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ARCHIVE: MileSAAver / SAAver award reduction discussion post-2015 AAdvantage merger

ARCHIVE: MileSAAver / SAAver award reduction discussion post-2015 AAdvantage merger

Old Jan 3, 2015, 6:43 pm
  #16  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,564
I agree as to the frustrating part, OP. It's particularly tough if you need more than one seat. I just found 2 seats on AB on October 13th from JFK to DUS. Cost per ticket is 50K miles and $5.60. You'd have to try to put it together with a flight from TPA to NYC and one from DUS to PAR, but it gets you across without having to pay BA's fees... I'm sure the seats will be gone soon, or may already be.

(You can add TPA to CLT to JFK for no additional miles...)

Last edited by Ord Liza; Jan 3, 2015 at 6:50 pm Reason: Add flights
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Old Jan 3, 2015, 7:12 pm
  #17  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Originally Posted by JPG3392
Is travelling on award tickets in economy class out of the question?
It most definitely would be for me with 1.4M miles in my bank
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Old Jan 3, 2015, 7:34 pm
  #18  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
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Had some luck starting with jfk to dus and then calling in to add on extra to/from in US and Europe.. Not ideal and not first choice as it involves changing planes 3 times each way and a change of airport as well in NYC, hoping others will open up, but at least know I will get there in business class.$28 and 100,000 miles dfw to vie, and $230 and 100,000 miles muc to dfw , but honestly as I don't sleep much found this stuff in the middle of the night
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 8:04 am
  #19  
 
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Seriously, how many freakin' threads a week do we require for complaining about lack of award inventory?!

Regards
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 8:39 am
  #20  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Originally Posted by scubadu
Seriously, how many freakin' threads a week do we require for complaining about lack of award inventory?!

Regards
IMO, we will see many more. Check OP's posting history which makes it clear where all the AA miles came from. There are many FT members swimming in AA miles due to credit card churning and MS. While other threads blame Saver availability problems on the merger, few highlight the demand created by the MS crowd, and the resulting lack of awards available to those who earn miles mostly by flying.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 8:57 am
  #21  
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Originally Posted by dickinson
IMO, we will see many more. Check OP's posting history which makes it clear where all the AA miles came from. There are many FT members swimming in AA miles due to credit card churning and MS. While other threads blame Saver availability problems on the merger, few highlight the demand created by the MS crowd, and the resulting lack of awards available to those who earn miles mostly by flying.
+1 - This and AA's use of Saver for the originally-intended purpose of awards, e.g., seats which cannot be sold and accordingly are "given away" as a reward to encourage future loyalty.

This thread is yet another example of what is a sucker's game. It doesn't matter whether you earn 100 or 100K miles for a given activity, what matters is what it costs to fly the route you want to fly. But, awards are capacity controlled, so it is a zero-sum game from AA's perspective.

There are people who easily accumulate millions of miles through other than BIS flying and then wonder why they can't get seats for their extended family in premium cabins on highly sought routes.

The reality is that while the US-AA deal expands TATL xPHL, it is not my enough to acommodate the entry of DM members into the combined program. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen. But, if AA sticks to Marketing 101, there will be fewer not more Saver seats as the year progresses.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 12:22 pm
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by dickinson
IMO, we will see many more. Check OP's posting history which makes it clear where all the AA miles came from. There are many FT members swimming in AA miles due to credit card churning and MS. While other threads blame Saver availability problems on the merger, few highlight the demand created by the MS crowd, and the resulting lack of awards available to those who earn miles mostly by flying.
Let's get real here. Though many people earn their miles by BIS, they do not necessarily pay for these tickets themselves as their employer does so. People earning their miles by CC spend do pay for these "miles" out of their own pockets (like spending $10K for the 100K miles from Citi CC offer). $10K would buy a whole lot of tickets - probably enough for EXP status (which the CC people did not get)
In addition, CC churning was much more prevalent a couple of years ago when Citi allowed churning without any restrictions - i.e. one could have the same Citi card over and over again. During this time sAAver awards were plentiful, esp. at T-330.

Last edited by Paulchili; Jan 4, 2015 at 12:28 pm
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 12:29 pm
  #23  
 
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Originally Posted by Paulchili
People earning their miles by CC spend do pay for these "miles" out of their own pockets (like spending $10K for the 100K miles from Citi CC offer). $10K would buy a whole lot of tickets - probably enough for EXP status (which the CC people did not get)
Not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse or actually don't understand how credit cards work.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 12:35 pm
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by Paulchili
Originally Posted by dickinson
IMO, we will see many more. Check OP's posting history which makes it clear where all the AA miles came from. There are many FT members swimming in AA miles due to credit card churning and MS. While other threads blame Saver availability problems on the merger, few highlight the demand created by the MS crowd, and the resulting lack of awards available to those who earn miles mostly by flying.
Let's get real here. Though many people earn their miles by BIS, they do not necessarily pay for these tickets themselves as their employer does so. People earning their miles by CC spend do pay for these "miles" out of their own pockets (like spending $10K for the 100K miles from Citi CC offer). $10K would buy a whole lot of tickets - probably enough for EXP status (which the CC people did not get)
Lets get real here. AA receives probably less than $0.005 per mile selling to Citibank which means AA got $500 at MOST from that credit card... but AA will receive the full $10k RT for that premium seat no matter if customer buys it or their employer.

