Oct 22, 2016, 12:59 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
"Basic Economy" Fares Delayed, now January 2017
This obsolete thread is now archived and closed. For the current thread, please see American Airlines' Basic Economy Fare Feb 2017 (Master thd)
Basic Economy fares, to have been introduced in the second half of 2016, have been announced as coming January 2017, once the holiday season demand has died down. This is stated in AA's most recent earnings calls. There has been no official announcement of what AA Basic Economy fares will entail, but this is what Delta does:
"Delta introduced fares without seat assignments and with no changes permitted and no elite upgrades to compete against Spirit Airlines — the idea was to offer less, something closer to what Spirit offers, when matching price … and encourage customers to spend more to get more." (Gary Leff - View from the Wing, 22 Oct 2016. Link.)
ARCHIVE: Basic Economy fares now coming Jan 2017 (master thd)
Mar 11, 2016, 9:13 am
#91
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Must be specific to PHX. I've cleared 93% out of SFO so far this year (28 of 30 segments), including a bunch of JFK flights.
Mar 11, 2016, 10:55 am
#92
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My guess is that it will be rolled out in phases. Maybe first with competitive nonstop routes. Then maybe certain city pairs involving connections. And then broadened out more systemwide. I believe DL started offering these fares on select nonstop international routes a few months ago (after initially only offering them domestically).
And the point is that the fare rules on Delta's Basic Economy fares (21 day advance purchase, round trip required, Saturday night stay required) essentially prevent them being available for most business itineraries, so they don't show up in Concur for most business trips. I expect AA's Basic Economy fares to be the same.
We'll see how this changes if/when they're available on international fares; my international business trips typically involve a Saturday night stay (and essentially all my business travel, foreign and domestic, is purchased more than 21 days in advance), whereas I don't typically have a Saturday night stay on domestic trips.
We'll see how this changes if/when they're available on international fares; my international business trips typically involve a Saturday night stay (and essentially all my business travel, foreign and domestic, is purchased more than 21 days in advance), whereas I don't typically have a Saturday night stay on domestic trips.
Mar 11, 2016, 11:11 am
#93
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When benefits are reduced (no upgrade fares, higher mileage requirements 125K??, lower earning rates, fewer SWU's, and higher redemption levels), that makes my incentive to fly AA much less. Why not fly the DL non-stop today and buy the comfort seat since I won't get upgraded? Tomorrow, Virgin or B6 have a decent flight with a reasonable up charge. Next week, OneJet has a non-stop in a five seat private jet.
- Flying a private jet is a complete non starter from my corporate policy standpoint
- B6 and VX don't fly to very many of the places I need to go
- If reduced RDM earnings and increased redemption costs are an issue; spreading one's flying over a bunch of different non-aligned carriers has a very similar end effect on ability to redeem awards
- Domestic upgrades and RDMs are not high on the list of things I value in the hierarchy of program benefits
- And while I need to see the actual markets and polices for this fares to be 100% certain of this, I strongly suspect corporate practices where I work will - even with our lowest Y policy - mean that I won't be buying these fares, and so they aren't going to impact my experience.
My viewpoint of what the FFP offers me is primarily filtered through its relationships to my corporate travel policy and to making the work travel I have to do into a better experience. Sure I could buy a ticket on another carrier, with a more limited network, on my two or three trips a year that are purely personal. Or split my work travel over UA,DL, and AA, and dilute benefits even further than the airlines are already doing. But no matter what: I guarantee AA is more interested in my business for the 20ish work trips I do a year than the few marginal leisure trips I also do.
Mar 11, 2016, 12:36 pm
#95
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For me, it likely means no more upgrades since the company will require lowest fare. A reason to no longer be loyal.
Mar 11, 2016, 1:57 pm
#96
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I don't disagree with you at all. My basic premise is that consumers complain about everything but their actions don't follow their complaints, especially when it comes to anything having to do with purchasing an airline ticket. Complain, complain, complain about everything - seat, fees, lines, waits, etc. but when the purchase decision gets made it's the lowest fare, period. Complain about no legroom but then buy a seat with 28" pitch because it's $20 cheaper... the whole thing strikes me as comical.
Mar 11, 2016, 2:00 pm
#97
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You mean the fee that does not exist for printing your own boarding pass
Mar 11, 2016, 2:26 pm
#98
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So, I expect these fares to come up in Concur, etc. much more often than the DL fare rules.
