Last edit by: Prospero
AA has increased award availability at the SAAver / MileSAAver level, apparently at the cost of reducing the availability of nonstop and direct routing and increasing availability requiring connections using married segment logic.
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space theyve opened up is on connecting flights. Theyre offering married segment availability award space thats highly restrictive...
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game Americans New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when youre searching for award space... youll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Link to Boarding Area: Sunday Reader Question: What are married segments?
Link to Worldspan page with extensive information on MSL and coding.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space theyve opened up is on connecting flights. Theyre offering married segment availability award space thats highly restrictive...
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game Americans New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
Married Segment Logic and Effects on Awards
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when youre searching for award space... youll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Married segment logic controls routings based on origin and destination, rather than segment-by-segment availability. Boarding Area
From Amadeus: Married Segment Control Link
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
- Ensures more effective forecasting by preventing O&D misuse and matching revenue forecasts with final revenues.
- Improves consistency of sales processes by controlling travel agent selling behaviour.
- Fully customisable and flexible solution that meets airline unique system requirements.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
More award availability restricted by married segments / connections
#211
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Not here; there!
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 29,366
Is that possible? AA is quoting the AAnytime price (65k), not the sum of the two separate segments (37.5k) for WAS-MUC. I thought the point was that AA is using married segment logic to charge a price that is higher than the sum of the individual flights, let alone the price of a saver WAS-MUC award (30k), unless they're booked separately.
#212
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: BOS, BWI, DCA, IAD
Programs: American, Delta, JetBlue, United
Posts: 2,038
AA generally has the policy of protecting you on separate PNRs if the long MUC-CLT is delayed and you miss your CLT-DCA connection. You'd have to retrieve your bag at US Customs anyway, I'd think about booking two separate tickets if you cannot get them to book it as one.
Yes its annoying to have to pay the extra 7.5k for the CLT-DCA ticket, but I don't think it would be much of an issue if you had to book it that way.
Yes its annoying to have to pay the extra 7.5k for the CLT-DCA ticket, but I don't think it would be much of an issue if you had to book it that way.
1) The 30k award ticket MUC-CLT is no longer available on the 3-4 dates when I prefer to travel, so the option of obtaining a 30k award ticket MUC-CTL and a 7.5k CTL-DCA award ticket is no longer on the table.
2) I have therefore booked and put on hold a 30k award ticket MUC-MAD-BOS-DCA. The hold will last until September 12th. I took this route on an award ticket last July and it's quite satisfactory, apart from the need to get up about 4:30 AM to drive to the airport. If nothing better opens up in the next few days, I'll purchase this set of flights.
Once again, thanks very much!
Last edited by JPG3392; Sep 6, 2018 at 7:18 pm Reason: Corrected inaccurate wording.
#213
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 47
Award Space Based on Origin NOT on Segments? (Tell me im not crazy)
I recently had a terribly frustrating experience with AA platinum desk. I was giving an explanation that seems to be complete garbage to me...but I wanted to see if anyone else had some insights that would make me feel less like "im taking crazy pills"
I was trying to book a Saver award on AA EZE-MIA-ORD-JAC for my wive to come with me on a work trip. The normal routing is EZE-DFW-JAC but there is not availability that day. However, my purchased ticket has me going the routing I gave above via MIA. When I search for the entire leg it doesnt show any Saver availability. However, if I search for EZE-MIA I see plenty of saver awards and if I search MIA-ORD-JAC i see tons of seats also. In trying to piece them together I called the platinum desk to have them help me.After more than an hour the supervisor told me I couldn't get it to work because essentially I was being blocked from the saver space on the MIA-ORD-JAC because I was coming from EZE. She told me that there was only a fixed amount of award space available between each city pair...so AA was blocking EZE passengers from having award space to JAC but providing it for people coming from MIA. They told me award availability is based 100% on your origin, not based on a fixed amount of seats made available on each segment.
So this sounds like a lazy and uninformed person trying to make up a reason for why they couldn't explain this problem to me. I let it go for now but I want to make sure I am not going crazy...
Any thought?
I was trying to book a Saver award on AA EZE-MIA-ORD-JAC for my wive to come with me on a work trip. The normal routing is EZE-DFW-JAC but there is not availability that day. However, my purchased ticket has me going the routing I gave above via MIA. When I search for the entire leg it doesnt show any Saver availability. However, if I search for EZE-MIA I see plenty of saver awards and if I search MIA-ORD-JAC i see tons of seats also. In trying to piece them together I called the platinum desk to have them help me.After more than an hour the supervisor told me I couldn't get it to work because essentially I was being blocked from the saver space on the MIA-ORD-JAC because I was coming from EZE. She told me that there was only a fixed amount of award space available between each city pair...so AA was blocking EZE passengers from having award space to JAC but providing it for people coming from MIA. They told me award availability is based 100% on your origin, not based on a fixed amount of seats made available on each segment.
So this sounds like a lazy and uninformed person trying to make up a reason for why they couldn't explain this problem to me. I let it go for now but I want to make sure I am not going crazy...
Any thought?
#214
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: TUL
Programs: AA Plat, DL FO/1MM, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, National Exec Elite
Posts: 2,102
Unfortunately, this is the way things are. Not sure of the fancy term that AA uses, but some call it "Married Segment Availability." If you need to go from Tulsa to Austin, you would do a search TUL-AUS and get a price - say $100. If you were to then search for the TUL-DFW and DFW-AUS segments individually, it's highly unlikely you'd find that those segments were $50 each. Fares and availability are market specific. Previously, award space was not subject to these same controls and awards could be pieced together in the manner you describe. Nowadays however, award tickets (on AA metal at least) are based on the origin and destination. In this case, they are not willing to sell EZE-MIA-ORD-JAC for the Saver mileage level.
