav.
#12
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That's my backup plan if I get equipment swapped onto something with the "Oasis" config. Which for now is fairly easy to avoid.
#13
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American Airlines and aspire sometimes do not belong in the same sentence. AA has prioritized seat density on its narrowbodies aircraft going forward - in Economy, denser than on Southwest. Perhaps when the 7M8 and Project Oasis include most of the AA narrowbodies, it will bring about the passengers Project Awaysis?
#14
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If there is a new lav size rule that goes into effect surely carriers will negotiate a generous transition period and then rip out a few seats where required. Until then...
#15
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If you look inside an AA MAX 8, there is not much differentiating it from the inside of a Spirit/Frontier/Allegiant aircraft. In fact, service might be better on the latter as well.