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ARCHIVE: AA 737 MAX 8 SSW / 7M8 aircraft in service Nov 2017 (discussion)

Old Jan 24, 2017, 8:58 pm
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All posts regarding AA 737 MAX 8 safety etc. as related to the crashes have been consolidated in one thread: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...37-max-8s.html.

This thread is dedicated to general discussion of the 737 MAX 8. There are other threads to post to:

Recent crashes and effect on AA: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1939333-recent-737-max-crashes-effects-aa-737-max-8s.html

7M8 First / Business cabin and MiQ seats: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1880631-aircraft-guide-aa-boeing-737-max-8-7m8-first-business-seats-etc.html

7M8 Main Cabin and MCE cabins, Meridian seats: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1892121-aircraft-guide-aa-boeing-737-max-8-7m8-meridian-main-cabin-mce-seats-etc.html

7M8 Space overhead bins related: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1951594-max-oasis-big-bins-agents-told-not-proactively-gate-check-bags-jan-2019-a.html

7M8 Spacewall lavatory related: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/american-airlines-aadvantage/1919254-737-max-8-bathrooms-air-carrier-access-act-compliant.html

Moderator
Configuration is F 16, 156 Y (of which 30 are MCE) IFE WiFi streaming, Internet WiFi via ViaSat, 110 VAC Universal plug plus 5 VDC USB low output.

For the Guide / master threads on this aircraft, please see

Guide: AA Boeing 737 MAX 8 / 7M8 First / Business Seats, Etc.

and Guide: AA Boeing 737 MAX 8 / 7M8 Main Cabin, MCE Seats, Etc.

In the order of Boeing 737 aircraft, AA included 100 737 MAX 8 orders with options for 60 more. The first 737 MAX -8 flew at the assembly facility in Renton, WAshington, USA on 29 Jan 2016. Deliveries to AA commenced in late in 2017, with four delivered in 2017. 16 more will be delivered during 2018, 20 during 2019. IATA code B38M; AA code "7M8".

NOTE: ALL 737-800s (and two class A321-32B) will be retrofitted to 737 MAX 8 seating, slimline advanced lavatories, IFE and WiFi standards under Project Oasis over the next three years.
American Airlines Boeing 737 MAX 8 SSW

The 737 MAX 8* is essentially a replacement to the 737-800 with passenger capacity of 172. (Read onward for seat configuration.) Range with Advanced Technology (AT) Split Scimitar Winglets is expected to be 3,515 nmi (6,510 km). (In comparison, the APB Blended Winglets 737-800 has range of 3,115 nmi or 5,765 km fully loaded.) See this page on Gizmodo for more information.

The fourth generation 737 MAX 8 (first flight 2016) includes airframe and wingtip modifications (Boeing Scimitar Advanced Technology Winglets) for enhanced efficiency and will use the larger and more efficient CFM International LEAP-1B engines. This will allegedly allow a 20% improvement in fuel burn over A320 aircraft, a 4% improvement over the A320neo* (new engine option), a 14% fuel burn reduction over the 737NG / 737-823 currently in use and a 37% fuel burn reduction over the 757-200.

(*The slightly longer and longer range A321-200neo will come in 2019.)

Boeing 737-800 Scimitar Split Winglets

The 737 MAX has the Boeing Sky Interior with LED interior lighting based on the Boeing 787 interior, overhead bins and fee-based ViaSat satellite-based Ka band WiFi. Individual seatback seatback video screens are no longer offered; AA has chosen free high quality live streaming music and movies (streamed from an onboard server and generally using the free downloadable GoGo Entertainment app) and high speed ViaSat Ka band Internet are said to be both sufficient and the wave of the future. At seat power is universal plug at 110 VAC plus 5.1 VDC USB; "large" overhead (cases stand on side) bins are provided.

The new 787 MAX aircraft carry 172 passengers: 16 in First, 30 in Main Cabin Extra and 126 in Main Cabin for a total of 172. Main Cabin will feature 30" seat pitch with Rockwell Collins Interior Design "Meridian" slimline seats, which AA states these seats' 30" pitch "feels like" 31" and is a more comfortable seat than previous generations (of slimline seats). The new Spacewall ultra slimline lavatory (29 in F, 24 in Y) are densified, as well.

