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Boeing 787-9 (789): Discussion of AA 787-9

Old Apr 5, 2016, 6:48 pm
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Boeing 787-9 (789): Discussion of 787-9 AA as of 6 Oct 2016

22 Boeing 787-9 Dreamliners were ordered in total by American Airlines.

Related threads:


Boeing 787-9 / 789: Best Business (B/E Super Diamond) Seat, Service (master thd)

Boeing 787-9 / 789: Coach, MCE & Premium Economy Seat, Service (master thd)

Retaining the wingspan of the 787-8, the 787-9 is a lengthened and strengthened variant with a 20 feet (6.1 m) longer fuselage and a 54,500 pounds (24,700 kg) higher maximum take-off weight (MTOW), seating 280 passengers in a typical three-class arrangement over a 7,635 nautical miles (8,786 mi; 14,140 km) range. Link to Wikipedia article.
Seating in the 787-9 "out of the box" will comprise
  1. 30 Business class seats

  2. 21 Premium Economy seats

  3. 234 economy seats (207 Main Cabin, 27 Main Cabin Extra)
...we learned that American would be installing the B/E Aerospace Super Diamond seat on their (~half the 772 fleet) 777-200, A350, and 787 aircraft going forward. These are the same types of business class seats as on Air Canada, China Airlines, Qatar Airways, Virgin Australia, etc. (EXCEPT the AA seats will not offer privacy dividers for the Center pair of seats) Link to One Mile at a Time article
B/E Aerospace will provide the Premium Economy seating (possibly a version of their Millennium seat); extendable leg and footrests for bulkhead seats, foot pegs for the rest.

AA will receive an additional 10 787-9s in 2017 and will receive the final 8 in 2018. AA has ordered a total of 22 787-9s to complement its 20 787-8s. These will have the General Electric GEnx-1B engines.

Originally Posted by Longboater
787 Blog

The 787 blog, which is very accurate, has posted additional 787-9 delivery dates. These are the scheduled delivery dates for the ten 787-9 scheduled to arrive in 2017. Its actually going to be a while before these aircraft really start to show up en masse as AA is taking its final three 787-8s in February and March. It won't be until next summer where they'll be plenty of these aircraft flying around the system.

Line Number 560 Delivery Date: 6/6/2017
Line Number 563 Delivery Date: 6/12/2017
Line Number 570 Delivery Date: 7/7/2017
Line Number 587 Delivery Date: 8/16/2017
Line Number 596 Delivery Date: 9/8/2017
Line Number 610 Delivery Date: 10/12/2017
Line Number 626 Delivery Date: 11/22/2017
Line Number 635 Delivery Date: 11/27/2017
Line Number 671 Delivery Date: 2/27/2018
Line Number 682 Delivery Date: 3/26/2018
Line Number 692 Delivery Date: 4/19/2018
Scheduled B789 markets as of 17APR17:

DFW-MAD
DFW-GRU
DFW-CDG
DFW-ICN
ORD-CDG (From JUL-05, Until AUG-03)
LAX-NRT (From AUG-04, Until OCT-27)
LAX-AKL (From OCT-06)
LAX-GRU (From NOV-05)
LAX-SYD (From NOV-06)


Link to Boeing's global 787 tracker.

Updated 17 April 2017 by econometrics
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Boeing 787-9 (789): Discussion of AA 787-9

Old Nov 12, 2015, 12:48 pm
  #31  
 
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Originally Posted by Longboater
The 789 would be a better aircraft for this route, if it had more seats up front. AA's configuration would essentially end any chance of upgrades and J will probably sell out weeks in advance for off peak days and potentially a couple of months on peak days. Even F on DFW-HKG has sold out several weeks in advance on non-peak days. LAX-HKG has the advantage of being almost a thousand miles less than DFW-HKG. Unlike the DFW flight that goes out without cargo and, particularly in the winter, has to either block off seats or bump passengers due to the wind, a flight out of LAX could actually carry some cargo and a pretty hefty load out of HKG.