#215
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Live: PWM/KBXM/BGR; Work: DCA/DFW/Everywhere; Play: LAS/MUC/MLE
Programs: AA EXP, DL PM, Hyatt Glob, Marriott Ambassador/LTP, Nat'l Exec Elite, mlife Noir, LEYE Gold
Posts: 6,630
Bottom line, you can still book it and probably even get it under a single PNR, it will just price out as two separate awards and you'll end up paying an extra 12.5k for the domestic part, or 25k up front. Not ideal but that's how it is now. Also if you have a citi card, JAC is a reduced mileage destination in October so that can take a little of the edge off.
#217
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: RDU <|> MMX
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Posts: 12,361
Thanks to all for the helpful and informative responses to my inquiry. Here is how things have developed and stand now.
1) The 30k award ticket MUC-CLT is no longer available on the 3-4 dates when I prefer to travel, so the option of obtaining a 30k award ticket MUC-CTL and a 7.5k CTL-DCA award ticket is no longer on the table.
2) I have therefore booked and put on hold a 30k award ticket MUC-MAD-BOS-DCA. The hold will last until September 12th. I took this route on an award ticket last July and it's quite satisfactory, apart from the need to get up about 4:30 AM to drive to the airport. If nothing better opens up in the next few days, I'll purchase this set of flights.
Once again, thanks very much!
1) The 30k award ticket MUC-CLT is no longer available on the 3-4 dates when I prefer to travel, so the option of obtaining a 30k award ticket MUC-CTL and a 7.5k CTL-DCA award ticket is no longer on the table.
2) I have therefore booked and put on hold a 30k award ticket MUC-MAD-BOS-DCA. The hold will last until September 12th. I took this route on an award ticket last July and it's quite satisfactory, apart from the need to get up about 4:30 AM to drive to the airport. If nothing better opens up in the next few days, I'll purchase this set of flights.
Once again, thanks very much!
#218
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: BOS, BWI, DCA, IAD
Programs: American, Delta, JetBlue, United
Posts: 2,038
Good plan. I would book the IB option now, then just keep an eye on availability over the next 10 months. If something better opens up, like the all AA MUC-CLT-DCA routing, you can call AA and switch for no fee (and get a refund of the IB surcharges). Booking this far out, I'd say it's highly likely that something better will pop up, especially as you're only looking for a single economy seat and have a little bit of flexibility in travel days.
Update: I have now been ticketed for award travel MUC-MAD-BOS-DCA on IB/AA at the cost of 30k miles + $197.41. As suggested above, I'll continue to monitor saver award availability MUC-DCA, and may make changes to my routing in the coming months. Thanks again to all for the helpful comments and suggestions.
Last edited by JPG3392; Sep 13, 2018 at 8:28 am Reason: Added updated information.
#219
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Los Angeles
Programs: WN CP & A-List, National ES
Posts: 163
I currently have an award on hold for SAN - LAX - NRT in SAAver J for 2 people. I only want the LAX-NRT segment. The CSR wont drop the SAN-LAX leg while the award is on hold. Am I correct that I can simple drop the first leg for free after it is ticketed? I have no status.
#220
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,424
I currently have an award on hold for SAN - LAX - NRT in SAAver J for 2 people. I only want the LAX-NRT segment. The CSR wont drop the SAN-LAX leg while the award is on hold. Am I correct that I can simple drop the first leg for free after it is ticketed? I have no status.
What is the reason the agent will not drop it?
#221
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Thousand Oaks, Ca., USA
Programs: AA Lifetime Plat; Bonvoy Titanium Lifetime Elite;Hyatt Globalist; HHonors Diamond; United Silver
Posts: 8,268
I currently have an award on hold for SAN - LAX - NRT in SAAver J for 2 people. I only want the LAX-NRT segment. The CSR wont drop the SAN-LAX leg while the award is on hold. Am I correct that I can simple drop the first leg for free after it is ticketed? I have no status.
#222
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: LAX,BUD
Programs: AA EXP,SPG G
Posts: 247
AA award snafu
Hi all, hope someone can help me with the following issue.
Need to get to LHR from LAX.
For my desired date there is J availability from SFO-LAX-LHR but space disappears if booking only LAX-LHR.
Placed it on hold, called in to drop the first segment but they weren't able to do it without canceling the whole itinerary. Never ran into this, since when does AA limits availability to certain city pairs? Any suggestions on how to drop that first segment? Obviously doing a return to SFO just to start the whole trip would be less than ideal...
Thanks
Need to get to LHR from LAX.
For my desired date there is J availability from SFO-LAX-LHR but space disappears if booking only LAX-LHR.
Placed it on hold, called in to drop the first segment but they weren't able to do it without canceling the whole itinerary. Never ran into this, since when does AA limits availability to certain city pairs? Any suggestions on how to drop that first segment? Obviously doing a return to SFO just to start the whole trip would be less than ideal...
Thanks
#224
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Bay Area
Programs: WN A-List, AA good-riddance, Safeway Club Card Extraordinaire
Posts: 3,851
Good rundown here:
https://onemileatatime.com/american-...award-tickets/
Is there no 1-stop availability out of LAX (connecting in, say, PHL or DFW)?
https://onemileatatime.com/american-...award-tickets/
Is there no 1-stop availability out of LAX (connecting in, say, PHL or DFW)?
#225
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 20,922