(AA revised its original plans to provide some rows of 29" pitch seats in the MAX 8 by switching out one MCE row, as of 12 June 2017.) See memo posted by CO777 in post 377.

"An American spokesman said the airline will add 40 Max jets to its fleet by the end of 2019. It has 100 on order." Existing and remaining Boeing 737-800 / 823s (two-class A321 and 32B aircraft will be densified with the new Meridian seats and Spacewall lavatories as well) will be configured to the same seat plan as the 737-MAX 8, going from 160 to 172 total seats.


Link to full article in CNN Money, 3 May 2017.

*Boeing aircraft are changing nomenclature. Like the existing 747-8 and 787-8 and -9, the 737 MAX 8 on order by AA will be the -8, not -800.

HISTORICAL / COMPARISON:

Boeing 737-100 "Fat Albert" entered service with Lufthansa in 1968
MTOW 110,000 lb; Range 1,540 nm; 85 passengers in 2 class config

Boeing 737-400 "Classic" entered service in 1984
MTOW 150,000 lb; Range ~2,100 nm; 147 passengers in 2 class config

Boeing 737-800 "Next Generation" entered service in 1998
MTOW 174,200 lb; Range ~2,935 nm; 150-160-172 passengers in 2 AA class config

Boeing 737 MAX 8 entered service in 2017
MTOW 181,200 lb; Range 3,610 nm; 172 passengers in AA 2 class config

*Click HERE for a list of registration tail numbers of 737 MAX 8 deliveries.

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ARCHIVE: AA 737 MAX 8 SSW / 7M8 aircraft in service Nov 2017 (discussion)

Old Jun 4, 2018, 1:29 pm
  #421  
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Originally Posted by KBMIFlyer
It is 156 coach pax -30 MCE and 126 other (seatguru has it wrong, if that is your source), but your point is still valid
Whew! Yes, I was using the SeatGuru numbers. At 156, 2 coach lavs are inadequate but not crazy. So I guess this is truly a kerfuffle about little. Thanks Gary (as ViewfromtheWing started this whole thing).

FWIW, I remember when the ratio was supposed to be about 50 pax per lav. They need to put a sign up discouraging anything other than basic hygiene in these lavs. If I saw a woman going in there to fix her makeup for 5 minutes, I might lose it (sorry for the sexist comment, but I've never seen a man do that -- but it's probably coming).
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Old Jun 11, 2018, 3:30 pm
  #422  
 
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The Points Guy reports 737MAX on the schedule for LAX-DCA and LAX-MIA (one direction a red eye).

Luckily only one per day.
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Old Jun 11, 2018, 3:36 pm
  #423  
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Originally Posted by beachfan
The Points Guy reports 737MAX on the schedule for LAX-DCA and LAX-MIA (one direction a red eye).

Luckily only one per day.
Another reason to fly DL on LAX-DCA.
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Old Jun 11, 2018, 10:51 pm
  #424  
 
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Originally Posted by AANYC1981
Another reason to fly DL on LAX-DCA.
Absolutely. Especially considering that DL provides complimentary light meals in Y/Y+ on DCA-LAX, and domestic DeltaOne catering in F. AA is just making themselves less competitive in this market by adding the 7M8.

-FlyerBeek
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Old Jun 13, 2018, 11:27 am
  #425  
 
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Related, if the unofficial AA Fleet Site is accurate, the sole reconfigured 738 is flying MIA-LAS & return, another long route. Given that you usually don't see 738s stick to a single route, I'm inclined to believe this is accurate.
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Old Jun 28, 2018, 2:14 pm
  #426  
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I'm booked on this plane one way MIA-LGA coming up.....only doing it to see how bad it really is. I'm in the 2nd exit row so it should be fine. I'm more curious about the streaming entertainment which never seems to work on the other ViaSat planes I have been on.
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Old Jun 28, 2018, 2:31 pm
  #427  
 
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Smile

Originally Posted by AANYC1981
doing it to see how bad it really is
Originally Posted by AANYC1981
I'm in the 2nd exit row so it should be fine
oh come on, don't you want to get the real experience?
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Old Jul 24, 2018, 2:27 pm
  #428  
 
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Finally had the chance to try the plane out on an LGA-MIA in F. As expected it's total crap - the legroom feels as tight as the US A321s and I can no longer sit with one leg crossed without that foot touching seat in front (unlike what is possible with the current setup in F on 738).