AA is not the sole reason for the promotion for huge miles for CCs... Citi is more responsible.

The good news is these MSers are greedy and typically only want premium cabins. Id rather take 2-3 trips in Y than 1 in J/F for the same miles.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 12:59 pm
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by imapilotaz
Lets get real here. AA receives probably less than $0.005 per mile selling to Citibank which means AA got $500 at MOST from that credit card... but AA will receive the full $10k RT for that premium seat no matter if customer buys it or their employer.

AA is not the sole reason for the promotion for huge miles for CCs... Citi is more responsible.

The good news is these MSers are greedy and typically only want premium cabins. Id rather take 2-3 trips in Y than 1 in J/F for the same miles.
Also remember most people want awards when its best for them, refuse to be flexible (including date and route) and refuse to pay anytime rates. So of course its AA's fault they are actually making money, demand is high and no need to give away seats for free.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 1:32 pm
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by imapilotaz
Lets get real here. AA receives probably less than $0.005 per mile selling to Citibank which means AA got $500 at MOST from that credit card... but AA will receive the full $10k RT for that premium seat no matter if customer buys it or their employer.
I understand that part but I don't understand the elitist point of view of those BIS customers that do not actually pay for their tickets themselves.
As for what AA gets from Citi, that certainly is not my problem. If AA felt that this was a "bad deal" for them with Citi, they should not have sold those miles to Citi.
It wasn't that long ago that AA was making more profit on selling miles than selling tickets (at least that was claimed here on FT some time ago - pre-BK).

Last edited by Paulchili; Jan 4, 2015 at 1:40 pm
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 1:49 pm
  #27  
 
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Originally Posted by ddistler
So of course its AA's fault they are actually making money, demand is high and no need to give away seats for free.
It would certainly be AA and Citi's fault if they offered inducements to use their service and failed to reasonably deliver on the promise.

Legally there's a line that's very hard to measure because the FF schemes are so opaque but beyond which they're engaging in deception.

Practically, if they make the 'reward' too hard to obtain the word will get around and the value of the inducement will fall. My hunch is we're entering that phase now.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 1:55 pm
  #28  
 
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Originally Posted by Paulchili
As for what AA gets from Citi, that certainly is not my problem. If AA felt that this was a "bad deal" for them with Citi, they should not have sold those miles to Citi.
It's also possible that we're seeing a hangover from the $1billion pre-purchase Citi did that paved the way for AA's dodgy strategic Bankruptcy. It's possible AA regrets some of that deal because of the price being paid today with an FF scheme that's beginning to get discredited in the eyes of the consumer.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 2:21 pm
  #29  
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
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Originally Posted by dickinson
IMO, we will see many more. Check OP's posting history which makes it clear where all the AA miles came from. There are many FT members swimming in AA miles due to credit card churning and MS. While other threads blame Saver availability problems on the merger, few highlight the demand created by the MS crowd, and the resulting lack of awards available to those who earn miles mostly by flying.
Searching through my posts and profile is appetizer. Don't assume my naivety here is indicative of my travel experience or speaks to my chops. Sure I'm new to the card game, but I'm currently Marriott and Starwood Platinum, and was recently a former United 1K and American Platinum.

When I had this status it was much easier to redeem discounted awards. Now? Seems impossible. I guess I could travel domestically, go to South America or Asia, but that's not where my heart strings are pulling me to.
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Old Jan 4, 2015, 2:24 pm
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Paulchili
I understand that part but I don't understand the elitist point of view of those BIS customers that do not actually pay for their tickets themselves.
As for what AA gets from Citi, that certainly is not my problem. If AA felt that this was a "bad deal" for them with Citi, they should not have sold those miles to Citi.
It wasn't that long ago that AA was making more profit on selling miles than selling tickets (at least that was claimed here on FT some time ago - pre-BK).
1. You assume that those paying for tickets with a personal CC are not reimbursed. That is a terrible assumption.

2. AA makes a ton of money by selling miles to Citi. Basically zero overhead and the cash is pure gravy. But, the impact on FF's is clear. There are more miles competing for the same # of awards. That drives the "price" of the awards up and means tougher availability. It is the passenger not AA which suffers, to the extent that this is suffering.
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