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-   -   144 TWOV China- AA Issues/Questions (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1837368-144-twov-china-aa-issues-questions.html)

moondog Apr 20, 2017 11:50 am


Originally Posted by carlosdca (Post 28206379)
In my hypothetical re-routing I did not say this happened after departure.

What if OP is re-routed NON-STOP PVG-LAX one day before his LAX-PVG departure (not unheard of). Go to the check in desk and say..but but, the original routing was through NRT, please use NRT as final destination?

In that case, he should not be allowed to fly without a visa. However, anyone who wanted to avail of TWOV would presumably decline that reroute.

muishkin Apr 20, 2017 12:21 pm

AA should print this in large font and distribute it to their agents.

For any travel containing the segments A-Mainland China-B

1. A is not in the same country as B. Neither is in mainland China.
2. departure for B minus arrival from A is less than 72/144 hrs.
3. Visa Free!

OskiBear Apr 20, 2017 12:23 pm


Originally Posted by ORDPLATAA (Post 28206364)

I guess my question would be (and I may have missed it) when reading TIMATIC: Does it actually state that the ticket must show or be constructed in such a way that the port in China is transit point (i.e. that the fare is actually a r/t ORD-NRT and either the outbound or return is routed via China)?

This is problematic because it requires/presumes that AA only accepts passengers utilizing TWOV when all one on ticket with AA. In my situation I described earlier, I had a separately booked ticket to an onward destination (third country). For me, this was nested within an AA LAX-PVG-LAX ticket.

arlflyer Apr 20, 2017 12:24 pm


Originally Posted by muishkin (Post 28206582)
AA should print this in large font and distribute it to their agents.

For any travel containing the segments A-Mainland China-B

1. A is not in the same country as B. Neither is in mainland China.
2. departure for B minus arrival from A is less than 72/144 hrs.
3. Visa Free!

4. And the word "transit" does not mean "transit".

MSPeconomist Apr 20, 2017 12:50 pm


Originally Posted by carlosdca (Post 28206379)
In my hypothetical re-routing I did not say this happened after departure.

What if OP is re-routed NON-STOP PVG-LAX one day before his LAX-PVG departure (not unheard of). Go to the check in desk and say..but but, the original routing was through NRT, please use NRT as final destination?

Hopefully the passenger has been notified of the rerouting before check in.

When a passenger learns about such a rerouting, he/she calls AA to explain that the rerouting isn't acceptable because of the TWOV rules and proposes some alternative itineraries that are TWOV complient for the same dates, origins, and destinations. It's there aren't any possibilities, AA should be willing to either rebook the other direction to make the entire itinerary TWOV complient (assuming that the outbound hasn't already been flown) or to change the travel date by the smallest number of days possible to obtain an itinerary that permits TWOV.

869 Apr 20, 2017 1:07 pm

I'd ask for PVG-SYD/AUH/DOH-LAX. Ha.

flyerCO Apr 20, 2017 2:16 pm

Just to point out the onward tickets doesn't even need to be for Air travel. If you have a confirmed ticket to board a cruise/train heading to another country then you qualify.

flyerCO Apr 20, 2017 2:21 pm


Originally Posted by carlosdca (Post 28206379)
In my hypothetical re-routing I did not say this happened after departure.

What if OP is re-routed NON-STOP PVG-LAX one day before his LAX-PVG departure (not unheard of). Go to the check in desk and say..but but, the original routing was through NRT, please use NRT as final destination?

Then the OP states the rerouting isn't acceptable because of TWOV issues. Either they change it by a day or reroute him through say HKG to make it compliant.

anacapamalibu Apr 20, 2017 2:30 pm


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 28206313)
, there should always be someone around at the check in area and then at the gate for such international departures who is an expert. Also, there's no reason an airline like AA can't generally try to assign their more experienced agents or international specialists to such international departures. If an agent doesn't know, they should be expected to learn the correct answer rather than penalizing the passenger by denying boarding.