I confess I'm not too familiar with cargo capabilities v. range for the 77W. I know the range for the 789 isn't all that great with a full load, especially with a dense configuration as AA will roll out. (UA does not carry cargo on their relatively premium 789 on LAX-MEL, which is just under 700 miles longer than LAX-HKG.) While the 789 absolutely has a huge advantage over the 77W with fuel, (UA has been rumoured to be considering returning to LAX-HKG with the 789.), the only aircraft that makes sense if AA pulls the trigger on LAX-HKG is the 77W.
Not to argue with you but have you seen the amount of cargo loaded onto the DFW-HKG flight? To make the statement that it goes 'out without cargo' is not true. I have been on the flight 4 times this year and the number of huge pallets with cargo loaded on this flight is amazing.
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Old Nov 12, 2015, 1:33 pm
  #32  
 
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Originally Posted by itchief
Not to argue with you but have you seen the amount of cargo loaded onto the DFW-HKG flight? To make the statement that it goes 'out without cargo' is not true. I have been on the flight 4 times this year and the number of huge pallets with cargo loaded on this flight is amazing.
Whoops, my mistake. I should have said it was in the winter time that the 77W is greatly weight restricted.
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Old Nov 12, 2015, 6:58 pm
  #33  
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LAX-HKG seems like a very safe bet for a potential route. While the 789 sounds good in economic theory (reduced CASM cost), the cargo demands and demand for premium seats on that route ultimately points to a 77W hauling the mail.

The thing that I feel like most of us pontificators are forgetting is that there is a limited # of 77W's that AA has flying around. With the SYD route, an additional LAX-LHR frequency mentioned upthread, and other moves, there can't be that many 77W's that are unspoken for, no?

Are there routes the 77W is currently running that a 789 would be better suited to perform? South America comes to mind.
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Old Nov 12, 2015, 8:45 pm
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by jtav559
LAX-HKG seems like a very safe bet for a potential route. While the 789 sounds good in economic theory (reduced CASM cost), the cargo demands and demand for premium seats on that route ultimately points to a 77W hauling the mail.

The thing that I feel like most of us pontificators are forgetting is that there is a limited # of 77W's that AA has flying around. With the SYD route, an additional LAX-LHR frequency mentioned upthread, and other moves, there can't be that many 77W's that are unspoken for, no?

Are there routes the 77W is currently running that a 789 would be better suited to perform? South America comes to mind.
There are two 77Ws left to be delivered next year. Only three aircraft are needed to do a hypothetical DFW-HKG-LAX-HKG-DFW. The 77W does thrice daily MIA-GRU. With the current state of the Brazilian economy, I can see the how some of those flights become 77Ds next year. Keep in mind JFK-LHR was thrice daily 77W but by next spring will be once daily 77W and thrice daily 77D. There are rumours that DFW-NRT will become a single daily 77W. Due aircraft utilisation, it's entirely possible AA could start LAX-HKG with the 77W and convert DFW-NRT to one single daily 77W, without changing the current 77W schedule. DFW-AUH appears to be a dead idea.
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Old Apr 9, 2016, 5:19 pm
  #35  
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Any member have any updates?

AFAIK, AA hasn't selected the seat provider for Business class yet, and that the original config was changed to allow for three rows of American's new Premium Economy.
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Old Apr 9, 2016, 8:58 pm
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver
Any member have any updates?

AFAIK, AA hasn't selected the seat provider for Business class yet, and that the original config was changed to allow for three rows of American's new Premium Economy.
JDiver, do you know which routes will have premium economy first and when they will be lauched? Thanks!
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Old Apr 9, 2016, 9:45 pm
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I'd have to imagine we'll be hearing something soon. According to the Dreamliner delivery spreadsheet, the first 787-9 for AA is still due in September. A commenter on Lucky's blog recently stated AA has already selected the new seat and finalised for the seats back in December. The poster said he was surprised it hasn't leaked yet as we've seen with W, LAX-HKG/AKL/SYD. Again, if B/E Aerospace was able to meet the order, the B/E Super Diamond will be the J seat for the 787-9/A350-900 and ~24 777s.
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Old Apr 10, 2016, 6:57 am
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Longboater
... A commenter on Lucky's blog recently stated AA has already selected the new seat and finalised for the seats back in December. The poster said he was surprised it hasn't leaked yet..
Blog commenters are not exactly known as a gold mine of authoritative, no-nonsense info on such things-- sort of the exact opposite.
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Old Apr 10, 2016, 7:13 am
  #39  
 
