Jan 3, 2018, 5:05 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
AA has increased award availability at the SAAver / MileSAAver level, apparently at the cost of reducing the availability of nonstop and direct routing and increasing availability requiring connections using married segment logic.
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: “Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space they’ve opened up is on connecting flights. They’re offering married segment availability — award space that’s highly restrictive...”
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game American’s New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when you’re searching for award space... you’ll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Link to Boarding Area: Sunday Reader Question: What are married segments?
Link to Worldspan page with extensive information on MSL and coding.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: “Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space they’ve opened up is on connecting flights. They’re offering married segment availability — award space that’s highly restrictive...”
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game American’s New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
Married Segment Logic and Effects on Awards
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when you’re searching for award space... you’ll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Married segment logic controls routings based on origin and destination, rather than segment-by-segment availability. Boarding Area
From Amadeus: Married Segment Control Link
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
- Ensures more effective forecasting by preventing O&D misuse and matching revenue forecasts with final revenues.
- Improves consistency of sales processes by controlling travel agent selling behaviour.
- Fully customisable and flexible solution that meets airline unique system requirements.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
More award availability restricted by married segments / connections
Jun 18, 2018, 5:19 pm
#166
Join Date: Jun 2010
Programs: Whatever's Cheapest, Accruing Miles, Redeeming for Premium Cabins, Not Chasing Status Unnecessarily
Posts: 2,264
Never Get Married - AAdvantage Not You (award & married Segments)
I accept paying a little Marriage (segment) tax of 7500 miles to put on the last segment of my otherwise ok award.
I get it, they need the loot. Times are tough in oligarchical airline world.
But what I don't accept is piecing everything together for multiple tickets, putting in everyone's names, the award taxes repricing, and the "flight is no longer available", calling in and being told, "Ok that last segment isn't available, someone must have gotten it, if you can hold it then tell me the PNR and I will piece it together, ok thx, ok your 2nd to last segment isn't available now"
That's just plain CPU hacking the award to make it unavailable to book. And that makes the miles completely devalued.
I get it, they need the loot. Times are tough in oligarchical airline world.
But what I don't accept is piecing everything together for multiple tickets, putting in everyone's names, the award taxes repricing, and the "flight is no longer available", calling in and being told, "Ok that last segment isn't available, someone must have gotten it, if you can hold it then tell me the PNR and I will piece it together, ok thx, ok your 2nd to last segment isn't available now"
That's just plain CPU hacking the award to make it unavailable to book. And that makes the miles completely devalued.
Jun 18, 2018, 5:25 pm
#169
Join Date: Jun 2010
Programs: Whatever's Cheapest, Accruing Miles, Redeeming for Premium Cabins, Not Chasing Status Unnecessarily
Posts: 2,264
USA1 = US airport not AA hub
USA2 = US airport AA hub
UK1 = Major UK airport
UK2 = Major UK airport
USA1 --> USA 2 7.5k miles
36 hours later USA2 --> UK1 30k miles
12 days later UK2 --> USA2 30kmiles
8 hours later USA2 --> USA1 7.5k miles
It won't let you book the UK2--> USA2 and USA2 --> USA1 flights together EVEN if you pay the extra miles. You have to use a separate PNR.
The agent has the gall to say "someone grabbed it". It's not grabbed.
IT'S AA NOT WANTING USA1 AADVANTAGE MEMBERS TO EASILY USE THE MILES AT ALL!
USA2 = US airport AA hub
UK1 = Major UK airport
UK2 = Major UK airport
USA1 --> USA 2 7.5k miles
36 hours later USA2 --> UK1 30k miles
12 days later UK2 --> USA2 30kmiles
8 hours later USA2 --> USA1 7.5k miles
It won't let you book the UK2--> USA2 and USA2 --> USA1 flights together EVEN if you pay the extra miles. You have to use a separate PNR.
The agent has the gall to say "someone grabbed it". It's not grabbed.
IT'S AA NOT WANTING USA1 AADVANTAGE MEMBERS TO EASILY USE THE MILES AT ALL!
Jun 18, 2018, 5:42 pm
#173
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brighton. UK
Programs: BA Gold / VS /IHG Diamond & Ambassador
Posts: 14,176
What is ridiculous is airlines imposing 'surcharges' and 'fees' and trying to give the impression that they are 'taxes' when they are not.
Jun 18, 2018, 5:56 pm
#174
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
USA1 = US airport not AA hub
USA2 = US airport AA hub
UK1 = Major UK airport
UK2 = Major UK airport
USA1 --> USA 2 7.5k miles
36 hours later USA2 --> UK1 30k miles
12 days later UK2 --> USA2 30kmiles
8 hours later USA2 --> USA1 7.5k miles
It won't let you book the UK2--> USA2 and USA2 --> USA1 flights together EVEN if you pay the extra miles. You have to use a separate PNR.
The agent has the gall to say "someone grabbed it". It's not grabbed.
IT'S AA NOT WANTING USA1 AADVANTAGE MEMBERS TO EASILY USE THE MILES AT ALL!
USA2 = US airport AA hub
UK1 = Major UK airport
UK2 = Major UK airport
USA1 --> USA 2 7.5k miles
36 hours later USA2 --> UK1 30k miles
12 days later UK2 --> USA2 30kmiles
8 hours later USA2 --> USA1 7.5k miles
It won't let you book the UK2--> USA2 and USA2 --> USA1 flights together EVEN if you pay the extra miles. You have to use a separate PNR.
The agent has the gall to say "someone grabbed it". It's not grabbed.
IT'S AA NOT WANTING USA1 AADVANTAGE MEMBERS TO EASILY USE THE MILES AT ALL!
Maximum permitted domestic connection: 3:59 hours
Maximum permitted international connection: 23:59 hours
See HELP DESK: MileSAAver / SAAver award questions, assistance.
Jun 18, 2018, 5:57 pm
#175
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2017
Programs: Rapid Rewards, AAdvantage, SkyMiles
Posts: 2,931
Jun 18, 2018, 6:07 pm
#176
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Not here; there!
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 29,536
"Maximum permitted domestic connection: 3:59 hours"
Not any more: Have you seen some of the domestic connections AA is now offering on an award search?
And in any event, on an international award, one gets up to 24 hours to connect -- even on the domestic (U.S.) portion of the itinerary.
Not any more: Have you seen some of the domestic connections AA is now offering on an award search?
And in any event, on an international award, one gets up to 24 hours to connect -- even on the domestic (U.S.) portion of the itinerary.
Jun 18, 2018, 6:16 pm
#177
Moderator: American AAdvantage
Join Date: May 2000
Location: NorCal - SMF area
Programs: AA LT Plat; HH LT Diamond, Maître-plongeur des Muccis
Posts: 62,948
"Maximum permitted domestic connection: 3:59 hours"
Not any more: Have you seen some of the domestic connections AA is now offering on an award search?
And in any event, on an international award, one gets up to 24 hours to connect -- even on the domestic (U.S.) portion of the itinerary.
Not any more: Have you seen some of the domestic connections AA is now offering on an award search?
And in any event, on an international award, one gets up to 24 hours to connect -- even on the domestic (U.S.) portion of the itinerary.
Yes, the final connection is part of an international award and would normally be treated that way. But if anyone reading thinks they could get a 36 hour connection, they won’t be able to do so.