How far of a walk is it to send a person over to Bradley Terminal?
With 5 Chinese airlines...there would probably be one with a staffed
check in desk. More likely than not...they would know.

But you got to find an employee without a uniform to go ask...LOL.:D




Air China CA TBIT (800) 882-8122
China Airlines CI TBIT (800) 227-5118
China Eastern MU TBIT (626) 583-1500
China Southern CZ TBIT (888) 338-8988
Sichuan Airlines 3U TBI

LHR/MEL/Europe FF Apr 20, 2017 3:20 pm

It would be pretty hard for agents to argue that they are applying the traditional definition of 'transit' if they looked at the provisions in context.

What sort of itinerary in 2017 would require a 144-hour 'transit' in Shanghai for the sole purpose of making a connection? The flight schedule would need to be so infrequent that there was just one flight a week on each leg, and they'd have to misconnect to the extent you had to spend 6 days waiting for the next available flight.

That kind of dispels the notion that this is a pure 'transit only' arrangement, and it must be that it is for the purpose of an extended stay.

FlyingJay Apr 20, 2017 4:47 pm

Good Afternoon Everyone. Thank you all for the expertise, opinions, and even critiques of my itinerary ;)

What made me the most upset is that the AA agent and supervisor spent over 2 hours trying to make a decision. By the time they decided not to let me board, we had no chance of flying out that day. This pushed back my entire planned trip costing me hundreds of dollars in hotel reservation changes, excursion costs, extra parking, and so on and so on (on top of the fare change).

For a major Airline that flies nonstop daily to PVG I was absolutely stunned at the confusion by the staff. If they were going to deny boarding based on policy, then do it immediately. Worst case scenario should have been a re-routing fare that I could take up with AA after the fact.

Ultimately I was booked for the following day on the same exact flight numbers with just a hard stopover in NRT.

AA183
JAL874
AA170

I actually like AA and use them exclusively for all domestic travel. I suspect the complexities are causing the delay in response. I am hopeful AA will make me whole in this situation.

I will keep you posted once I hear something! Thanks Again Flyers

tom911 Apr 20, 2017 5:20 pm


Originally Posted by FlyingJay (Post 28207687)
This pushed back my entire planned trip costing me hundreds of dollars in hotel reservation changes, excursion costs, extra parking, and so on and so on (on top of the fare change).

This brings up a side issue of reimbursement of these costs. If AA won't cover them, do you have travel insurance that may, either with a policy or through the credit card you charged the airfare to? Would you be able to make a claim and be reimbursed due to AA not allowing you to board your original flights? Have you made any inquiries about this?

FlyingJay Apr 20, 2017 5:22 pm


Originally Posted by tom911 (Post 28207830)
This brings up a side issue of reimbursement of these costs. If AA won't cover them, do you have travel insurance that may, either with a policy or through the credit card you charged the airfare to? Would you be able to make a claim and be reimbursed due to AA not allowing you to board your original flights? Have you made any inquiries about this?

I booked everything on my Chase Reserve which has good travel insurance. I was waiting for AA before I do anything else.

MSPeconomist Apr 20, 2017 5:26 pm


Originally Posted by FlyingJay (Post 28207845)
I booked everything on my Chase Reserve which has good travel insurance. I was waiting for AA before I do anything else.

Please report back. My guess is that the travel insurance will either say that it's not covered or say that the AA agents must have been right.

moondog Apr 20, 2017 5:34 pm


Originally Posted by tom911 (Post 28207830)
This brings up a side issue of reimbursement of these costs. If AA won't cover them, do you have travel insurance that may, either with a policy or through the credit card you charged the airfare to? Would you be able to make a claim and be reimbursed due to AA not allowing you to board your original flights? Have you made any inquiries about this?

I think he should push AA (firmly and persistently) to cover those expenses because they wouldn't have been incurred in the absence of AA's incompetence. Don't let them off the hook!


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