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Originally Posted by JonNYC
Blog commenters are not exactly known as a gold mine of authoritative, no-nonsense info on such things-- sort of the exact opposite.
Yeah, I'll believe it when I see it.
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Old Apr 10, 2016, 9:02 am
  #40  
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Originally Posted by broland
JDiver, do you know which routes will have premium economy first and when they will be lauched? Thanks!
Nope. There are more informed people, such as Longboater and JonNYC, in this thread already so I'm watching, too.

I am guessing the 789s may have PE "out of the box", and if the 789 launches on time AA probably has made a seat manufacturer selection, agreement and MOU - just not a releasable contract yet? Still some legal maneuvering? I hope the go fairly OEM after the Zodiac "we need a custom seat" debacle.
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Old Apr 10, 2016, 11:37 am
  #41  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver
Any member have any updates?

AFAIK, AA hasn't selected the seat provider for Business class yet, and that the original config was changed to allow for three rows of American's new Premium Economy.
I have no new information - but with delivery scheduled for late September according to the nyc787 blogspot sight, I suspect they've made the decision and have chosen at this point not to make a public pronouncement until closer to delivery date.

If they chose the cirrus or BE super diamond configuration there would likely be an outcry as to why aren't they using these already on the 77D. Given they have about 8-10 more as I understand it to do with the Zodiac seat on the 77D, they are probably waiting until closer to delivery to make this choice public to keep the noise level down on the 77D.

Just a guess...
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Old Apr 10, 2016, 11:41 am
  #42  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver
Nope. There are more informed people, such as Longboater and JonNYC, in this thread already so I'm watching, too.

I am guessing the 789s may have PE "out of the box", and if the 789 launches on time AA probably has made a seat manufacturer selection, agreement and MOU - just not a releasable contract yet? Still some legal maneuvering? I hope the go fairly OEM after the Zodiac "we need a custom seat" debacle.
I re-read the W press release and sounds like W will be factory installed on the 787-9. The tentative 789 configuration was 28J/261Y. W on the 789 is three rows of 2-3-2, so the number of MCE seats will go down unless one row of Y is removed. My guess is that the new 789 configuration will be 28J/21W/234Y with only a few rows of MCE to make room for W. We should hear something soon about the new seat in J as the the first 789 for AA is scheduled to undergo final assembly in just a couple of months.
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Old Jun 17, 2016, 3:37 pm
  #43  
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The first AA 787-9 (line number 466, s/n 40639 parts are arriving and is entering assembly in Charleston, SC; the aircraft is due to be delivered during September, 2016. Three further 787-9s are expected to be delivered to AA in Q4 2016. AA has ordered a total of 22 787-9s to complement its 20 787-9s. These will have the General Electric GEnx-1B engines.
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Old Jun 17, 2016, 4:23 pm
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver
The first AA 787-9 (line number 466, s/n 40639 parts are arriving and is entering assembly in Charleston, SC; the aircraft is due to be delivered during September, 2016. Three further 787-9s are expected to be delivered to AA in Q4 2016. AA has ordered a total of 22 787-9s to complement its 20 787-9s. These will have the General Electric GEnx-1B engines.
And it seems like yesterday the first Dreamliner was delivered to AA. I don't expect the 787-9s to start seeing dedicated routes until at least November as the second and third 787-9 will arrive in October. Your guess is as good as mine as to where they'll start to show up. I'd bet on these aircraft seeing plenty of LAX-Asia flying by this time next year.
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Old Jun 17, 2016, 9:20 pm
  #45  
 
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Slightly OT, but on occasion I drive to CHS for flights as they can have some really good fares. I love driving by the Boeing plant and seeing all the brand spanking new 787s lined up in liveries of various airlines you'd never normally see there. Last week there were 787s ready for delivery to Air Canada, Hainan, Thai, and one unpainted.

Views from the air are awesome as well.
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