Bulkhead pitch in row 1 (fka row 3) looks truly terrible - this was 2 days after a pretty roomy flight in 3A on a 738 from ORD-LGA so I feel like I was able to have a pretty good visual cue. Now this looks like the row to avoid, if it wasn't already.

Cocktail table feels really poorly designed, especially after not being used to sharing with the neighbor. In the past I could fit the nut ramekin and a glass of wine on my individual cocktail table but there is no longer enough space for 2 glasses each for 2 people on the shared space.

And lastly, there's a horrible bar in the lower portion of the backrest that becomes especially noticeable when you recline. Can solve in part by using the blanket as a cushion between the seat and the backrest but it's still pretty bad. Not sure why they had to get rid of the existing F seats since they are pretty comfortable and well thought out.

Wrote in and complained - unfortunately the complaint got lumped in with the 5 hour delay on the return but they did acknowledge I didn't like the seat and I got 15K miles out of both.
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Old Jul 24, 2018, 8:26 pm
  #429  
 
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Originally Posted by daron4000
Finally had the chance to try the plane out on an LGA-MIA in F. As expected it's total crap - the legroom feels as tight as the US A321s and I can no longer sit with one leg crossed without that foot touching seat in front (unlike what is possible with the current setup in F on 738).

Bulkhead pitch in row 1 (fka row 3) looks truly terrible - this was 2 days after a pretty roomy flight in 3A on a 738 from ORD-LGA so I feel like I was able to have a pretty good visual cue. Now this looks like the row to avoid, if it wasn't already.

Cocktail table feels really poorly designed, especially after not being used to sharing with the neighbor. In the past I could fit the nut ramekin and a glass of wine on my individual cocktail table but there is no longer enough space for 2 glasses each for 2 people on the shared space.

And lastly, there's a horrible bar in the lower portion of the backrest that becomes especially noticeable when you recline. Can solve in part by using the blanket as a cushion between the seat and the backrest but it's still pretty bad. Not sure why they had to get rid of the existing F seats since they are pretty comfortable and well thought out.

Wrote in and complained - unfortunately the complaint got lumped in with the 5 hour delay on the return but they did acknowledge I didn't like the seat and I got 15K miles out of both.
Sounds like a major downgrAAde. But, as Doug Parker keeps lecturing, this is what passengers wanted.
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Old Aug 17, 2018, 3:39 pm
  #430  
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Interesting.......

https://news.delta.com/more-screens-...-entertainment

the cheapness at AA abounds.......
econometrics likes this.
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Old Aug 17, 2018, 3:41 pm
  #431  
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I was on my first 7M8 a week ago. Seemed like being on an MD80 sans the really comfy F seats.
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Old Aug 17, 2018, 5:23 pm
  #432  
 
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Originally Posted by daron4000
Finally had the chance to try the plane out on an LGA-MIA in F. As expected it's total crap - the legroom feels as tight as the US A321s and I can no longer sit with one leg crossed without that foot touching seat in front (unlike what is possible with the current setup in F on 738).

........................

And lastly, there's a horrible bar in the lower portion of the backrest that becomes especially noticeable when you recline.........
That explains why they like to use it on a cross country red-eye, and lax-hawaii. The bar in your back special.

Last edited by beachfan; Aug 17, 2018 at 5:38 pm
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Old Aug 17, 2018, 9:46 pm
  #433  
 
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Originally Posted by daron4000
Finally had the chance to try the plane out on an LGA-MIA in F. As expected it's total crap - the legroom feels as tight as the US A321s and I can no longer sit with one leg crossed without that foot touching seat in front (unlike what is possible with the current setup in F on 738).