I think these portals will need to expose more detail (fare class or category), but we shall see.
Rasheed
Mar 11, 2016, 2:33 pm
#99
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Earlier this year I flew on a LAX-BOS r/t itinerary and the fare was $177 a/i and that was awesome. It was a trip I wouldn't have made if it wasn't for that low fare accompanied with the Plat perks I'd have, particularly MCE at booking. Even though I didn't get an u/g I put in for, it was still great to earn the actual mileage flown
Should AA be inclined to offer such a bargain, would this be part of these "basic economy" fares? I simply wouldn't bother booking many trips like this if I didn't earn miles/EQMs or couldn't have my elite benefits. This is particularly true with international itineraries when lounge access, security priority and MCE are more important. If my status means squat on certain fares and if my status only means something on non-competitive fares, I'll just book whatever decent airline has the lowest fare.
Should AA be inclined to offer such a bargain, would this be part of these "basic economy" fares? I simply wouldn't bother booking many trips like this if I didn't earn miles/EQMs or couldn't have my elite benefits. This is particularly true with international itineraries when lounge access, security priority and MCE are more important. If my status means squat on certain fares and if my status only means something on non-competitive fares, I'll just book whatever decent airline has the lowest fare.
Mar 11, 2016, 3:06 pm
#100
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I think that sentiment misses the point.
If, as you say, the Basic Economy fares simply replace the current lowest available fares then passengers will be being asked to pay what they paid before but will be receiving a whole lot less. The net effect isn't too dissimilar to prices going up....you have to pay more to get what you once got for less.
If, as you say, the Basic Economy fares simply replace the current lowest available fares then passengers will be being asked to pay what they paid before but will be receiving a whole lot less. The net effect isn't too dissimilar to prices going up....you have to pay more to get what you once got for less.
Think of this as being the equivalent to a cereal maker charging the same price for a box of cereal, keeping the size of the cereal box the same, but putting less cereal volume in that box.
Last edited by Fanjet; Mar 11, 2016 at 3:16 pm
Mar 11, 2016, 3:08 pm
#101
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I don't disagree with you at all. My basic premise is that consumers complain about everything but their actions don't follow their complaints, especially when it comes to anything having to do with purchasing an airline ticket. Complain, complain, complain about everything - seat, fees, lines, waits, etc. but when the purchase decision gets made it's the lowest fare, period. Complain about no legroom but then buy a seat with 28" pitch because it's $20 cheaper... the whole thing strikes me as comical.
Mar 11, 2016, 3:12 pm
#102
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PHL-SAN 89% price increase
My weekly PHL-SAN round trip cost increases about 80% immediately after this news of a new lower fare bucket coming
I've already booked out into the beginning of June, so I'm not impacted yet ... But I already am seriously looking at other options
I've already booked out into the beginning of June, so I'm not impacted yet ... But I already am seriously looking at other options
Mar 11, 2016, 3:46 pm
#103
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You mean something goes up in price??? I thought actual prices remain constant over time.
Think of this as being the equivalent to a cereal maker charging the same price for a box of cereal, keeping the size of the cereal box the same, but putting less cereal volume in that box.
Think of this as being the equivalent to a cereal maker charging the same price for a box of cereal, keeping the size of the cereal box the same, but putting less cereal volume in that box.
You said:
Firstly, fares are going up because passengers will have to pay more to get the same.
Secondly, the new Basic Fares do not exist in the current pricing matrix so you cannot say that the lowest fares are not going up. The lowest fares that are around right now are going up and they're being replaced by completely new fares that, numerically may be similar, but are actually a very different product indeed.
Thirdly, your rationale would appear to be that, as long as there's a low-fare product to buy, regardless of the product's merits, we should be happy there's a low-fare product to buy. What happens when the low-fare product is terrible?
Mar 11, 2016, 3:52 pm
#104
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Mar 11, 2016, 4:13 pm
#105
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Those paying these fares versus those paying a higher fare will be receiving the same cabin service on board. Baggage fees will be the same depending upon status. The only difference is the inability to select a seat in advance for non-elites. But even now that is becoming harder for a non-elite to do free of charge. Unless they choose a middle seat. But not being able to choose your middle seat at the time of booking versus at the 24-hour window is a deterrent how again? As for no elite upgrades on these fares. Well, free upgrades are only available to a small, select group of passengers anyway. And not always guaranteed. The one main difference is that these fares are completely non-refundable/changeable. But every fare under $200 is basically that in reality.