Bulkhead pitch in row 1 (fka row 3) looks truly terrible - this was 2 days after a pretty roomy flight in 3A on a 738 from ORD-LGA so I feel like I was able to have a pretty good visual cue. Now this looks like the row to avoid, if it wasn't already.

Cocktail table feels really poorly designed, especially after not being used to sharing with the neighbor. In the past I could fit the nut ramekin and a glass of wine on my individual cocktail table but there is no longer enough space for 2 glasses each for 2 people on the shared space.

And lastly, there's a horrible bar in the lower portion of the backrest that becomes especially noticeable when you recline. Can solve in part by using the blanket as a cushion between the seat and the backrest but it's still pretty bad. Not sure why they had to get rid of the existing F seats since they are pretty comfortable and well thought out.

Wrote in and complained - unfortunately the complaint got lumped in with the 5 hour delay on the return but they did acknowledge I didn't like the seat and I got 15K miles out of both.
We need to start a new contest. Who can rack up the most miles without flying on this wretched bird.
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Old Aug 18, 2018, 5:48 am
  #434  
 
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Originally Posted by daron4000
Cocktail table feels really poorly designed, especially after not being used to sharing with the neighbor. In the past I could fit the nut ramekin and a glass of wine on my individual cocktail table but there is no longer enough space for 2 glasses each for 2 people on the shared space.
Did you use the extension for the cocktail table? There is a second piece that pops out by spring release under the first part. My wife and I had no issue having both of our drinks and nuts out.

We flew main cabin on the "Project Oasis" 738 with the new interior, MIA-LAS flight back in June, and in row 1 (yes it is very tight I can confirm) on a LFB upgrade on the return to MIA.

I do agree, and perhaps it was because being over 6' having no space to spread my legs out was a bummer, that the first class seat was disappointing for comfort. I did like the space to keep your tablet in the arm rest, and that the outer armrest drops down for the aisle passenger. Recline was very limited and very little padding.

I really didn't find the main cabin seat to be that bad, better than the MCE flights I have taken this year in the 757, MCE 738 (non-IFE screen ver) and the LUS A321. The tablet holder and usb port right on the backrest in front of you is nice (too bad they didn't install the same system in first, looking down at the tablet flap on the tray table was not as comfortable), and installing the power ports under the seats in front of you so you don't have to fumble around for them under your knees was another improvement. Even on the almost 5 hr flight to Vegas I was quite comfortable in the regular seat, for what it is. I found the steaming entertainment to be seamless, no loading times, kept going off the airplane servers even when the wifi was down.

Miami, despite having an excellent terminal, seems to have a pretty poor selection of American's better planes from what I have flown, a lot of old 737's, regional jets, and LUS planes, at least for going up and around the east coast. Given the choice of an LUS plane or that awful 757 and the Max8, given my experience, I would take the Max every time.
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Old Aug 18, 2018, 9:01 am
  #435  
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Originally Posted by HiAperture
really didn't find the main cabin seat to be that bad, better than the MCE flights I have taken this year in the 757, MCE 738 (non-IFE screen ver) and the LUS A321. The tablet holder and usb port right on the backrest in front of you is nice (too bad they didn't install the same system in first, looking down at the tablet flap on the tray table was not as comfortable), and installing the power ports under the seats in front of you so you don't have to fumble around for them under your knees was another improvement. Even on the almost 5 hr flight to Vegas I was quite comfortable in the regular seat, for what it is. I found the steaming entertainment to be seamless, no loading times, kept going off the airplane servers even when the wifi was down.
So you mean if was a pretty ordinary domestic flight?

Given all the hysterics about this aircraft, I'm curious to fly it just to see for myself. The problem is the aircraft is still rare in the AA fleet, so it will likely be awhile. I have flown several 737s on other airlines with the smaller bathrooms, and found those complaints to be overblown: the inconvenience was equivalent to finding an electric hand dryer instead of paper towels in a public restroom.

BTW, does anyone know why the new aircraft don't have Boeing new "space bins" for carry-on luggage? I've been doing some flying on Alaska this summer and it seems like their entire 737-900 fleet now has them. Once you get used to the slightly odd aesthetics, the space bins are very useful -- at least they are when customers can figure out how to use them!
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